1 Breaking news: Ace has been released

2 From what?

3

Bondage?

4 Also, please notice the one royal he met and didn't bow to, Queen Elizabeth. Probably the only of the three that deserved to get one

5 Hearing our political leaders talking about our foreign policy in terms of 'the diplomacy of deference'  almost makes my head explode.

6 "the diplomacy of deference," = WEAKNESS

7 Great. So he's not only a liar, he's also craven.  That's some resume for a President.

8 I draw the conclusion that our dear reader is too stupid to know how stupid he looks.

9 Bow Wow Wow!

10 Obama is black, he's from the pacific and he is AWESOME!

11 Lie about a bow, no problem, lie about a blow, big problem. One letter and your ass is impeached.

12 Darn sock puppet - (shaking hand vigourously)

13 Maybe the fact that stuff like this gets an 'ehhhh....' reaction from the general public is why our politicians are such brazen douche bags.  This bow in itself is trivial, but in a larger picture it highlights a dangerously naive foreign policy.

14  ace is spot-on.

I recall a post WWII anecdote where a young (I think) Dane aide commented to a senior diplomat about how Dennmark was going to be grateful to the US for saving it from Hitler.

The senior diplomat responded - I'm quite certain that Dennmark will be spectacularly ungrateful.

-

because nations pursue national interests.

-

15 Next time he bowes one of his Secret Service agent should kick him in the ass.

16 Ace - are you alright. Many of us were worried because you were absent for so long today. You're like crack for us.

17

Problem is, most things can be spun by the White House and the PTM as "blog issues."

The CBO stating flat out that O's gonna raise taxes? "Blog issue."

O waffling like an Eggo on missiles in Poland and the Czech Repub? "Blog issue."

Holder's various misdeeds? "Blog issues."

ACORN? "Blog issue."

At some point, these "blog issues" need to resonate with the public. So far, the only thing that's made it to the real world are the Special Olympics quip, the Cambridge cops quip, and this KSM terror trial.

Two of which should, more than the things up top, have been relegated to "blog issues."

18 Wicket lives!

19 Hope and unicorns - repeat

20 Downplaying bald assertions of American self-interest, Obama in his speeches has emphasized the pursuit of enlightened shared interests with other nations.

Funny, I seem to recall the last president talking about freedom as a human value that transcended borders.  Of course, that just got him called a neocon asshole.

21 The Precedent had planned to burn an American flag for his introduction to the Chinese thugacracy but this bowing controversy derailed those plans. Instead, The Precedent just settled for throwing his flag pin onto the ground and stamping on it.

Who says The Precedent doesn't learn from his daily mistakes?

On a related note, China has negotiated a deal to buy some more Treasuries if the US gives up defending Taiwan and lets China take it back. The Precedent replied, "Sure. I was going to give you Taiwan free! [whispered: Suckas!]"

22 Next time he bowes one of his Secret Service agent should kick him in the ass.

"Thats from the American people asshole!"

What a lovely thought.

23

A blogger bloging about a blog issue but missing the point because he's too used to the blog perspective.

This post was way too meta for me.

24

The one and only reason this subject gets 'ehhh' from the public is because the media decides that that's what it gets - by not focusing on it. If they wanted to, they would harp on it until people were out in the streets screaming about it. All thru the power of repetition. Just remember all the non events that they harped all over Bush about and the end result was a sinking popularity that would put Hitler to shame. Same with Palin, same with Qauyle. Same with any Republican of note that I can remember. And really, minumnetally stupid things done by Democrats never get mentioned. They always get a  pass. The media are the shepherds and the people are the sheep that go where they tell them to go.

It's a wonder to me sometimes that conservatives have as much support as they do have. With the constant brainwashing doled out by the media we really are an endangered species.

25

The diplomacy of deference?  How about they defer to us or they get a cruise missile sent into their bunkers?

Why are we deferring to kleptocrats and murderers?  They ought to be deferring to us for letting them live.

(I'm thinking of the Chinese and the Saudis -- the Japanese, well they got a pretty square beatdown in 1945 and they are a functioning democracy today, so I have no beef with them.  I sure wouldn't bow to Hirohito's son, though, for fear of what the ghost of Douglas MacArthur might do.)

 

26 He bowes better than he salutes

27 @22 Next time he bowes one of his Secret Service agent should kick him in the ass.

"Thats from the American people asshole!"

What a lovely thought.

Made my day, lovely image of our beloved President face planting in front of some 3rd world dug - THIS is what I want for Christmas!

28 Let's not jump to conclusions. The White House acted stupidly.

29

It's that he's investing far too much time thinking about trivialities, convincing himself that the trivial trumps the substantial, that he invests no time or effort at all in substantive manners.

When you are incapable of understanding substantive matters because your entire career is a series of transparent shams, a gift given to you by others with no effort on your part, you necessarily invest what little attention you are capable of summoning up into meaningless gestures and trivialities.  You don't have any other tricks up your sleeve.  You are Barack Obama, the media President.

30 Well a bow is half way to taking it up....ah never mind

31 Not impressed.

32 I can't see another 3 years of this shit. 

33 It was a back spasm. Nothing to see here, just move along.

34

A man with some grace and dignity and an accompanying understanding of who and what he represents would understand that when he bows, he bows for all the American people. And I personally resent him for bowing for me. My parents and I didn't emigrate to this country so this no account could humble us.

But as I said, it would take a man of grace and dignity and wisdom to see this and those traits are noticeably absent in this poseur.

35 I can't see another 3 years of this shit. Posted by: Jewells at November 17, 2009 04:22 PM (l/N7H) Those sleepie things they give ya in First Class on the plane work well

36 Wicket lives!
Posted by: toby928 at November 17, 2009 04:16 PM (PD1tk)

My actual Ewok fursona is Chief Chirpa.

37

Obama lied. Gibbs lied. White House sources lie. They all denied down the line that they were offering a sycophantic servility -- bowing like an inferior -- to royalty, and they now are forced to admit it was a lie all along.

They lied, yes, but it's a certain kind of lie. They are clueless and have to quickly make excuses whenever they are called out for mistakes. They just blurt out whatever excuse comes to mind.

It's more excuse making than lying. And I'm not trying to defend them at all, just getting at the source of the problem: lots of mistakes and a poor effort at covering them up.

38 "Diplomacy" is merely a polite manner of announcing these carrots and sticks.

America's first Diplomat, Benjamin Franklin,  would be proud of you for that succinct sentence.  (And America's second Diplomat, John Adams would scoff and belittle Ben!)

