Ace of Spades HQ

September 01, 2008

Scientists Predict: Global Warming Will End Under President Barack Obama
— Ace

On the other hand, it will also end under President John McCain.

It will also end under a Sam Elliott/Powers Boothe Action Cowboy Co-Presidency.

No sunspots seen in an entire month -- the first time that's happened since 1913. Fewer sunspots = lower solar activity = lower earth temperatures.

A 2005 paper predicted sunspot activity would dwindle to nothing... but it was rejected for publication as being "too controversial." So, this is kind of a major thing.

And on top of that, the longer the delay before the next period of high sunspot activity, the more severe the cooling will be. And we've been waiting for the start of a new cycle for a long time.

Doesn't matter. The Black Hole Machine's going to kill us all first. So we're not only going to die, but Al Gore's going to get to keep his fucking Oscar.

This article is kind of funny. When global warming itself is not being directly discussed, or challenged, scientists and science journalists feel freer to kinda-sorta admit: You know, it's pretty much all about the Sun when you get right down to it.*

Shhh. Don't tell anyone. There are... political considerations to weigh when discussing science.

As a commenter said (sorry, forget who):

If only there were some... natural mechanism for explaining the warming and cooling phases of the earth.
This hypothetical mechanism would have to be a massive source of energy, however. Approximately on the scale of our own Sun.

PS, one observatory says they saw one tiny speck of a sunspot in August. So, if you go by their findings, it's merely a 50-year rarity rather than a century rarity.

Thanks to both Arthur and someone.

* Actually, they probably didn't mention global warming to avoid the delicate, politically charged question of whether it would sorta be a good thing to have some man-made warming in a period of severe solar cooling.

Science.

Oh: Last year alone, as sunspot activity continued to dwindle, we lost something like .7 Celsius in global mean temperature -- nearly wiping out all the scary-huge warming we've had over the past century (about 1 degree C). And more cooling seems to be on the way.

Posted by: Ace at 11:28 PM | Comments (81)
Post contains 392 words, total size 3 kb.

1 So, it'll soon be time for a President who knows cold weather.

Posted by: someone at September 01, 2008 11:29 PM (2z2WN)

2 So Abstinance DOES! work!

Posted by: wickedpinto at September 01, 2008 11:41 PM (ul7te)

3 Just remember that a scant 16,000 years ago, Chicago and much of Illinois was under 1000m of ice. So if global cooling goes on for more than a couple years, it would be good thing to have a leader who can handle a snowmachine and hunt caribou.

Posted by: Maetenloch at September 01, 2008 11:43 PM (HIUG4)

4 200 years ago my home town was under water, maetenloch.

Posted by: wickedpinto at September 01, 2008 11:45 PM (ul7te)

Let me correct maetenloch.

200 years ago my hometown wasn't near lake michigan, it WAS lake michigan.

Posted by: wickedpinto at September 01, 2008 11:46 PM (ul7te)

200 years ago my hometown wasn't near lake michigan, it WAS lake michigan.

Heh, I believe real estate agents refer to this as being all lakefront property.

Posted by: Maetenloch at September 01, 2008 11:49 PM (HIUG4)

7 good line

Posted by: wickedpinto at September 01, 2008 11:50 PM (ul7te)

8 "Just remember that a scant 16,000 years ago, Chicago and much of Illinois was under 1000m of ice. So if global cooling goes on for more than a couple years, it would be good thing to have a leader who can handle a snowmachine and hunt caribou."

Obama can ride a bicycle....

Does that count?

Posted by: kal at September 01, 2008 11:51 PM (F+J2I)

9 Has anyone seen that fucking sunscreen commercial that talks about global warming?

This chick gets in some kind of photobooth on the beach that spits out a blue photo that enhances her freckels (UV DAMAGE!!!!), and she's talking about how it's proof of global warming, hence we need [brand name] sunscreen?

Fuck. The Earth is already apparently cooling by some accounts. I wonder how long it will take for scientists to honestly report that global warming was pure BS. Oh wait, I know: as soon as they have the next crisis lined up to bilk us for tax dollar grants. Sadly, a lot of the things we should do if global warming is a threat are things we should do anyway (nuclear power, cleaner energy sources, etc), and if the public associates that stuff with global warming... it could be a problem down the road for environmentalists who made a shitty argument when they had a good one.

