1

The media dismissed the Wright controversy as soon as Obama spoke. I don't expect they will use this much. Racism and bigotry are ok as long as they are practiced by a socialist.

However I just got done watching Obama bowling. He was in Altoona Pa. Very near my hometown, Tyrone. I witnessed something I didn't know about the man. Yes, yes he can't bowl, I expected that. He bowls with his left hand. Obama is left handed. No offense to any southpaw out there but I have not met any leftie who is not just a little bit crazy.

2 the anti gay stuff only works for the dem primary, which is already too late to bring up, at best it may convince some dems to stay home, but its not going to convince any dems to vote repub so the anti gay stuff won't hurt him that much.  As for the race stuff the repubs wont bring that up unless since the left has already spent decades painting the repubs as rascists, that subjects going to be taboo.

Hillary would be easier cause shes the establishment, hes untouchable and if u attempt to touch him and u have an R next to ur name ur a rascist

3 A McCain presidency is looking all the more likely now. I approach that with mixed emotions. It's better than either alternative, to be sure, but not ideal. Such is life.

4 He isn't really left-handed. He just uses his left hand to show his solidarity with the socialists. and because sharia law says something about balls and not to touch them with your right hand, but you'll have to ask an islamic expert about the details.

5 He did some bowling recently and scored a 37.  Impressive!

6 The vid's not showing up for me but, "We don't have slave masters. We got mayors. But they still the same white people who are presiding over systems where black people are not able, or to be educated." He hasn't been to Detroit I take it?

7 The hits just keep on coming with this asshole.

8  Topsecretk9, I edited to add the link to Youtube, so you might be able to view it there.

9 As soon as the Dem convention is over, and if Obama survives the super delegate fiasco that we're hoping to see play out -- he'll pull a page from the Clinton play book and stick a finger into the wind to see how he should "feel" about this. 

He won't lose more than just the smallest amount of the black vote in the general if he distances himself from radicals such as this.  He won't feel the slightest twinge of guilt in turning his back on them to assuage middle America.  There will be a New Obama, with New Hope.  He'll win more of the moderate Dem vote that for whatever reason seems to like McCain than he'll lose by making a couple of statements that condemn the same base that he's pulled money and votes from in his very short public career.

It's all for the Greater Good.   Which is why he shouldn't win, and also why he won't.  The only way McCain can lose this is to run a G.H.W. Bush style campaign.

Unfortunately, McCain is already setting that tone.  Hopefully, and I'm no huge fan of the guy, he'll make sure that he injects himself into the "message" and doesn't let himself get over handled.

10 Incidentally, is Meeks and Cynthia McKinney related and I missed the memo?

11

So, if we put politicians in the place of BSG, who would we get?

Bill Clinton = Baltar

Obama = Zarek

McCain? = Adama

I was going to go with Roslin and Hildog, but Roslin never cried like a pussy to get people to like her. On the other hand, both are equally likely to steal an election.

12 Not even going to try to answer that, but I'm watching BSG on SciFi right now, you goof.  Or is that why you thought of this?

13 Gab Thanks - I was able to view it once I hit the comment hyperlink...and view and comment I did - I transcribed the TV interview but it seemed to hit the internet blackhole....that interview is a head shaker.

14 Or, heh, Bill Clinton wishes he was Colonel Tigh before he finds out he's a cylon.

15   The only way McCain can lose this is to run a G.H.W. Bush style campaign.
Posted by: mesablue at April 01, 2008 02:35 AM (5yNaE)

mccain will lose if he doesnt pander to his base, this election will be won by the candidate who can reconcile with their base the best, both can perhaps be seen as centrists (well mccain can, and hell obama makes u feel good, which is what most centrists are looking for) so the candidate who can actually motivate the base to vote instead of jerkin off to reruns of baywatch will win

16

heh mesa,

Yeah, this episode about the Saggitarons was one of the better fillers.

And I don't think Clinton wishes he was Tigh as much as met Tigh's wife.

17 Given the flaws in the top Democrats' campaigns, and how out of sync they are with the public on immigration, a Republican should be able to beat all three of them.

18 this election will be won by the candidate who can reconcile with their base the best

True, but McCain's base is still reconciling with itself.  He doesn't have to pander so much as shore up a shaky foundation. It's not an army of true believers.  This election is going to poll with the wind -- I hate that.

And I don't think Clinton wishes he was Tigh as much as met Tigh's wife.

Well that and that a certain something that I won't mention happens right before they leave New Caprica that grants him certain, ahem, freedom.