39

Those sleepie things they give ya in First Class on the plane work well

If only.  Unfortunately we will all be wide awake when the shit really hits.  It's gonna be ugly folks.

40

Gibbs (sometime tomorrow): It was a BACK SPASM.  Whoever said it was a bow, didn't know the president had just engaged in a vigourous game of basketball against the Chinese national team, single handed.  He was victorious, might I add. And resplendid in a shimmering black Nike warm up suit.

41 Diplomacy is the art of saying 'nice doggy' while reaching for the stick.

42 Obama lied. Gibbs lied. White House sources lie.

Of course.  Thats how the WH and Obama deal with the media and the general public.  They are "What will make Obama look good for the next 5 minutes?" type of lies.  Absolutely no basis in reality and all easily provable as lies with the most basic of investigations.

I can't stand people that lie right to your face and then get offended when you don't believe them.

43

Every time he bows to foreign royalty, he's symbolically sticking his ass up in the air and telling the American people to kiss it.  It's just like when he put his middle finger on his nose as a message to Hillary.

He's a nacissistic asshole and someday he'll be brought back down to earth.

44 The burning question I have about this post? Who is agent #024 at the bottom and will whe be at the next moron meet? And, oh yeah, welcome back ace (finally) and nice post.

45
Did the White House beclown itself?

46

The problem is Obama is playing diplomatic checkers while the rest of the world plays chess. His bowing, scrapping, apologizing is viewed as him as a "lets make friends and work together" approahch. The narcassist in him will not allow him to understand that others view him differently. The rest of the world sees it as either 1) he won't make waves, he wants to get along, so we can do what we want, when we want and he'll just, at worst, say something along the lines of "oh, we are so disappointed they did that". In otherwords, you can do what you want without fear of American retribution or 2) America won't be there when we need her, so we better plan on going it alone.

On the foreign policy front, Obama is just trying to make America irrelevant. So long, last remaining superpower.

47 A man with some grace and dignity and an accompanying understanding of who and what he represents would understand that when he bows, he bows for all the American people. And I personally resent him for bowing for me. My parents and I didn't emigrate to this country so this no account could humble us.

Posted by: LGoPs at November 17, 2009 04:23 PM (v/rEn) While The Precedent has nothing even approaching grace or dignity, he does fully understand that he is demeaning America and the American people with his idiocy. To be honest, this bow is a step up from his treasonous world tour spent indicting the US for all manner of wrongdoing and sins (all made up in his twisted, America-hating mind), which gives a sense of how bad the Indonesian imbecile is for the US.

All I can say is that he isn't my President and nothing he does represents or reflects me in any way. In fact, he isn't any sort of President, so far as I'm concerned. He is The Precedent and that's about it.

The Precedent is out to exact revenge on America and the West. He will do everything in his power to demean the office of the Presidency and to make America look like a pathetic nation with a fool at the helm. This is why he doesn't mind being embarrassed by his Copenhagen fiasco, or the countless idiotic mistakes he constantly makes, or his ridiculous errors in protocol and diplomacy, or the unbelieveably stupid and weak way he casts the US in Afghanistan or with Iran. It is not HIS embarrassment he cares about, but the embarrassment of the US on the world stage that he is aiming for. Anything The Precedent can do to lower the stature of our nation, to destroy any trust that Americans might have in our institutions, to denigrate our nation and traditions, is a good day for the Traitor-in-Chief.

This will continue on until either The Precedent is summarily tossed out of office or the US breaks under the constant attack from within our own halls of power. This will not continue to the natural end of his term. That's for sure.

48

butter-baked crumbs of hope

Oh, yeah, baby. A moment on the lips; a lifetime on the hips.

49 He thinks he's being Mr. Cool post-national transcendent global hipster President dude.  "Bush never bowed, so I'll do it!"  But he comes off looking like a clueless gaijin in Japan and a wimp everywhere else.  Going to kindergarten in Indonesia doesn't make him a cosmopolitan citizen of the world. 

His whole administration is based on this kind of Snoopy-style fantasy:  "Here's the cool post-national global President impressing royalty with his elegant bowing," thinks Obama.  "What a clueless gaijin schmuck," thinks the Emperor.

50 a belief that a calm and reasonable style will summon calm and reasonable responses around the world.

>>>> Yeah, how's that working out for you?  Iran is playing you like a not too bright Irish Setter.  Iran pretends to throw the tennis ball of good faith negotiations and you go lumbering after it only to realize that they didn't actually throw the tennis ball.  Then they pretend to throw the tennis ball again and you go lumbering after it again and then . . . . (repeat ad nauseam)

51

 giving America a less belligerent posture abroad.

Bullshit. He went out of his way to insult the UK, our greatest ally, with his inconsiderate, niggardly (yeah, yeah) gifts and his arrogant return of the Churchill bust.

It's simple: Obama alienates our allies and kisses our enemies' asses.

The logical conclusion is that he shares the same ideology and interests as the nations he's deferential toward.

52 The funny thing is, I think Obama did the bow to show off how "international" and "enlightened" he is and not a stupid cowboy like W was. This whole fucking O! presidency is all about how Obama != Bush, but Obama = Savior of America. if we'd all just roll over and take it, like the media wants us too.

53 Oh, there's still a superpower.  It's called China and Obama's bowing in Japan was just a warmup to the kowtow he's going to give the PRC leadership.

54

I think it's worse than this. It looks to me like Obama wants some kind of recognition for knowing that the Japanese bow when they greet each other. I know it sounds juvenile, but I believe there's an audience for it.

A great many lefties are stupid kids.

55 It is beyond belief that his bow was intentional. To the Japanese his bow looked foolish, not deferential.

So it is not a question of him doing one thing intentionally and then lying to the American public, he is stumbling through his job, and then lying about what he did and why in order to cover up incompetence. Same deal with Honduras.

56 I'm the first Perpendicular President!

57
Obama is anti-Western and anti-white man.

58 Okay, so he bowed. But, did you notice the creases in his pants were PERFECT!

59 ... and I should clarify that Japan is not our enemy, but the imperialism that the Japanese emperor represents vis-a-vis the U.S. is certainly an enemy of the recent past.

60

Oh, there's still a superpower.  It's called China and Obama's bowing in Japan was just a warmup to the kowtow he's going to give the PRC leadership.

Already happening. Today, Obama had to sit there and get his lecture from China about his spending. And since their purchase of our debt financed his Stimulus plan, he really didn't have a choice. No discussion about China's human rights records or Taiwan. No, a lecture from the communist about how our government is spending too much.