Posted by: Shill at September 01, 2008 11:54 PM (8jYMc)

Mother Earth?

this bitch has been doing perfectly well in taking care of herself for 4 1/2 billion years, I think she outranks any pol who doesn't even have a degree in a hard science.

Posted by: wickedpinto at September 01, 2008 11:55 PM (ul7te)

11 Pffffft. Sunspots. Yeah, right. I think the cause of this cooling is clear, and it has nothing to do with sunspots, which, like, totally don't even happen anywhere near the Earth.

No, the Earth is cooling down because celebrities are buying Priuses and fluorescent light bulbs. Duh.

Posted by: Sean M. at September 02, 2008 12:05 AM (e6v7s)

12 And Clearly her offspring rock, I mean, I'm a child of mother earth, and any woman who can deal with that, is borderline fucking ninja!

Posted by: wickedpinto at September 02, 2008 12:06 AM (ul7te)

13 I'll never get back the 7-10 minutes I spent watching Live Earth.

Posted by: Jim Treacher at September 02, 2008 12:10 AM (NV3P1)

14 I spent that time blowing my knows and smelling my sack sweat, so, I count it as time well used, compared to your 7-10 minute nightmare Jim Treacher.

Posted by: wickedpinto at September 02, 2008 12:12 AM (ul7te)

15 knows? nose.

Posted by: wickedpinto at September 02, 2008 12:13 AM (ul7te)

16 You're waaaay off, Ace. Global warming stopped the sunspots from forming. We radiated so much heat that the spots were forced back into the corona only to die cold and alone. It's called cosmic biofeedback. Google it!

Posted by: AnonymousDrivel at September 02, 2008 12:23 AM (sI5Ho)

only to die cold and alone.

Or the wickedpinto paradigm

Posted by: wickedpinto at September 02, 2008 12:26 AM (ul7te)

18 Ya got to love the Karl Rove/Haliburton secret government that is really running earth.
Step 1. Set-up phony front scientists to start the global warming hysteria
Step 2. Get every democratic on board the bus.
Step 3. Use super duper ray gun to turn off sunspots and stop warming to discredit democrats.
Karl Rove, like Dr. Evil only real!

Posted by: liontooth at September 02, 2008 12:33 AM (n3pxb)

19 Ixnay on the oolingkay. I've got a retirement account to fund.

Posted by: Jim Hansen at September 02, 2008 12:38 AM (iIvIk)

20 Why do we do it? Because we're scientists!

Posted by: Cybrludite at September 02, 2008 01:43 AM (kpHqB)

21 Wait. This is a funny thread, but aren't you (plural you) arguing that a sunspot low is masking global warming, and that the phenom actually exists, and will show itself when the sunspots return?

Posted by: FloofyParisParamus at September 02, 2008 01:54 AM (KSF7K)

22 Cool.

Posted by: maverick muse at September 02, 2008 02:06 AM (F1b/5)

*sigh*

Floofy? Climates change, thats what they do, it's happening all throughout the solar system, BECAUSE OF THE SUN! not because I like 1980's luxury car's.

Posted by: wickedpinto at September 02, 2008 02:07 AM (ul7te)

24 Mother Earth outranks any pol who doesn't even have a degree in a hard science.

Posted by: maverick muse at September 02, 2008 02:08 AM (F1b/5)

25
"So if global cooling goes on for more than a couple years, it would be good thing to have a leader who can handle a snowmachine and hunt caribou."

Fuck the caribou: I want to see Sarah tackle a mammoth!

Posted by: Brown Line at September 02, 2008 02:33 AM (OMiLl)

26 wickedpinto, no sigh necessary. Global warming is a sham; I was just pointing out that the sun spot thing leaves room for the idiots to claim that "we must act radically NOW before the sunspots return and the earth fries!"

Posted by: FloofyParisParamus at September 02, 2008 02:37 AM (KSF7K)

27 Floofy, "global warming" exists only in computer models. There is no direct mechanism to get from the scientists' projected increases in CO₂ (not "carbon" for chrissakes) levels to the IPCC's 2.5C projected temperature increase. The models get there by assuming feedbacks that are net positive to amplify the impact of increased CO₂.

Problem is, these feedbacks don't seem to be acting like the models say they should. As a result, while atmospheric CO₂ has been increasing for the last 10 years, global temperatures haven't.