19
True, but McCain's base is still reconciling with itself.  He doesn't have to pander so much as shore up a shaky foundation. It's not an army of true believers.
Posted by: mesablue at April 01, 2008 02:58 AM (5yNaE)

i agree, as much as i hate to admit it i will probably vote for him if he makes the smallest concessions or at least has a conservative vp (as bad as it sounds considering how old he is and the fact he may kick the bucket in office will work in his favor for the conservatives if he has a vp that is conservative)

20 I think it's ace's police filters maybe --- here is the interview transcribed using asterisks "..ah the word N***** is not in the african american community, a bad word, and it's a term of endearment and I don't see it as derogatory or defense- or offensive" Q - That is insult.You weren't using it as a term of endearment? "and ah nobody would be offended by it except for an individual it applies too" There is a strange, strange logic happening here - if you are called a N**** it's a compliment unless your are a mysterious person that innately knows you should take offense? Whatever.

21 OT: I stuck this at the end of the beta male slap fest, but it has so much Ace O' Spadey goodness that it needs to see the light of day in a newer thread -- so, indulge me:

 A true alpha male celebrating Earth Hour:

7:59 - Turned on every light in house, including both TVs, which are both in the living room. The 32-inch and 19-inch sets are tuned to CBS and FOX, respectively. The PlayStation 2, despite not being used, is also turned on, but with no game in the system.

8:02 - Answered the door from disgruntled next-door neighbor complaining about “light pollution” and how I’m not “doing [my] part.” Gives a confused look when I scold him for lack of butane conservation after he lights up a cigarette.

8:06 - Order two large pizzas from Papa John’s, Pizza Hut, and Domino’s. Tell each person taking my order that I will tip generously if the pizza arrives before 9, but insist that if the pies arrive right at 9 or later, I will not pay.

8:09 - Wife calls and tells me she’s running late from work. I remember that I have a wife. I leave the cell phone on the table.

8:12 - Throw one sock in washing machine. Set wash cycle for a full load with hot water. Without soap.

8:17 - Pull out electric guitar and amp from closet and set up on front porch. Attempt to spraypaint PUNTER-PALOOZA in the front yard grass, but realize too late that I’ve made my letters too big.

Complete with flame throwing goodness and much more at the link above.

22 I'm also beginning to wonder why we feared this guy so much. His base is quickly shrinking to hopeful blacks and extremely clueless college-age whites. How many more "Greatest Speeches in the History of the Spoken Word" can he come up with?

23
Obama is only in the running because of MSM cover, and Hilldog is only in the running because of MSM cover, and McCain only won out because of MSM cover.

Wait a second, I think there may be a pattern there...

24 Mesa Never been a McCain lover, but I'm a convert only in that I will NOT vote to screw our boys and girls making the ultimate sacrifice. Em-FA-Sis on the "sacrifice" - me and you too! sacrifice your vote to protect those making the ultimate sacrifice.

25 Heh heh, fire.

26 Yeah topsecret, kinda sucks.

It was fun voting for W last time just to increase the pain and suffering of the BDS'ers.

I do have faith in McCain that he won't screw our troops. That's more than enough for me to tip the scales. But, considering how our primary season started -- how the hell did we end up at this point?

A whole lot of people screwed up big.

More than a little disheartening.

27 Seriously, I think about this vote in terms of the people that made ultimate pledge to defend my freedom and my comfort. I will not desert them or their sacrifice. I WILL NOT! McCain is the ONLY candidate that has pledged to support them and their sacrifice. I will live with all the other stupid potential policy FUBARs I see in a McCain presidency because I think or serving military deserve more from us, they deserve everything we can give them and I'll take the price of eggs and gas over their SACRIFICE - can we say it all together?

28 The worst part is, I used to like McCain.  Ten years ago when I was a, gag -- moderate.

I was a Republican in Chicago which is rare enough, so cut me a little slack.  Big city politics are not translatable to the standard scale. 

A lot has happened since then and more than anything, I got back to my basics when it comes to how I feel politically.  Very conservative on federal and state, libertarian locally, so that puts me at odds with with basic Republican mantra, but makes me more conservative than the general public.  Also makes me wonder what the heck I ever liked about McCain, to get back on topic.

29 As Rush puts it, at least we'll get a conservative with McCain about 55% of the time. As opposed to 99.9% liberal with Hillary or Obama. Can't argue that and can't buy in with the "I'll never vote for McCain" crowd.

I have hope that McCain will surprise us. The "office" of the President does strange things to those who hold it -- Clinton turned into a shameless panderer after being somewhat of a moderate idealogue. I think McCain is a service before self kind of guy and will mold himself to the needs of the office -- which will force him to be more conservative than he could be in the Senate.  Completely different day to day concerns.  Statesmanship and goofy moderate brinkmanship  will have to give way to the necessity of running the country.

Or, not.  We'll see.

30 But, considering how our primary season started -- how the hell did we end up at this point? Lazy liberal "reporters" liked the Joe Wilson mythology versus actually reporting? The dem candidates bet exploiting a war they used to be in favor (not Obama - but believe me, he will be soon) with one campaign tactics, now they are fighting their way out of the defeatist hole. "Bush Lied" works as a tactic when you aren't in power. And OH the balancing act now? Both = of them avoid Iraq so desperately, it's hilarious. That's what you get when you LIE and deceit your people about a war. Mostly Democrats bought their anti war goods - both candidates know how different they will be if elected president. It's all about SUCKERS.