Of course, in Obama's head, this was just confirmation of what he truly believes, we are not taxed enough and if we just paid more in taxes, good economic times would be here again.

 

61 In between the bows and the deference, is there someone on the global stage who is actually looking out for US interests and pushing our agenda?  Obviously, the President isn't and Hillary appears to just be hitting the feed bag a little hard.

62

He should just drop to his knees when greeting foreign leaders and heads of state and so that all doubt is removed.  Keeping people guessing is not very deferential.

Either that or the White House is making things up on the fly to explain that Obama isn't just clueless about foreign protocol - he is deliberately flaunting protocol.  You see, deliberatly flaunting established diplomatic protocol and forms just demonstrates how special President Obama is.  These rules do not apply to him, just to lesser beings.

In fact, he can show even more deference to other nations by sending dossiers on American national security secrets directly to their heads of state - it isn't proper for an inferior to keeping secrets from his superiors.

63 I'm the first Perpendicular President!

Posted by: Barry at November 17, 2009 04:36 PM (FcR7P)

Now that's some funny, right there. thread winner, brutha!

64 Just one advocate out there for the US?

65 spongeworthy is right
This guy made a life out of pleasing people and it's reflexive. He knows they bow, and figured that was the thing to do. Someone who was better bred or better traveled would have known that you cant just copy what a foreigner does when traveling since you are more likely to insult than impress.

66

Obama is anti-Western and anti-white man.

Posted by: goforitbillbelichik at November 17, 2009 04:37 PM (3owkY)

That's more on point than what I said, actually.

Who was it that called that bow a Karate Kid level knowlege of Asian culture?

That line was golden.

67

Man...I got nothing today! My sock is even drawing a blank.  Need some tits & ass jokes to get me going. How bout some cheerleader pics or chicks in 3 corner hats or a link to an ABBA tune.

 

 

68

I think it's worse than this. It looks to me like Obama wants some kind of recognition for knowing that the Japanese bow when they greet each other. I know it sounds juvenile, but I believe there's an audience for it.

Look. He bowed. He gets Japanese tradition. He is truly an international President. We are so proud. He isn't Bush.

69 Palinfan - I agree.  Although I think I would be more concerned about what the ghost of Bill Halsey would do.

70 In between the bows and the deference, is there someone on the global stage who is actually looking out for US interests and pushing our agenda? Obviously, the President isn't and Hillary appears to just be hitting the feed bag a little hard. Posted by: ed at November 17, 2009 04:40 PM (Urhve) Yeah there is. He is called by many names: doughboy, swabby, grunt, jarhead, GI Joe, etc

71 67

Man...I got nothing today! My sock is even drawing a blank.  Need some tits & ass jokes to get me going. How bout some cheerleader pics or chicks in 3 corner hats or a link to an ABBA tune.

 

 

Posted by: dananjcon at November 17, 2009 04:42 PM (pr+up)

Ask and ye shall receive

72

A blogger bloging about a blog issue but missing the point because he's too used to the blog perspective.

This post was way too meta for me.

To understand the blog, you must become the blog, William. Meditate on the pixels and truly see the blog. It is us all. Valu-Rite on. Valu-Rite off.

73 @ 71. Thanks, now when I head to the strip clubs, I can tell Mrs. Mallamutt I am "going to work out - to increase my life expectancy".

74 Wow Ace: You are writing on fire again   -   time to hit the tip jar (like he'll notice)  again!

75

Yeah, and here's some more tasty B.S.

U.S. is angered by Israel's unwillingness to guarantee its own destruction in accordance with Barry's wishes, while giving the Palestinian "peace partners" a pass on seeking UN support for a declared Palestinian state. http://tinyurl.com/y8w5byz

And more "Smart Diplomacy" in action - Turkey turns Islamist while Barry congratulates himself on his teleprompter virtuosity:

http://tinyurl.com/yzmhsg6

 

 

76

71 thanks!

Looking at breasts is as healthy as going to the gym for 30 minutes daily and prolonged a man's life by five years.

I knew I was on to something! 

77 We have gone from the "cowboy diplomacy" of the G.W. Bush administration to "houseboy diplomacy" of the Obama administration!

78 I don't know.  I waffle between thinking this guy is a clueless dolt or evil incarnate.

79 I get what you are saying here, Ace, and maybe its just because I'm a blog moron, but this bowing shit sort of bothers me.  The guy is supposed to physically embody the American nation as the head of state, and the America I know and love doesn't bow to any nation.

80 I waffle between thinking this guy is a clueless dolt or evil incarnate. Posted by: Jewells at November 17, 2009 04:48 PM (l/N7H) Why can' t he be both?

81 Need some tits & ass jokes to get me going.

Call on me.

82

That's more on point than what I said, actually.

I know.

And I know that you know that Obama has said more kind words about the Chinese, the Venezuelans, the Taliban, etc., than he has about Americans. He does this on purpose. Obama is righting the wrongs, and that means, in his little mind, that it's high-time for the White Man of Western Civilization goes to the end of the line.

Obama is the worst kind of racist: a racist with power. When he won the election he said, "Okay, now it's time to make things right." All these schemes, Stimulus, Cap & Trade, health care reform, are noting more than reparations and a power-grab over everybody's lives.

83

I waffle between thinking this guy is a clueless dolt or evil incarnate.
Posted by: Jewells at November 17, 2009 04:48 PM (l/N7H)

Did someone say "waffle"? Cause I would just like to finish mine.

84 Ace, I think it does make a difference.  This diplomatic stuff may look like trivialities and often times it is, but in this case it's an indication that he will bow to them on substance, not just on style.

85 The approach also invests deep faith in the power of Obama's personal presence—a belief that a calm and reasonable style will summon calm and reasonable responses around the world.

What personal presence? The sweet smell of Kools or something? This is what really gets me about Obama. He truly believes he's Gandhi or something. Obama is completely delusional. I think one of the reason's he put off the meet with the Dali Lama is his fear of looking small in comparison. Obama sees the bow as humbling himself and everyone is supposed to be so impressed by the idea such a truly historic figure would do that. The guy needs some mental help, big time.

86

So it is not a question of him doing one thing intentionally and then lying to the American public, he is stumbling through his job, and then lying about what he did and why in order to cover up incompetence.

That's what I'm sayin'. He acts off the cuff of his head, as my husband likes to say, and then they make up excuses on the fly.

So long as the media goes along with the excuses and doesn't mention that Excuse #2 contradicts #1, they do quite well at fooling many of the people most of the time. And C. Gibson all the time, but that's not important right now.

 

87 All these schemes, Stimulus, Cap & Trade, health care reform, are noting more than reparations and a power-grab over everybody's lives.