The argument isn't that a sunspot low is masking global warming. It is that this is yet another example of how badly the global warming models are flawed.

Posted by: Andy at September 02, 2008 02:38 AM (iIvIk)

28 Okay Floofy, I been gone for a while, and have forgotten some (not many) of the old time commenters, and am unfamiliar with some of the newer ones, I guess you are one of the newer ones, and I apologize for my lack of research to have been better prepared.

Posted by: wickedpinto at September 02, 2008 02:40 AM (ul7te)

Last year alone, as sunspot activity continued to dwindle, we lost something like .7 Celsius in global mean temperature -- nearly wiping out all the scary-huge warming we've had over the past century (about 1 degree C). And more cooling seems to be on the way.

Crap. I forgot my jacket this morning. The government needs to do something about this cooling. I demand that they require car manufacturers to build less efficient cars that pollute.

Posted by: Steve L. at September 02, 2008 02:44 AM (o0YD+)

30 Andy, I agree; I was just pointing out the opening the sun spot angle offers to the idiots...

Posted by: FloofyParisParamus at September 02, 2008 02:46 AM (KSF7K)

31

But the hockey stick proves everything, proves that it exists!

Posted by: Rev Dr E Buzz at September 02, 2008 02:53 AM (sf4Oe)

32 Now that Global Warming / Climate Change has proven to be total BS, will AlGoreBot PLEASE just go away! Nobody wants your snake oil sir. Also, be aware of the next scam sure to be reported by the MSM. The arctic ice is melting. Problem is, not much we can do about it as it being caused by Al Gore's hot air and undersea volcano's. http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2007/12/071212103004.htm

Posted by: sirsurfalot at September 02, 2008 02:58 AM (Czvjx)

33 Hmmmm.

"It will also end under a Sam Elliott/Powers Boothe Action Cowboy Co-Presidency."

I'm in!

Posted by: memomachine at September 02, 2008 03:03 AM (f4Zt4)

34 Sorry, Floofy. My sarcasm detector's a little sluggish this morning. I blame global warmcooling.

Posted by: Andy at September 02, 2008 03:03 AM (iIvIk)

35 Hmmmm.

One thing that I think is a bit weird is that there aren't any new TV westerns. Next to reality shows a TV western has to be the cheapest type of show to make and definitely has re-run potential that reality shows simply don't have.

Posted by: memomachine at September 02, 2008 03:04 AM (f4Zt4)

36 Global warming and global cooling will be subsumed in the transparently unscientific and ideological, but yet somehow generally accept and loudly touted, "climate change", in which professional scientists will make complicated claims that suggest that any form of climate change that happens now--warmer, cooler, dangerously the same--is a result of the Climate Gods being unhappy with Man's property, especially his SUVs, so he must sacrifice, or the planet will either burn or freeze, depending on the whims of the Climate Gods. Interesting that various companies and notable individuals (especially those who ought to know better) are jumping on the global warming bandwagon as (a) the planet is cooling, and may get much colder, but probably not and (b) the general public is becoming much more skeptical of the so-called climate science that is blaming their cars and lightbulbs for changes in the global climate system. I've thought for a long time the environmental doomsayers resemble bearded street preachers with sandwich boards strapped across their chest, warning that it was the end times. It seems more and more people are with me on that, these days.

Posted by: Kevin S. Willis at September 02, 2008 03:04 AM (NZfvn)

One thing that I think is a bit weird is that there aren't any new TV westerns.

Subtle homo-eroticism has been on the decline since liberace.

Posted by: wickedpinto at September 02, 2008 03:16 AM (ul7te)

38 Hmmmm.

It's actually a combination of things that center around the cyclical nature of the Sun. To this you need to add the precession of the Earth as it wobbles on it's axis and the fact that the Earth's orbit around the Sun isn't a perfect circle.

Frankly it's a bit amazing how many liberals I've encountered who think that the orbit is a perfect circle "because that's how it's depicted in the text books!!".

So you've got a very complex series of cycles within cycles. Where some cycles are at opposite maximum and minimum, they'll cancel out. Where cycles are all at maximum or minimum, then that'll be a serious motherfucker.

What cycles are aligning for the next few decades to the next few centuries, who knows. But it's clear that global warming might be something we'll wish were true because one thing is for certain and that is you can't grow wheat in a snowfield.