31 As Rush puts it, at least we'll get a conservative with McCain about 55% of the time. As opposed to 99.9% liberal with Hillary or Obama. Can't argue that and can't buy in with the "I'll never vote for McCain" crowd.

Everyone understands and acknowledges this, including the "I'll never vote for McCain" crowd.  What you're not stating is that Hillary or Obama will at least meet unified Republican opposition in pretty much everything they want to do.  McCain won't.  Everything liberal that McCain wants, McCain will get without even having to spend political capital on it.  The -exact same- liberal legislation proposed by Hillary or Obama that will send Republican Congressmen to the battlements will get cheers and yessirs from those same congressmen when McCain proposes it - the -exact- same liberal legislation.  That's why you'll hear people say that a McCain presidency could be worse than a Hillary/Obama one.  Not solely because of the president themselves, but because of what they'll deal with in Congress.

Qwinn

32 I if i said Su*****Normally, I think I wouda been flagged.

33 Hey, this description below sounds kinda like a Jerry Falwell / Pat Robertson church. I will love to the spin how Meeks doesn't affect Obama, but evengelicals contaminate Republicans. Meeks sends kids to 'hell' Christian fright house depicts abortion, gays October 31, 2006 Recommend BY CATHLEEN FALSANI Religion Reporter This Halloween, Chicago's Salem Baptist Church wants teenagers to go straight to "hell." Admission is $7 and passengers arrive at its gates on a yellow school bus. Salem's "Nights of Terror" promises to "scare the hell out of teens" by guiding them on a half-hour tour through Hades -- ... In one scene, a girl was lying on a gurney where a masked man in surgical scrubs pretended to perform an abortion. A toilet was sitting nearby apparently to collect the aborted fetus. 'I thought it was very scary' A fenced-in cell housed a few denizens of "hell," including a pedophile trolling the Internet for a young victim, a meditating Buddhist, and two mincing young men wearing body glitter who were supposed to be homosexuals. ... Comer knows some of the parts of Salem's "hell" will be controversial but says he and Salem's senior pastor, the Rev. James Meeks, who could not be reached for comment, are confident they can back up their vision of hell with Scripture.

34 A lot of people in my office who wouldn't shut up about Obama are now suddenly talking about diverse topics like NCAA, Apple's new thin laptop, Paris Hilton etc.
I see a sudden chill in the air. One guy softly muttered, "I can't believe I voted for this guy (in primary)". Obama is fast losing support of 'Typical white people'.

Any similar anecdotes from anyone?

35
A whole lot of people screwed up big.

I blame Iowa.

36 Obama is left handed. No offense to any southpaw out there but I have not met any leftie who is not just a little bit crazy.

Aren't McCain, Bush 41, Bill Clinton, and Reagan, to name a few, left-handed?  Perot and McCain support your theory, though.

37 In response to your question about selling sermons, Ace, it's been common in several Evangelical congregations I've attended.  Sometimes they're arranged in lecture series which you can buy as a set, such as "Going Through the Gospel of Luke," "How Jesus Talked About Money," "Godly Relationships Today," and so on. 

These aren't the basic homilies that those of us from more liturgical backgrounds are used to which run about twenty minutes; they tend to run at least 45 minutes and I remember one sermon in particular at an urban church I visited once which lasted three hours.  They often include an outline and a page for taking notes in the bulletin, and the sermons themselves are sometimes even at the academic level of a college (which isn't surprising when a lot of the those holding the "teaching pastor" position tend to have degrees, even advanced degrees, in religion and/or theology).

The thing is, most of the time these sermons don't say anything more controversial than "Don't have sex until you're married," "Homosexuality is wrong," or "Get your friends saved."  The worst I ever heard was one minister making some kind of a weak joke about the Baptists.

38 Besides Nurse Bloomberg, is there another white mayor of a major city?  Seriously, a combination of white flight and white guild seems to have ensured that the cities are all run by extreme-left black mayors.

39 Alice Walker's schtick, "it's about race/it's not about race," is worse off than Evelyn Mulwray, "she's my daughter/she's my sister".

40 *giggling*

Best Democrat primary ever!

Also, pet peeve:  using "evangelical" to mean anything other than "of or related to evangelizing."  If you mean "Southern Baptist," then say that.  If you mean "fundamentalist" or "Biblical literalist," then say that.  And if you mean "Protestant" or "non-Catholic," then say that.  Please don't use a term that has a clearly defined meaning that doesn't match with what you're saying.  It's extremely confusing. 

I never know what group people are talking about when they say "evangelical."  All I know is that they don't actually mean evangelists.