Posted by: goforitbillbelichik at November 17, 2009 04:51 PM (3owkY)

It's not even reparations.  It's not like anybody benefits from this, it's all about vindictive punishment.

88
How much longer until the correct diplomatic response to an Obama bow will be the unzipping of the fly?

89

Why can' t he be both?

I'd almost rather think he's a clueless dolt.  That we can probably recover from at least.

90 76

71 thanks!

Looking at breasts is as healthy as going to the gym for 30 minutes daily and prolonged a man's life by five years.

I knew I was on to something! 

Posted by: dananjcon at November 17, 2009 04:46 PM (pr+up)

If you're in my age range, the key point is: "that men aged over 40 should spend at least 10 minutes daily admiring breasts sized "D-cup" or larger."

91 I disagree with the idea that it's just a blog issue too.
I work with a bunch of liberals and all of them don't like it. They don't like the idea of their hero bowing to people.
It has no effect on who he bows to and it pisses off everybody here. So what exactly is the friggin point anyway? Other than to give Obama an opportunity to be humble?

92

if the blog is tingling that means it's working

 

countries don't have friends- they have interests

i think obama is like Clinton in a way- he wanted to be President so he could be President

feeds his ego

c'mon 2010

this must be like (in political terms) what the 101st went thru at Bastogne- surrounded by enemy, but if we can just hold out long enough....

93 did everyone catch the short clips of Obama walking past the Chinese honor guard duded? Yeah maybe he will come home and rethink his position of showing weakness as strength, he looked incredibly weak

94 Would it just be easier if Obama dropped to his knees and gave them a "hummer"?

95

77

You have to think he's losing street cred within his "caucus." The macho, gang- baggin, rapper constituency has gotta be thinkin the Dean of Douchbaggery is a bit of a punk...YO.

Cheney bitched slapped him again:   Dick Cheney told POLITICO that Obama was advertising “weakness.” (sweeet dude)

Or maybe they just don't give a shit after getting their man in the "White House"

96 If you're in my age range, the key point is: "that men aged over 40 should spend at least 10 minutes daily admiring breasts sized "D-cup" or larger." Posted by: conscious, but incoherent at November 17, 2009 04:56 PM (kn+jW) Personally, I'm an "ass man" myself

97 Looking at breasts is as healthy as going to the gym for 30 minutes daily and prolonged a man's life by five years.

So under the new ObambiCare--with all the supposed savings for preventative care--going to a strip club will be covered by our insurance.  Right

98 He could now so low his head touches the ground and he would still get more respect than your hero bush. Spin that wingnuts!

99 Would it just be easier if Obama dropped to his knees and gave them a "hummer"? Posted by: wrg at November 17, 2009 04:58 PM (7t+Ws) We already sold the "Hummer" to a Chinese Company

100

90

LOL...I'm doing it right now!

101 and where did obama get the idea he's so fucken special? he's the 1st president that is younger than me- that makes him a punkass bitch in my book

102

also taking it out of the realm of "blog issue" is that any symbolic act stands for something concrete and real. And Obama isn't just showing the symbolism of deference, weakness, and appeasement; he's actually practicing deference, weakness, and appeasement. His symbolic gesture then is simply confirmation of objective reality.

Is the dead hobo at your feet also reality, Ace? Or is he all dead hobos? Or all-dead all dead hobos?

103
Punishment?

Definitely.

If you don't like the word reparations, we can use atonement, as it is a synonym of reparations.

104 Palinfan - I agree.  Although I think I would be more concerned about what the ghost of Bill Halsey would do.


I'm still pissed off that the Japanese language is spoken in places other than Hell.

105 He could now so low his head touches the ground and he would still get more respect than your hero bush. Spin that wingnuts!

Posted by: Left winger at November 17, 2009 04:59 PM (+2Ggg)

 

 

good afternoon, chicken fucker

106 99
We already sold the "Hummer" to a Chinese Company

Damn..

107 It has real life implications. The president negotiates trade alliances and treaties with world leaders. He's telling them through his body language that he is willing to take the short end of the deal, nay - that America DESERVES the short end of the deal. Somebody send these fucking amateurs a copy of Herb Cohen's book "You Can Negotiate Anything." And all you fucking shysters out there would benefit from a copy, too.

108

Fooock....nj traffic time!

later.

 

109 Policy I'd say the first bow to the Saudi King was a blog matter only. This second one may be as well but it does offer a revealing insight into the man, as the Leftie MSM might say.

Suppose you're about to meet the Saudi King. Even if you're only a ego-centric junior state senator that fell into the PoTUS seat, you would be nervous because you're out of your element. In the US he could just turn on the cool charm that he's relied on for his 40-something years and glide on by. Meeting with foreign heads of state is not his usual forum so he allows his fatal flaw to overcome him; his need to please.

There's something in his psychology that drives him to be liked so badly that he makes an ass out of himself by overextending.

Policy-wise it's easy for him just to pick up the usual pacifistic leftie ideals of jaw-jaw and no war-war. That deference just comes with the party. The psychology on the other hand, is Obama's own personal train-wreck.

110 It looks to me like Obama wants some kind of recognition for knowing that the Japanese bow when they greet each other. I know it sounds juvenile, but I believe there's an audience for it.

A great many lefties are stupid kids.

Posted by: spongeworthy at November 17, 2009 04:35 PM (rplL3)

I probably would have had no problem with it, had he done it properly. The way he did it, while shaking the emperor's hand, was a sign of subservience. That was not a bow of respect or of equals, it was the bow of a servant. He is not enlightened at all, he is ignorant. 

111 I don't know what this guy is. Total idiot or evil wanna be tyrant. I lean towards the second. I only know I haven't feared for my country this much since the Clinton administration.

112 Since it's a blog issue, and this is a blog, can I link to my post about him bowing in China?

The doofus did it again.

113 It's almost as if this country was run by amateurs?

114

#77:

'From cowboy diplomacy to cabinboy diplomacy' has a better ring to it.

115

Of course, in Obama's head, this was just confirmation of what he truly believes, we are not taxed enough and if we just paid more in taxes, good economic times would be here again.

 

That's why, come December, I'm pulling out all my money from anything "Wall Street".  First reason is that the Bush tax cuts end Dec. 31st, and secondly, after a dismal Christmas retail season, many will see the writing on the wall and the stock markets are going to start going down.  Quickly, I think.  Of course, this is just my analysis and I am no financial whiz.  But with unemployment so high and probably going higher, the economy cannot sustain the faux prosperity of the stock market. 