Posted by: memomachine at September 02, 2008 03:17 AM (f4Zt4)

39 Hmmmm

"Subtle homo-eroticism has been on the decline since liberace."

I blame Putin.

Seriously. What kind of name is Putin? Sounds like a Russian version of Liberace don't you think? Liberace and Putin, bringing the swinging sounds of homo-eroticism.

Putin. Sounds like someone with a speech impediment trying to speak Spanish.

Posted by: memomachine at September 02, 2008 03:19 AM (f4Zt4)

40 Sunspeck counts after allSun DOES NOT have first spotless calendar month since June 1913
You didn't expect them to admit it .. did you ?

Posted by: Neo at September 02, 2008 03:24 AM (Yozw9)

41 Also, every friggin person who signs that stupid KYOTO Protocol should go to Gitmo. And now an old school classic.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2IlHgbOWj4o
Crank it up and do the Science is settled Dance.

Posted by: sirsurfalot at September 02, 2008 03:24 AM (Czvjx)

42 OT:
http://corner.nationalreview.com/post/?q=N2VjNWU5YjUyM2Y1YWM5N2YwMTBjYmE0NjUzMzFhNzM=

HOGWASH. The price of crude is plummeting because (1) Harry Reid is a dick; (2) Nancy Pelosy is worse than that; and (3) We have a dril drill drill VP candidate.

Posted by: FloofyParisParamus at September 02, 2008 03:37 AM (KSF7K)

43 John Ringo is the prophet of global climate change. Check out his book The Last Centurion.

Global cooling due to decreased sunspot activity.

Posted by: Mark at September 02, 2008 03:44 AM (/5VuW)

Shhh. Don't tell anyone. There are... political considerations to weigh when discussing science.

Bingo.

If you have any doubt, check out this article from 2001. It describes a detailed piece of research by NASA into sun spot activity and the relationship with the last Little Ice Age. It makes a compelling cause and effect relationship between sloar activity on the large, yellow ball in the sky that has been the primary catalyst on earth's climate since time started. It demonstrates how during the last ice age, sun spot activity was almost non-existent and wild, regional temperature swings happened on earth.

Of course, it goes on to say that none of this applies anymore. SUV's and flourescent light bulbs are now causing the glaciers to melt. Why? Who funds NASA? Follow the money.

Posted by: JackStraw at September 02, 2008 04:09 AM (VBon8)

45 You'd think that after the whole Iraq War .. Bush lied meme, that people would be a bit more skeptical of (world) government truths. Afterall it was the consensus of the global intelligence community that Saddam Hussein had WMD (chemical & biological at least), so a consensus on Global Warming goes relatively unchallenged.

Fool me once .. shame on you. Fool me twice .. shame on me.

But remember that it is an imperative that lawmakers do something now, lest the whole Global Warming thing will be "cured" by Nature, leaving them without any chance of claiming credit for ending the warming trend.

Posted by: Neo at September 02, 2008 04:14 AM (Yozw9)

46 "The Black Hole Machine's going to kill us all first. So we're not only going to die, but Al Gore's going to get to keep his fucking Oscar."

Al Gore will clog the black hole, saving the planet.

Posted by: Dusty at September 02, 2008 04:16 AM (Mlw0p)

I alway thought it was pretty funny that they ignored sunspots in the whole global warming religion becuase the one of the first things they teach in chemistry and in physics is to know that the energy entering the system effects the system and that if that energy changes the effects change.

I guess the global warming folks missed that because "they don't really do anything except pass out the sylibis on the first day." Right?

Posted by: Rob B at September 02, 2008 04:20 AM (q32Ly)

48 But remember that it is an imperative that lawmakers do something now, lest the whole Global Warming thing will be "cured" by Nature, leaving them without any chance of claiming credit for ending the warming trend.

The left does not want global warming ended. They need something to scare the ignorant into believing that only they have the solution.

Posted by: Reiver at September 02, 2008 04:22 AM (Yi1Sk)

49 They already turned the LHC on and we're all still here, so I think we can all just hope that the upcoming cold spell will get people to rethink that Oscar for the Gorebot.

Posted by: Aurvant at September 02, 2008 04:38 AM (VvcWe)

50
A Sam Elliott/Powers Boothe Action Cowboy Co-Presidency?!

Awesome!