41  " And still people think that Clinton will be easier to beat in the general. What are you guys smoking?"

What concerns me is that the MSM is even more shameless this time around.  They are Obama's personal spin doctors.

42 Re: white mayors Daley, Jr., in Chi-town

43 "the anti gay stuff only works for the dem primary, which is already too late to bring up, at best it may convince some dems to stay home, but its not going to convince any dems to vote repub so the anti gay stuff won't hurt him that much. " I don't know how many gay people you know, but I know plenty, and black homophobia disturbs them a lot. They speak softly about it, but I suspect it will be a bigger deal than you might suspect and throw them back to Hillary.

44

El Rushbo noted yesterday that nObama's camp couldn't care less about his LIES, though they are outraged when confronted with his lack of a accomplishments.

Black politicians have an immunity to lies. Lies only matter when convenient; i.e., when white women tell them. Ask Alice Walker about her loyal but "white made the difference between them" college girl friends and those gender free bottles thrown by white women at her.

There were things that ladies did not do. Throwing in public was not lady-like. It didn't matter what was being thrown or what the target was. Ladies couldn't throw worth sh*t, anyway. That takes practice. Ladies WOULD gossip and shun the unwanted. Alice Walker, like her target Hillary, re-invents the past according to her whim with self fabricated memories consisting of contemporary opportunities projected into the past where they did not exist, even for white women.

Meanwhile, as ever, the parties lead their voters with carrots.

 

45 Re: Obama in the general and smoking.

It's easy.  If it's Hillary the MSM will just do their usual muddle.  If it's Obama any critic of his will be immediately and loudly denounced as racist.  After decades of the only thing the public schools teach being "racism is bad" that will be sufficient to sink any GOP candidate, let alone one who looks like a walking mummy.

46

The MSM's wet dream is to elect an angry black man to validate their hatred of  "racist" fly -.over America ( see, we were right you stupid yokels).

It validates their world view while screwing the people they secretly would love to shove into railcars- they will do anything to elect him.

47

Assuming either of these marxist/socialist/racist assclowns will be EASY to beat in the general assumes at least 2 important things:

1. McCain has the political balls to come at either one of them hard with unpleasant facts that should easily be their undoing.  He has so far not shown any such indication.  He acts like the Dems are his best pals (and maybe they are).  I seriously doubt he'll do what's needed to properly bury either of these two.

2. Even if he did come at them hard, the MSM is going to have all of their pro-Dem amps turned to 11 this season.  It wouldn't matter if either of the Dems is caught in bed with under-aged kids while snorting coke.  MSM won't have the time to report it because they'll be too busy digging dirt on their former friend that still technically has the R beside his name.

 

48 "Besides Nurse Bloomberg, is there another white mayor of a major city?" Richie Daley, Chicago. The man who gave us Barack Obama. God, I'm so proud to be a Chicagoan!

49

It validates [the MSM wet dream] world view while screwing the people they secretly would love to shove into railcars- they will do anything to elect [an angry black man].--jjshaka

Yes.

50 If you mean "Southern Baptist," then say that.  If you mean "fundamentalist" or "Biblical literalist," then say that.  And if you mean "Protestant" or "non-Catholic," then say that.

I'm sorry, but I have to disagree: Evangelical has a generally-accepted meaning in the United States (which is different from its meaning in Europe).  It describes those Christians who believe in the inerrancy of the Bible.  They tend to be "born again" and of Protestant or Protestant-derived denominations (non-denominational "Bible churches are nearly always Evangelical), although some Catholics (usually converts) describe themselves this way as well.

I think the adjectival form of "evangelism" is "evangelistic."

51 "What you're not stating is that Hillary or Obama will at least meet unified Republican opposition in pretty much everything they want to do.  McCain won't."

Qwinn, with all due respect, that "unified Republican opposition" won't mean squat when C-in-C Obama pulls our troops out of Iraq and single-handedly throws away everything they've achieved over the last five years. For me, that consideration trumps everything else.

Not to mention the judges that Obama will nominate. Or the officers he will promote - do you honestly think a David Petraeus will be promoted by an Obama administration?

No, McCain will be very bad. But Obama or Hillary would be very much worse.

52

This whole Obama saga has enlightened me to the fact that the majority of blacks in this country are bigger assclowns then I had ever imagined. I think it's healthy actually.

 

 

53

MoronInTraining

Yes.

McCain is not to be trusted, nor is he to be financially supported UNTIL he secures our national borders. And he won't. His election by default will continue dissolving USA citizenship and empowering the globalization of the non-national sovereign-global New World Order that for over a century now isn't new at all, really. Those "progressive ideals" have proven the bane of mankind's misery countless times; by coersion we are led to the slaughter. We are in no better a position than the weakened cattle being electrically prodded while being water boarded to facilitate butchery by our government officials.

At best, McCain plays Saruman the White.