116 I have to disagree with the opinion that this kind of deference is irrelevant.  It has a definite negative effect on how other countries perceive us which in turn effects how future negotiations proceed.  The change in perception may be slight, but it is the start to having these countries think they may have a chance to strong arm us during negotiations. We were never equals and always had the advantage of sitting in the higher chair during negotiations.  Not so much now.

117 “The truth is that he’s building a foundation that’s going to be helpful in terms of creating markets for American exports, helpful in terms of our national security, helpful in terms of the issue of energy and climate change,” the adviser said. “So he’s getting a lot of business done that I think is going to be fruitful as we move forward.”

Absolutely delusional. The permanent campaign is not working at home, Every issue Obama pushes tanks in the polls. So what's the lesson? Take it international.
Obama showed up so the Burmese are going to trade their weapons for a bunch of Chevy volts or something and give them to the people. Lunatics are running the White House.

118 113 It's almost as if this country was run by amateurs?

Posted by: Bosk at November 17, 2009 05:04 PM (pUO5u)

almost?

119

#103:

Atonement is perfect - repent of your sins and atone for them.

120 As I've said, over and over: don't listen to what they say; watch what they do. (And I mean this for all pundits and politicians, regardless of ideological stripe.) We have unfortunately entered an age where language has become unrooted from the world of physical things. It's not so much that we have become used to a permanently abstract way of communicating with each other -- using the text simply as a vehicle for subtext, to use the po-mo term -- but rather that the message itself often remains implicit rather than explicit. In other words, the message is...what you take from it. There's no "there" there. Politicians -- and, increasingly, journalists -- are increasingly using language that transmits no information at all. The only way to device how these people think and feel about issues is to watch them for physical cues; to observe their actions.

Obama speaks as a moderate but governs as a far-left ideologue. He is one of the New Left breed who use speeches as white-noise generators, intended to lull and soothe rather than to impart factual information. He cannot really say what he thinks because he knows his actual ideological and political positions would be unpopular with the vast majority of Americans (even people who voted for him). So he opts instead to speak in vague generalities, knowing that his actions will not be scrutinized as intensely as his words...at least until after the fact.

This is a very old rhetorical device...maybe the oldest. It's not exactly lying (telling deliberate falsehoods) or hypocrisy (saying one thing but doing the opposite); it's more like a magician using misdirection and theatricality to obscure the mechanism of a given trick. The real action takes place while your attention is diverted; the only point of the talking is to draw your attention away from the hidden panel or the trap-door, not to impart any useful information. In fact, if you impart any useful (i.e., factual) information, then you have failed -- the "magic" of the trick is lost if people can see it coming.

The problem is (as we have seen) that this kind of smoke-and-mirrors mindset becomes habitual. The long-term practitioner, over time, loses the ability to speak with clarity. His notions of what words are, and what purpose they serve, are so unanchored in the physical world that a kind of paralysis sets in. Words lose their physical referents. (The semiotic bond is broken, as the po-mo types would say.) This leads to a terrible problem: how can someone reason in the abstract when the mechanism for abstract reasoning no longer functions?

121 94 Would it just be easier if Obama dropped to his knees and gave them a "hummer"?
    He saves those for his visits to George Soros.

122 Obama lied. Gibbs lied. White House sources lie. They all denied down the line that they were offering a sycophantic servility -- bowing like an inferior -- to royalty, and they now are forced to admit it was a lie all along. But it's not like they "lied-lied".

123

Empire of Jeff at November 17, 2009 05:02 PM (xGIqT)

Could not have said it better though I apparently gave it a try.

124 So, according to the Obama View of the Universe, International Relations are like Junior High, where Shelly doesn't like Debbie because she's stuck up and Tammy told Denise that Tyler said she was a hosebag and now Tiffany is on Tammy's side but Angie's mad at Tiffany because she really has a crush on Tyler, and Obama thinks he can bring everybody together by being nice to everybody.

What a fuckin' rube.

125 Obama lied. Gibbs lied. White House sources lie. I prefer to think of it as "massaging the truth".

126 >>>This diplomatic stuff may look like trivialities and often times it is, but in this case it's an indication that he will bow to them on substance, not just on style. I said something like that in my "actually" update, but the thing is, in that case, the problem is STILL the substantive concessions, not the symbolic ones. The symbolic ones are merely confirmatory of the substantive policy of appeasement. Incidentally, Japan is a strong ally, so it's not the case here that Obama is kissing our enemies' asses (not in this case). But I also don't know why the hell Japan needs to be treated differently all of a sudden, either: They're a good ally and remain so. It's not like the Japanese relationship requires fixing. And I guess then that maybe the Queen of England starts wondering -- why no bow for me? Actually I think I'm convincing myself that there is some genuine harm inflicted here. If you bow to some and not to others -- well, as they say, when you do a favor for someone, you create 20 people wondering why they don't deserve the favor. And one ingrate. Why bow to Saudis and Japanese, but not the Queen? Other heads of state will start noticing the departure from long-established protocol and start wondering why they aren't getting deferential, servile breaches of standard protocol.

127 Nice to hear from ya nice deb. Told the morons about the tea party vid you had up this am. And for anyone who hasn't been there, check our her site sometime, like when this one goes for 3 or 4 hours without a post.  On the plus side ace, you usually come back hammerin after one of those value rite breaks.

128 Why bow to Saudis and Japanese, but not the Queen?

Because bowing to Whitey would be offensive.

I wonder if it really is that simple.

129 And another thing.
This is an INDEPENDENT

130

#109:

That is why there is an entire Department of the US government that can provide advice on protocol - the State Department.  I bet they can provide you with a script, with diagrams, to show you exactly what you are supposed to do and when you are to do.  I will also speculate that the US Congress has people who can advise a representative or a senator on the proper protocol.

[This is theater, just like in the photograph of Churchill, Stalin and Roosevelt at Yalta.  All three are seated.  FDR was so ill he could no longer stand, so all three were seated.  This had to be negotiated and set out before the meeting took place.]

What President Obama is doing is mere self-indulgence.

131 oops.
 This is an independent issue. Maybe on the right and left its not a biggie, but to people that dont follow the news too closely and voted for the guy because he seemed reasonable, this is insulting.

132 I had a bit of trouble drumming up a lot of passion about this. My real beef here isn't that what Obama is doing is wrong. My actual beef is that the crap Obama is doing is irrelevant. This never made me angry, either. But it does crack me up. He may be doing this as part of executing his ridiculous foreign policy of trying to become the world's BFF. But he's also showing everyone (despite his supposedly "soaring rhetoric") that he's a Peter Principal doofus who is in way over his head.