With Michael Ironside as Secretary of Defense and William Forsythe as Secretary of Kicking Ass.

Posted by: Steve (aka Ed Snate) at September 02, 2008 04:45 AM (Xhr8c)

Mr. Gore? Mr. Gore? The Nobel Prize Committee is on the phone. They want their prize back.

Posted by: klrtz1 at September 02, 2008 05:09 AM (HCNr7)

But remember that it is an imperative that lawmakers do something now, lest the whole Global Warming thing will be "cured" by Nature, leaving them without any chance of claiming credit for ending the warming trend.

I do wonder if McCain knows anything about this...

Posted by: Entropy at September 02, 2008 05:19 AM (m6c4H)

This chair I'm sitting in is about one hundred yards from the bay and about 6 feet above sea level. All this time I've been waiting on someone, anyone, to tell me when the water gets too high so I can get the hell out of here.

But no. Now what am I supposed to do? Get some ice skates?

I wish the geopolitco-commie-nerd-scientists could make up their fucking minds.

Bastids.

Posted by: SlaveDog at September 02, 2008 05:20 AM (H6Jyg)

54 I'm bored.

Posted by: Entropy at September 02, 2008 05:48 AM (m6c4H)

Global cooling of 1-2-4 degrees will be much more devastating than global warming of the same amount.

I would hate to see Algore stoned to death in the public square.

Posted by: FUBAR at September 02, 2008 05:52 AM (HrVHr)

56 So the sunspots/solar activity has been decreasing for the past ten years and now the sun is giving us less heat. However the tempretures over the last ten years have been much higher all time records in fact, does this seem to be a bit strange ? Why have has the past decade been so hot if sun activity is at a record low ? Ace I come back from vacation from the Labrador and find out that you not only don't seem to realize when I am mocking you (my last post) but now do not seem to be able to read a simple graph. The link you post to shows a graph where the solar activity/strength is decreasing yet durring that time we have temps WELL above normal. How did we get the abnormally high temps with less solar power ?

Posted by: John Ryan at September 02, 2008 06:15 AM (TcoRJ)

57 LA LA LA LA CAN'T HEAR YOU NAH NAH NAH

Posted by: Al Gore's accountant at September 02, 2008 07:21 AM (VkNlv)

As a commenter said (sorry, forget who):

Was that Phinn? I remember this comment too, and the name of the poster is escaping me.

Posted by: EC at September 02, 2008 07:25 AM (mAhn3)

59 We're gonna need a lot of energy if the Earth cools. Real energy, too, not fantasy 'alternative' energy (and what happens to solar and wind when the sun stops outputting the energy that drive them?), but real, use-it-now energy from oil and natural gas.

Sounds like Sarah Palin might be the kind of leader we need right now, someone who can get us to open up the stored energy we already have access to.

Posted by: Dick Palmer at September 02, 2008 07:41 AM (MMC8r)

60 Whoops. Sockpuppet.

Posted by: Stinky Esposito at September 02, 2008 07:41 AM (MMC8r)

They already turned the LHC on and we're all still here

That's what the man wants you to think.

Posted by: PR at September 02, 2008 08:10 AM (k7SeR)

62 Noooo! Do you realize how much a Scandi infestation follows cold weather? I predict we will see longboats rowing up the Potomac and the sacking of Washington. Well, maybe that's just wishful thinking. But the iceback toilet people are coming sure as the cold is.

Posted by: otcconan at September 02, 2008 08:23 AM (wWa9U)

63 Bush Lied, Sunspots Died?

Posted by: TXMarko at September 02, 2008 08:30 AM (thqrj)

question: do atmospheric CO2 levels drive global temperature, or does global temperature drive atmospheric CO2 levels?

anyone?..... bueller?

Posted by: shoey at September 02, 2008 08:44 AM (IRh55)

65 How about a little thermonuclear warming, hmm?

Posted by: Mahmoud Ahmadinejad at September 02, 2008 08:59 AM (zAvxs)

66 Here's a handy link to the outer space Solar Observatory. Click on the picture for the giant sized sun and count the (lack of) sun spots for yourself. http://sohowww.nascom.nasa.gov/data/realtime/mdi_igr/512/

Posted by: Arthur at September 02, 2008 09:06 AM (DoIJz)

67 ''It will also end under a Sam Elliott/Powers Boothe Action Cowboy Co-Presidency.'' Don't forget Val Kilmer, the perfect Doc Holliday for the AOSHQ lifestylers: booze, guns, poker, terminal illness. Don't mess with AOS.