54 Curtis, I don't want to listen to no jive-ass preacher talking to me about Heaven and Hell blame whitey.

55 The term "evangelical" is often used in the MSM to confuse people. I remember watching "Jesus Camp" on tv when it was aired this last December or so. The film didn't explain at all what kind of group this was, except they called it "evangelistic". This lead the viewer to believe that basically all Protestant churches used Charismatic preaching style and content with the crying, falling out, and many times health and wealth doctrine, then quickly smeared both judges Roberts and Alito, saying they were subservient to this type of church. I rolled my eyes so hard when I watched it.

56

The problem Rev. Meeks has is that he is attacking the mayor and councilmen of the City of Chicago in racists terms, but it is clear that he doesn't like their policies.  But here is the problem, the mayor and council are liberals....the mayor is a member of the democratic party as are most of the council.

 

 

 

 

57 I like the top ten harmless geek pranks link in the side bar.

My brother just got an IM telling him his boss, his bosses son and he are all invited to a small, intimate meeting between small business owners and Senator Obama. Respond right away so we can clear you with the Secret Service. Location: The Kentucky Fried Chicken at the entrance to the mall. Heh!

I tried to post this prank over there but for some reason it didn't appear:

Change the location of your buddies browser cache to his desktop.

58 But isn't Obama on the Down Low?

59
Anybody catch Google's April Fool Joke?

60 "HILLARY or OBAMA it doesn't matter they're both BAD NEWS for the USA"

from Stuff Spurwing Plover Said
(Volume IV First Edition)

61 The anti-gay sentiment may cause a movement toward Hillary in the primary, but I don't think it will end up hurting the Democratic party much in the general election.  At best, it will get swept under the rug.  Gays have gotten used to being taken advantage of by the Dems, to the point where if they're given anything at all it's seen as a huge gift.  They put up with Bill Clinton's bait-and-switch on allowing gays in the military and then foisting 'Don't Ask, Don't Tell' on them, to Clinton signing the Defense of Marriage Act, to the Democratic party high mucky-mucks embracing Fred Phelps.  If a Republican vice-president-elect personally invited someone like Phelps to the presidential inauguration - twice - he'd be picketed and protested for the rest of his term and probably afterwards.  Yet Al Gore is still the Democratic darling.

62 It's so funny to see all of the hate and anger here. To respond to what is perceived as hate and anger you mentioned from Obama's spiritual advisor with more hate and anger seems rather silly and contradictory. I think better discussions woud be WHY so many black spritual advisors are so angry? How many of the commentors here have lived a lifetime of discrimination? Or have preached to people living one? How many here have even been in a situation of being a minority? Or are they content to be the majority on their couch? Maybe then people could understand where these preachers are coming from instead of sitting on the laptops of self rightousness.

63

This whole Obama saga has enlightened me to the fact that the majority of blacks in this country are bigger assclowns then I had ever imagined. I think it's healthy actually.

 Careful of the banhamma there, sir.

This election cycle has brought up the troubling propensity of blacks to vote race first. We seem to ignore this when it involves only our cities but it is disturbing. Turns out there are two Americas: black and white- if we can't make blacks feel like they are American first we could be in deep doo.

64

Wow Heidi, high horse much?

I hate to tell you this but the white backgroud of the site does not indicate the color of the commenters.

65 Maybe then people could understand where these preachers are coming from instead of sitting on the laptops of self rightousness.

Okay. Wright came from an upper middle class black family, received his bachelors and master's degree from Howard University, another masters from University of Chicago, and his phd from somewhere else the name of which I don't remember. He is now a millionaire.

So, what he is "coming from" is fucking life a privilege beyond the average life of the vast majority of white people.

66 He goes on to claim that the n-word is not a "bad word" for blacks and is actually a term of endearment!

So using the N word is a term of endearment for blacks...and if I tried to drop that on some of the blacks in some of the more reputable neighborhoods in the LA area, I'm sure that I would end up on a slab at the county coroner's office by the end of the day (being the pasty white gangster that I am).

Barry's buddies are like case of herpes - they just don't go away.

67 Actually, I find myself in surprising agreement with Reverend State Senator Meeks.  The Mayor and other whites DO control the public school system and they DO control it for the benefit of themselves and not the people, schools are supposed to be serving.  However, this analysis applies to the entire Democrat Party from Los Angeles to Seattle to Miami to New York City and includes the National Democrat Party.  The DNC has been quite willing to throw black children in the horrible inner city schools under the bus for decades, in order to keep the Teacher's Unions on the gravy train throwing kickbacks to the Democrat Party.  The Unions get Billions, while the Party gets millions (not to mention Union personnel and political support for Dems).

Now, the Reverend State Senator Meeks presents this as a racial problem (uh, it's fellow Democrats running the show Rev) and this is far too close to the Jews run the country kind of stuff.  The Mayor and the Dems aren't screwing over black kids, because they're black, it's all about the power and the money.  Dems will throw anyone under the bus regardless of race, color, creed, national origin or sexual orientation.