133

But I also don't know why the hell Japan needs to be treated differently all of a sudden, either: They're a good ally and remain so. It's not like the Japanese relationship requires fixing.

Neo-neocon has a theory. Remember Obama saying he didn't want to think about victory-victory in Afghanistan?

I’m always worried about using the word ‘victory,’ because, you know, it invokes this notion of Emperor Hirohito coming down and signing a surrender to MacArthur.

Which didn't actually happen, of course.

Neo-neocon:

If I had to guess, knowing what I now know about our President, I’d say that it’s related to what he sees as the humiliation (”coming down”) of a non-white (in this case, an Asian) at the hands of a white American military man who was nothing if not overbearing (in this case, MacArthur), in order to not only surrender but to unconditionally surrender, and then to have his country occupied by the morally despicable US.

Then she ties it to what just occured...

134

Because bowing to Whitey would be offensive.

I wonder if it really is that simple.

 

You may be on to something there.  Hmmmm.  Maybe that's why he didn't go to the Berlin Wall celebration.  Has he bowed to the French president, whatever the fuck his name is? (Sarcozi, Saercosi)

135 And here's the actual link to what Neo-neo wrote.

136 I don't think you would see Sarah curtsy. I'm suprised Obama bowed instead, a curtsy seems like the natural thing for him to do.

137 Why bow to Saudis and Japanese, but not the Queen? I've been asking that question much longer than you, buttercup. When do I get MY respect?

138

Because bowing to Whitey would be offensive.

I wonder if it really is that simple.

That occurred to me as well. I'll bet he won't bow to any European leader. He sure as hell didn't bow to the Pope. I'd like to see him do a tour of Africa and see how many warlords he bows to.

139

Why bow to Saudis and Japanese, but not the Queen?

I think Obama hates England because of its history of African colonialism and his Fathers involvement in Kenyan political landscape. 

I haven't read "Dreams of My Father" but the title alone tells you his is influenced by his fathers world view.

140 You should see Barry when he's drunk and prostrate on Bourbon Street.  On... Bourbon Street.  No one get lower than the man, The Extreme. 

141 Other heads of state will start noticing the departure from long-established protocol Yah! Why won't he sign my yeal book?

142

Other heads of state will start noticing the departure from long-established protocol and start wondering why they aren't getting deferential, servile breaches of standard protocol.

In Japan and in England, he ignored protocol.

There really truly is a State Dept. department in charge of gift giving. He didn't consult them and looked stupid.

He bowed incorrectly in Japan, went against all of our history, and looked stupid.

Barak Obama: Beyond Protocol.

143 This ain't just something bloggers care about. I get a 25% increase in hits every time Poresident Obama bows to someone new: people care and want to know what the heck is going on. That last time it finally had gone away but now he's reminded everyone again. People don't like this, they don't like it a lot.

144 In my country, we drag our arses across the carpet and sniff each others genitalia.

145

Since Obama is so keen on observing other nation's customes I'd like to have him visit the country of my birth. There the custom is for the visitor to bed over and firmly grasp his ankles while the host shoves it up his ass........all while chanting "Drill, baby, Drill!"

At least that's what I think the custom is. Haven't been there in a long, long  time.......

146

Americans should never bow.

I find the entire concept of royalty/nobility revolting.

147

I'd like to see him do a tour of Africa and see how many warlords he bows to.

 

 

He won't bow.  He'll be "dapping" with them for ten minutes.

148 Japanese Emperor whispers:
"pick up your fucking shinebox, dammit"

/priceless

149

@88 : How much longer until the correct diplomatic response to an Obama bow will be the unzipping of the fly?

--------------------

Has he met with Putin yet?

 

150

I haven't read "Dreams of My Father" but the title alone tells you his is influenced by his fathers world view.

A more apt title would be "Creams of my Father".......

151

drenched in drama, topped with butter-baked crumbs of hope

Ace, are you dieting again?

152

He could now so low his head touches the ground and he would still get more respect than your hero bush. Spin that wingnuts!

We shall see. We shall see.

153 They Lie!

154

Posted by: Iamnotanaalcoholic at November 17, 2009 05:33 PM (KGrpW)

I had to Google that. I laughed and flinched at the same time.

155

So my point, then, is that what Obama is doing is perfectly trivial, and to get all outraged about it actually invests his empty and feckless symbolism with a power it doesn't have.

Sorry Ace, I disagree. His gestures carry more of an inpression than you think and are indicative of an ingratiating apologist.

Just as the Stars and Stripes never dip to a foreign flag, no U.S. president should place themselves in a position of lower status when dealing with foreign powers. Obama won’t hesitate to fling arrogance at American citizens who oppose his socialism, but when it comes to foreign governments, he’s more than happy to kowtow. Besides, he’s bowing to the wrong Asians. It’s the Chinese who have us by the economic short and curlies.

So this is what the “world” wanted; a humbled American president. This little fop is embarrassing beyond belief.

156 deference:
respect and esteem due a superior or an elder; also : affected or ingratiating regard for another's wishes.

So this is the diplomacy of the US now?  respecting our superior countries?  ingratiating regard for their wishes?  Great policy.

What about, oh I don't know, say the US citizens? Dumbasses.

157

He won't bow.  He'll be "dapping" with them for ten minutes.

 

 

Because everyone knows that Obama's down for the struggle, don'tchaknow?

158 I don't think I agree with Ace at all. If this isn't a "real" issue then nothing Obama does as a head of state slash diplomat is a real issue. That's a pretty big hunk of his job description to wave away as "blog issue."

Is the DVD set a blog issue? The reset button?

Look, if you step to the Emperor of Japan and bow like a five year-old who knows fuck all about Japanese customs. . .and you're the President of the US? Guess what, that's notable.

159 There really truly is a State Dept. department in charge of gift giving. He didn't consult them and looked stupid.

Posted by: Mama AJ at November 17, 2009 05:32 PM (Be4xl)

Which State department? The one that made one of the most humiliating mistakes in all of international diplomacy with that ridiculous "reset/overcharged" button? And the White House still likes to reference that pathetic gaffe of a gesture of an idiocy as if it actually meant something and as if no one remembers how embarrassing it was for the US to make such a joke of itself to only nation that can actually physically annihilate us.

The Precedent WANTS to embarrass and denigrate and demean the US (and the West, when he can). He is stupid enough to be able to pull it off naturally, and he has stocked his administration with such utter incompetents that the embarrassment for us comes naturally to them, too. They cannot help themselves - not that anyone would be trying, anyway.