Posted by: Mex Headroom at September 02, 2008 04:50 PM (iot9F)

68 But, just so typical that everyone has failed to note that large chunks of Arctic and Antarctic ice sheet continue to break off. Cooling? What planet did you come from? Are you living in some kind of parallel universe or just conveniently ignoring evidence to the contrary? Sunspots are unpredictable at best, melting ice isn't. If there is a "so called" period of cooling, shouldn't the glaciers be freezing instead of melting. It's like saying white is black, and black is white. What you are saying is inconsistent with current scientific evidence and the laws of thermodynamics. Educate yourself and do some research before making it a political issue. If there is any relevance to global warming, it has nothing to do with bipartisanship.

Posted by: Thomas Jones at September 04, 2008 12:26 PM (IpR0w)

69 La, la, la, can't hear you? The wise are quick to counsel and a fool is quick to his own destruction. So explain it to us then, why are temperatures abnormally high and still rising in a period of reduced solar activity? Because CO2 traps solar energy. Look at Venus. It's atmosphere is purely CO2 and it traps so much solar energy that the planet is inhospitable. Proof right in our own solar system, just in case the argument has more of a political bias than a scientific one. Wouldn't it just be great to live on a planet with temperatures of 800 degrees or better, assuming you weren't severely dehydrated at that point. Oh, by the way, just in case you haven't noticed, California wildfires have increased 4 fold since the start of global warming, and just for scientific accuracy, that releases more 4 times more CO2 into the atmosphere than it previously did. Stop being like an Ostrich and pull your head out of the sand.....or arse is more like it.

Posted by: Thomas Jones at September 04, 2008 12:39 PM (IpR0w)

70 Gee, lets check out Venus and see if that's cooling off too.

Posted by: Thomas Jones at September 04, 2008 12:42 PM (IpR0w)

71 And of course politicians are going to make money off of energy, no matter what party. Republican or Democrats, it makes no difference. McCain=Oil or Al Gore=Alternative Energy. So, don't kid yourself because, either way, taxpayers are going to have to pay for infrastructure improvement programs no matter which side of the energy equation you slice it. Actually, we pay $1 billion a year importing foreign sources of energy, much more expensive than the proposed solar and wind project that is only going to cost $3 billion over the next ten years. That's a projected cost of $1 million a year. Tell me how that is cheaper than the billions of dollars we import in energy every year? Not only do you not make any scientific sense, you make no economic sense either. Okay then, help us waste our money. When the country goes broke, don't blame us.

Posted by: Thomas Jones at September 04, 2008 01:00 PM (IpR0w)

72 The economics of gradiosity versus the econcomics of efficiency.

Posted by: Thomas Jones at September 04, 2008 01:05 PM (IpR0w)

73 75 The economics of grandiosity versus the econcomics of efficiency.

Posted by: Thomas Jones at September 04, 2008 01:05 PM (IpR0w)

74 Sorry, made a type....meant to say $3 million a year

And of course politicians are going to make money off of energy, no matter what party. Republican or Democrats, it makes no difference. McCain=Oil or Al Gore=Alternative Energy. So, don't kid yourself because, either way, taxpayers are going to have to pay for infrastructure improvement programs no matter which side of the energy equation you slice it. Actually, we pay $1 billion a year importing foreign sources of energy, much more expensive than the proposed solar and wind project that is only going to cost $3 billion over the next ten years. That's a projected cost of $3 million a year. Tell me how that is cheaper than the billions of dollars we import in energy every year? Not only do you not make any scientific sense, you make no economic sense either. Okay then, help us waste our money. When the country goes broke, don't blame us.

Posted by: Thomas Jones at September 04, 2008 01:21 PM (IpR0w)

75 nike air jordan

Posted by: ee at May 11, 2009 11:44 PM (LN6Aa)

no one can end global warming!

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Posted by: ee at May 12, 2009 06:00 PM (LN6Aa)

every one should be able to swim!

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Posted by: ee at May 12, 2009 06:03 PM (LN6Aa)

The economics of grandiosity versus the econcomics of efficiency

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Posted by: ee at May 12, 2009 06:06 PM (LN6Aa)