A real "Power to the People" solution would be to put the power in the hands of the parents, not black politicians.  Parents need control of their education budget and control of their education preferences.  Meeks wants the power and the money for himself and he'll throw black kids under the bus with the same abandon other Democrat politicians will.

To me, it is a plantation system and a kind of slavery, the problem is blaming whites and not his fellow Democrat politicians, the school-industry unions, etc.

68

 I think better discussions woud be WHY so many black spritual advisors are so angry?

It pays, and well.

69 Qwinn, please tell me you are kidding. Unified GOP opposition to an Obama POTUS? Uh, you do understand that the GOP is in the minority in both houses of congress, right? That means that conservative republicans can scream and holler and still stop nothing .... right? And congress has little power over the Commander in Chief. So Obama could fuck over the military pretty much at will, for at least 4 years.

70 I may die of popcorn lung before the convention.

JAMA (Journal of the American Medical Assn) reports that recent testing indicates that a sever overindulgence in sex - with or without partner - can alleviate some of the symptoms of popcorn lung! Indeed, if done with a willing set of partners in rotation, a complete cure is possible if the strict and fatiguing regimen is adhered  to.

71

Brief historical observations from Jonah Goldberg [edit personal observation]:

Religion was a political tool, while politics was the true religion. [Fascists to Black Supremacists] The progressives viewed the traditional system of constitutional checks and balances as an outdated impediment to progress, a barrier to their own ambitions. [moveon.org]

Huey Long famously said that if fascism ever came to America it would be called 'Americanism' [or anti-fascism].

Wilson: America is not now and cannot in the future be a place for unrestricted individual enterprise. The history of liberty is dead. Only a very gross substance of concrete conception can make any impression on the minds of the masses. They must get their ideas very absolutely put, and are much readier to receive a half truth which they can promptly understand than a whole truth which has too many sides to be seen all at once. [Educational system] The competent leader of men cares little for the internal niceties of other people's characters [contrary to early Romantics emphasis on the inner]: he cares much--everything--for the external uses to which [people] may be put...as materials upon which the leader's power operates. "Men are as clay in the hands of the consummate leader."

Progressives boast "power accrues to whoever is truly on God's side".

[So, from Wilson and the 1896 Social Gospel movement to Bush and Islam. Now to the Rev.Wright's nObama to whom Nancy Reagan's slogan is applied, "Just say no!" Positivist convolution and retrograde inversion dissolve civil rights by Black Power, blacks upon blacks upon whites. Today's Christians don't know their grandparents or greatgrandparents involvement in America's Social Gospel that shed all Christianity. As competitors with progressives and positivism, today's Christians get the brunt of political bigotry. But sadly the evangelicals have blindly committed the sabotage that they eschew of our conservative principles that they treasure by empowering the wolves and coyotes like Bush.]

 

72 I think better discussions woud be WHY so many black spritual advisors are so angry?

How big is "so many"?  10%, 20%, 50%?  You tell me.

73

toby928

and they laugh all the way to the bank

74 Heh hatred and anger....you're talking about Meeks and Wright, right? LOL because mostly I see a lot if incredulity here. Obama supporters are amusing in their silly death-grip on the narrative, that's for sure.

75 How many here have even been in a situation of being a minority?

Your question is a rhetorical one, but allow me to answer it anyway.

When I was in high school, my family moved to Hawaii.  Whites are the minority there, and are referred to as "haoles," a word that means 'foreigner' or 'outsider.'  The majority in my first high school (James Campbell High in Ewa Beach) did everything they could to make me feel like one.  I was beat up a few times, spit upon, had fireworks thrown at me and once - just for kicks - a guy decided it would be fun to pinch a nerve in my hand while pretending to be friendly.  There was even a "Kill Haole Day" where the school became a free-for-all of random punches and kicks.  Good times...

The racism was institutionalized.  When I and my family went to the school's administration to complain about this treatment, we were told that we had to understand that "there are places whites just should try to avoid."  That's a direct quote, as I'll never forget those words coming out of an authority figure.  The school may not have directly condoned the behavior, but they did little or nothing to stop it.

Was I angry at such treatment?  Absolutely.  Have I allowed it to color my view of those who were abusive?  Once, yes.  But I worked and transferred to another high school (Radford, in Aiea) and graduated.  I didn't wallow in my victimization or allow the hatred of others to define who I was. 

So to answer your question, yes, Heidi.  I have been a minority, and an unpopular one. 

Any other questions?

76 As Rush Limbaugh surmised, nObama's supporters live a lie and are only aroused when their lie is studied under the light of solar power that exposes no realm of substance other than "lie" for their existence. The lie doesn't bother them, and the only reason the lie would bother YOU is that you are a racist.