Make no mistake about it, everything the Precedent does goes through one test in his pea-brain: "Will this harm the US in some way?" That is the only thing that he really cares about. I just wonder how much more of this most Americans are going to need to see before they put two and two together. It might take a long, long time, though, since no one seems to have cared when the Indonesian imbecile proved that he has the mathematical abilities of stupid 7th grader when he babbled about "profit and earnings ratios" - after which business leaders and economists still act as if the guy has a brain!

I just don't know. The signs could not be more overt and obvious, yet I'm still waiting for someone with a large public voice to say what a total imbecile The Precedent is. He is plain stupid and too many people are still scared to say it - and I include Krauthammer in that; his "baby Jesus" comments really don't get to the real problem and Charles is still beating around the bush in treating The Precedent as someone with any intellect, at all.

160 Here we have the pinnacle of Modernism- "everything is relative, formless, and ultimately meaningless," especially traditional symbolism.  Yet he continues to go abroad and make a show of empty symbolism?

The Greatest Leader in Universal History Ever Ever does not show himself to be subservient to a Divinity (i.e. Japanese Emperor) for empty symbolism.  He knows the meaning behind what he is doing.


Before the election, I dismissed Obama, saying he'd be owned by Congress.  I was wrong- Obama makes himself appear weak and feckless, while those behind the scenes do a lot of dirty work so that he doesn't have to. (Beck has video of an underling saying exactly that).

161 Um, which "adversaries" is he "confronting"?  Maybe Israel?  Fox News?  Great Britain? 

162 Well, we do have one thing to be thankful for:  Putin's a white guy.  Maybe Obama won't bend over for him, at least.

163 He is who we always thought he was.

164

BTW, this "blog issue" was just mentioned on the screen newscrawl for Canada's CTV's version of CNN Headline News network to the effect that "Amcerican conservatives say Obama deep bow to Japanese emperor makes the country look weak." (That they probably ran from AP or Reuters or the like.)

165 I think spongeworthy got it exactly right:

It looks to me like Obama wants some kind of recognition for knowing that the Japanese bow when they greet each other.

Anyhow, it cracks me up that Axelrod claims that Obama is "standing up for human rights".  What exactly does he think those words mean?

166 What circa said at #146...
Fuckin' royalty. Give me a fuckin' break.
I understand the demands of protocol , and simple good manners , I'm a southerner after all ,but we're Americans dammit , surely a nod and a handshake would satisfy everyone except perhaps David ( I love your multi -ethnic package ) Brooks.
If not , they can kiss my rebel d*ck.

167 I still hate that fucktard obama

168

If you learn nothing else in life, son, you need to learn that all Democrats are compulsive and pathological liars.

Their motto is, you can fool all of the people most of the time, and you can fool all of the people all of the time, but you can't afford to fool all of the people only some of the time, not if you want to keep your job and/or your stipend from the government.

169 O shit. You're kidding, Obama lied?

170
"The approach also invests deep faith in the power of Obama's personal presence—a belief that a calm and reasonable style will summon calm and reasonable responses around the world."

Politicians are, as a rule, not shrinking violets. But if Barack Obama really believes that the world can  be moved by his "personal presence", then he is the most arrogant, and most deluded, individual to occupy the White House in my lifetime - and I go back to the Truman Administration.

171 He's a bottom.

172

#159:

The professional State Dept., the part that has advised every ambassador, every diplomat, every government official, since that Department was foramalized.  No matter any personal political affiliations.  This stuff is pure stage, pure theater, and is rote.  For a professional diplomat to give inaccurate advice regarding protocol (something that can be discovered easily) would be, I think, like a professional plumber deliberately making wrong connections - grounds for termination - and darn near unthinkable.

Imagine a State Dept.protocol officer giving bad advice to this Chicago mob, humiliating them.

173 Look. The dude is a con artist. He lies all the freakin' time. When do people wake up and realize this? Do not be surprised when Obama lies. Lying happens when Obama's mouth is moving.

174 Two words. Bowrack Obowma.

175 burberry scarf | CD Keys

176 Like Jackson and Sharpton, Obama is nothing more than a common street hustler. Democrats love street hustlers.

177 #120 Monty - it's more like a magician using misdirection and theatricality to obscure the mechanism of a given trick. The real action takes place while your attention is diverted; the only point of the talking is to draw your attention away from the hidden panel or the trap-door, not to impart any useful information. In fact, if you impart any useful (i.e., factual) information, then you have failed -- the "magic" of the trick is lost if people can see it coming. And remember the other essential rule of this sort of behaviour: you never repeat a trick, because once the novelty of the diversion has been lost, the mark will be more alert and know to look for how the trick is REALLY done. I think that's happened already - nobody listens to Obama's speeches anymore, we already know that there's no 'there' there. Can anyone quote a line from one of his speeches delivered within the last month? Even from the Ft. Hood memorial service? It's just white noise, and we've already learned to filter it out.

178 For a professional diplomat to give inaccurate advice regarding protocol (something that can be discovered easily) would be, I think, like a professional plumber deliberately making wrong connections - grounds for termination - and darn near unthinkable.

So ... who got fired for that 'reset/overcharged' nuclear button fiasco? Something that bad should have taken 20 people in its wake, up to a pretty high level, too.

Imagine a State Dept.protocol officer giving bad advice to this Chicago mob, humiliating them.

Posted by: Mikey NTH at November 17, 2009 08:15 PM (TUWci)

Again, what do you say about the 'reset/overcharged' button? What about the DVDs to Brown? The iPod to the Queen? The Copenhagen fiasco?

It doesn't even matter who made these decisions and worked on them, the point is that The Precedent LOVES to embarrass the US in any way he can. That is one of his main tactics. I don't see why you think he cares in the least bit about "being humiliated". He, and the rest of his administration humiliate themselves almost every day. They love it. The Precedent loves it. He wants the office he holds to be rendered a total joke and to be sucked dry of all respect and dignity that it ever held, and he wants to do this in a way that the office cannot recover. He also tries to get everyone around him to do the same to the offices they hold. He wants to scorch the earth in his wake - to make us pay for his third world shame and humiliation. Yeah .. it's not our fault that he is such an imbecile, but we have to deal with the destructive jealousy that his idiocy and ineptitude give rise to.

I just wish he would learn how to properly use the indefinite article before he takes this nation down the shitter. It's really offensive to have our nation destroyed by someone so stupid that he could never learn to use the word, "an". I mean, that is f*cking pathetic.