77 Ha ha. April Fools! Really, you guys are some of the nicest black church going folk I've never met.

78

I think better discussions woud be WHY so many black spritual advisors are so angry?

Coming from you, supporter of "hate crimes" legislation and such.

Yes, you're too dumb to see the irony. And no, I won't explain it to you.

79 bgates #17 "Given the flaws in the top Democrats' campaigns, and how out of sync they are with the public on immigration, a Republican should be able to beat all three of them."

Now there's an idea.  Maybe somebody should try to FIND a Republican, and convince him or her to run for President.

80

Holy crap!  Obama is begging to go down in flames.  I wonder if Michelle picked the replacement pastor (kinda like the Breck Girl's wife picking the campaign bloggers).

If Hillary loses, something tells me she will do whatever is necessary to ensure Obama goes down in flames.

McCain will win in a landslide.  I just can't see any other conclusion.  Tens of millions of average white voters will get scared to death and vote against him.

The next thing we have to worry about will be an overly cocky McCain in his first year.  That could be a problem.

81 Mesablue #29 "As Rush puts it, at least we'll get a conservative with McCain about 55% of the time. "

Yeah, well, that includes the 33% of the time that he's asleep, leaving about 22%.
    And yeah, I'm still gonna vote for him.  But don't try to fucking snow me, okay?

82 McCain is a pro-war Democrat. 

From a certain POV he's the perfect Republican candidate as far as electability goes in this particular cycle.  Both Obama and Hillary! are absurd socialists.  McCain is truly "center" and will attract both the base (well, enough of them) and the moderates while the Dem candidates struggle to attract the nutroots and center at once.  They won't be able to do it: Hillary! tacks to far to the right, and Obama to the left.  Either way they alienate non-trivial numbers of voters.

His best strategy is to simply shut up and let them destroy each other now.  Later, his best strategy is to simply shut up and let them destroy themselves.  Once he's in office, his best strategy is to simply die and let a well-chosen Veep handle things.

83

Heidi, it is the black church going folk or any specific racially purist congregation you should reconsider exhonerating before rejecting those of us living the melting pot lives. Today's most flagrant racists are minorities who refuse to accept those outside of their purist genetic pool.

Many of us who grew up a persecuted minority found maturity by living productive lives enjoying friendship and loyalty outside of our gene pool.

There is no more reality to "white" than "colored", as if you don't get that. If you insist that totally racist reality still distinguishes the two parties, then the KKK "white" is Democrat (charging Obama as Uncle Tom), and the GOP is "colored".

84
In the long run, people who support Obama and those leaning towards supporting Obama will ignore all this.

85 JayC #62 "^{from Stuff Spurwing Plover Said
(Volume IV First Edition)}"
That's from the heavily-edited, spelling-cleaned-up edition, isn't it?

Alice H #63 "the Democratic party high mucky-mucks embracing Fred Phelps."

The whats embracing who, when?  What, because of his vast influential voter power or the sheer charisma that he brings to every issue?  Oh wait, he only has one issue, and it's making noisy obnoxious protests at military funerals because the USA isn't gay-hostile enough to suit him.  Can anybody name ten people who don't despise Fred Phelps?  Outside of his eentsy little "Baptist" church, I mean.  And the quote marks are there because even the Baptists don't recognize that toxic little creep as being one of their own.

"If a Republican vice-president-elect personally invited someone like Phelps to the presidential inauguration - twice - he'd be picketed and protested for the rest of his term and probably afterwards.  Yet Al Gore is still the Democratic darling."

Al Gore did that????  Okay, besides Al Gore, can anyone name nine other people who don't despise Fred Phelps?
  Oh my goodness, you know what?  The hard-hitting deep-digging reporterette on 60 Minutes the other night also forgot to bring that up, while she was forgetting to ask about the funding source(s) for his superduper worldwide advertising campaign. That's just darned odd, isn't it?

86 When Obama ran for the U.S. Senate in 2003, he frequently campaigned at Salem Baptist Church while Rev. Meeks appeared in television ads supporting the Illinois senator’s campaign...

I could have sworn there was a big dem uprising over Churches supporting or advocating a political candidate and that would risk losing their tax exempt status. I guess it's ok for dems.

87

April Fools! Oh, man, I really had you going, didn't I?

Seriously, we're all about healing and getting past the politics of race. Vote Obama.

Or you're a racist.

88 2008 is turning into a year where every day is Christmas.  The Dems just keep on giving.  Now if only they will lose ungraciously (a la 2000) so I can continue to feel this tingling up my leg into 2009.

89 Dogstar #85 "McCain will win in a landslide.  I just can't see any other conclusion.   ... The next thing we have to worry about will be an overly cocky McCain in his first year."

It's not too early to start worrying about over-cockiness, imho. 

90 "McCain will win in a landslide.  I just can't see any other conclusion.   ... The next thing we have to worry about will be an overly cocky McCain in his first year."

I have no doubt that the day after his inauguration, we'll be ordered to wear our underwear outside our pants.

91 Okay, I'm white.  But I can't in good conscience say that I've ever heard a black person refer to another as a "House n*****" and not mean that as anything other than insult.  A term of endearment.  Really???  This has to be an April Fools joke.

92 But I can't in good conscience say that I've ever heard a black person refer to another as a "House n*****" and not mean that as anything other than insult.

Maybe in 1865 it was merely a description of where one worked on the plantation,  today, not so much.

93 I could have sworn there was a big dem uprising over Churches supporting or advocating a political candidate and that would risk losing their tax exempt status. I guess it's ok for dems.

Well, your thinking about the Clinton years when people got all up in arms when some black churches were practically campaigning for him.

The response the media got was, and I'm sorry I cant remember who said it, "the Black Church is a political movement".

94 Yes, churches sell recordings. Years ago I recorded church services and such using wire recorders and lathes using shellac-on-glass or shellac-on-aluminum.

95 This might be a little late, but I wanted to address Heidi's comments from earlier. 
Heidi - I refuse to look into your questions as to why some black preacher might be angry.  I don't care because I have nothing to do with his anger.  That and I've faced some adversity in my life and don't see any reason to complain about it.  I grew up male, white, and poor.  My father worked 50-60 hours a week for years to put food on our table and put my sister and I through college.  We had to shop for clothes at the Salvation Army (not because we were looking for kickin' 'vintage' shirts, but because we needed clothes) on occasion, among other second-hand clothing outlets, especially during the times my father was laid off - gasp! yes, it happens to whites too.  I have faced discrimination on the job and been turned down for employment on at least two occasions...because I was white.  Not 'there was a under-qualified black man that they had to hire to fulfill quotas.'  No, I was passed over because, with a little tilt of their heads and a knowing glance, both men, both black, said 'I don't think you'll be a good fit here' after what I considered to be good interviews.  You know what, Heidi?  I held out my hand, shook theirs, thanked them for the opportunity, exited the building, and had a good laugh.  Both of those instances took place in Atlanta at all-black companies in October, 2000.  I was not aware before the interviews that they were trying to maintain a certain 'look' to their companies.  I have since continued to live my life, and while those were vital lessons on my life, I have no anger about them. I don't go around to strangers on the street and yell about the injustices I have faced in my life.  I have forged on without the help of government, social activism, or fringe groups and made my own life.  I harbor no anger against black people in general.  I judge people as individuals, and this is without regard to skin color.  There are far more individual white people I harbor animosity for than individual blacks.  I see no solidarity in skin color, rather I believe in solidarity in belief and philosophy.  I hold out my arms and welcome blacks to the conservative movement, not because it 'colors' or - ugh - 'diversifies' the movement, but rather I rejoice because it signifies freedom of thought, a release from the prison of fear (you know, fear of the white, racist, homophobe boogey-man), and the breaking away of an individual from a collectivist socialist monolith.  To the point of your comments, when I have been the victim of attempted robbery by black men, were they justified in trying to rob me Heidi?  Were they justified in calling me 'white-boy?'  Was it OK for them to assume that I had money because I was white?  Did I 'owe' them because they might have been poorer than me?  Did their 'circumstances' deem them entitled to what I had?  There is no line of reasoning in the brain of man to justify a 'yes' answer to any of those questions.  No, I don't need to explore 'why' some black preacher might be angry.  Because I have faced injustices in my life and I'm not angry at those situations.   I'm angry at people like Heidi, and Rev Wright and others.  People who want to start a fire, never wanting a solution to their 'plight' because there's money to be made in the hate business (see Mr Wright's fancy new House that Hate Built), when right in their face is the simple truth:  there is opportunity for everyone in this country.  No, outcomes are not guaranteed, but if you get out of your own way, there's possibilities for success for everyone, regardless of skin color.  Heidi, I know where these preachers are coming from, and the blind eye you turn to their hypocrisy whether its out of shallow black skin solidarity or equally shallow white guilt is much more egregious than the perceived 'laptops of self-righteousness' you pine on about. 

96 Ouch, didn't realize I went on so long...and with no spaces.  My apologies to regular morons.

97 I wondered when this shoe would drop, not necessarily from Wright but anyone who is exposed to our AA citizens speaking their minds knows that gay marriage etc is, um, not popular. Likewise our black citizens skew strongly pro-life (and somewhat pro-voucher but whose counting?). Farrakhan is no anti-Semite merely and the Meekses/Wrights/Sharptons of this world do not harbor discreet greivances that are amenable to mitigation but bitter, irrational hatreds that are unappeasable except through the destruction of their object. This they share with the jihadis.

98 Wonder what Meeks thinks of Mayor Ray Nagin.

99

Captkidney,

People know rattling the banhammer makes noise.  Drawing it does not.

Art,

Amen.

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