179 2 + 2 = TBD

180 ODS strikes deep.

181 Ace added: 'Actually... also taking it out of the realm of "blog issue" is that any symbolic act stands for something concrete and real. And Obama isn't just showing the symbolism of deference, weakness, and appeasement; he's actually practicing deference, weakness, and appeasement. His symbolic gesture then is simply confirmation of objective reality.' Precisely. Which means that these gestures are not irrelevant at all. His actions embolden tyrants, endangering millions, and may end up (G-d forbid) being paid for by the blood of many innocents. The big question is if that is his intention, or his incompetence. Best regards, Peter Warner.

182 ODS strikes deep. It doesn't matter that he's lying to us because it doesn't matter.

183 So it seems while foreign royalty gets deep bows, the American public gets lies and fast-talk about it. --Which is significant in and of itself even on a "merely" symbolic level. It is probably in America's interest to improve relations with the "Islamic" world - all of it. Are secular Albanian Muslims, by and large pro-American as Muslim populations go, impressed by his fealty to a Saudi king? Are the Saudis enthralled by that display - or do they see it as a sign of weakness, a guy who just wants to make friends at the cost of his nation's dignity? I'm reminded - perhaps unfairly - of the infamous photos of Dutch General Karremans reluctantly sharing a drink with General Mladic, reportedly during the events of the Srebrenica massacre. Karremans at least had the mitigating factor that his soldiers were in danger and the Serbs held NATO hostages; a position of physical (if not moral) weakness. The least he might have done was to forgo the toast. What's Obama's excuse? Was Akihito going to kick his ass for offering a paw instead of a bended knee? Ace you are right. In material terms, doesn't matter. And yet it matters a lot.

184 Obama and his team have been lying since before he even started running for President.  The fact that they still lie should not come as a surprise to anyone.  The lack of outrage at their constant lying is simply a reflection of liberalism at it's core.  Liberals have no scruples, principles, or values.  The ends always justify the means because their ultimate goal is to control the world according to their hatred of people.  Their contempt for the individual person is the only thing that drives them.

Lying, to a liberal, is noble.  The poor schmucks they lie to will be better off because they're too stupid to live without being told exactly what to do.  It's good for them. 

Barack Obama does not think like an American.  He was elected to the office of President of The United States but he has no idea what that office represents.  To him, he does not represent the people of The United States.  He seems to think the office he holds should reflect his own view of the world and it's up to him to correct the false assumptions of this nation that he feels has failed its promise.

I honestly believe that Obama has no idea what America stands for.  Like all liberals, he sees the world from a self centered point of view based on who he considers "Evil" and that Evil must be fought at all costs.

To all liberals, true Evil is Christianity.

185 Deference my ass.  What a pack of mindless, craven sissies.  They wouldn't last a week in my industry, and they're meeting with heads of state.  I wish it were otherwise, but nice guys finish last.  "W" set the right tone allowing his natural affinity for people to surface with the U. S. military serving as his backdrop.  Walk softly but carry a big stick.

186

He's a rabbit. He sees the snake and freezes -hopes it will just go away.

187

Last May my daughter graduated from Notre Dame and at her graduation ceremony I was subjected to the lecture The One gave to the most Anti-Abortion Catholics on the planet. If he DID what he said he would do, I'd be a fan of the man. What he lectured us on was "Not demonizing our enemies, but instead focusing on our common goals while agreeing to disagree on our differences". After lecturing us in this manner, he went back to Washington with his Honorary Doctorate where he received his Nobel Peace Prize, and proceeded to continue to be the most PRO-abortion advocate ever to sit in the White House while demonizing Fox News, and anyone who opposes in any form his Health Care initiative, or any other  liberal agenda item while excluding any Republican input from the discussion.

This hypocrit knows no shame and will say anything to look good regardless of his intentions. Period.

188 With Bush people had to throw their shoes at him.  With Obama he freely bends over and kisses them.

189 Oh obambi really is a child, isn 't he? he perhaps should have read a book or two about japanese culture before bowing so much lower then what was appropriate - if at all. if he asked i would have reccomended, "The chrysanathemum and the sword." what bambi and his moronic leftists fail to get is that just because YOU think you are being polite or behaving in "appropriate" manner does not mean that the other guy agrees. when it comes to making mistakes of protocol when dealing with people of other cultures, the worst offense of all is to think that the world really sits around and ponders about YOU. to mr bambi, he thinks it's aaalllllll about him. he doesn't get that when the emporer was standing there trying to figure out how to react to this supplicant bowing and bowing and bowing repeatedly, he was really thinking, "BAHHAAAAA! BAHABAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH!- Stupid americanjin." it's the equivalent of someone from another country, or culture, trying to use out dated american slang or something. it's just embarrassing, and you feel bad for the guy. you just want to say, "dude, it's okay! be yourself!" well, i am sure that the japanese emporer is well versed enough in the ways of snotty american customs to know that we don't share the custom of bowing. obama looked like a fool, and did nothing but make his host uncomfortable. he bowed far too low for someone of the position of president, and he kept bowing, and bowing. a simple nod, or slight incline of the head would have sufficed. what a moron obama is, and how embaressing. he couldn't be polite to the queen of england, yet he goes over  board with the japanese emporer to the point of embarressing his host AND shaming HIMSELF.

i have to ask, is obama naive or just stupid? and at this point, what is the difference?

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อ่านการ์ตูน อ่านวันพีช อ่านรีบอร์น อ่านนารูโตะ อ่านบลีช

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A jacekt bought from north face jackets sale can be worn out for about 5-6 years even you wear it everyday and climb the peak once a week. The northface jackets are designed in support of numerous critical enviromental challenges, just like for example severe freezing weather.

210 ทํานายฝันhttp://za-bata.exteen.com/20111029/entry-1#ixzz1jRPn9awL
Read more:http://za-bata.exteen.com/20111024/entry#ixzz1jRPvowqr อักษรพิเศษ

211 อ่านนารูโตะ Naruto 571 อ่านบลีช Bleach 480 อ่านวันพีช One Piece 654 อ่านรีบอร์น Reborn 369

212 คําคมสอนใจคําคมอกหักคําคมเด็ดๆคําคมคําคมอกหัก

213 เลขเด็ดวันนี้ทํานายฝันคําคมแรงๆคําคม คําคมโดนๆ คําคมกวนๆ คําคมความรักทํานายฝันเลขเด็ด

214 ดูดวงรายวันคําคมความรักทํานายเนื้อคู่คําคมเด็ดๆคําคมโดนใจ

215 อักษรพิเศษกรอบรูปน่ารักสถานะเฟสรูปเค้กวันเกิดราคาทองคําวันนี้