1 Life is messy.  Relax.  No one is going to hold this sort of thing against her.  At least no one worth bothering with.

2 Well...that was unexpected.

3 Who gives a fuck?  What does this have to do with Gov Palin's ability to assume the VP spot?  Anyone?  If anything, it drives home the fact that she is a normal person dealing with normal issues that a lot of families deal with.  Exit question for Obama:  Is this penalizing her daughter?  Should she abort it?

4

Makes many attacks by Dems even more tricky and even more likely to seem elistist.

Imagine during the VP debate that  a stumbling Biden claims something about how Palin is "more of the same" on health care & thus does not understand the challanges facing young single mothers. 

Still, first reaction is that it makes me more impressed with her & family choices.  More examples of experience with real life modern situations.

I hope the daughter is ready for the political attacks.

5

What have we just found out?

The daughter is keeping the baby, and the father is marrying her.

Other than the abortion-at-any-costs family planning crowd, who has a problem with this?

6

Wait.

So Rove got the daughter pregnant to distract from Gov Palin's inexperience?

 

7 LOL.....what are the loonies going to say?

That she should abort the baby?  The fact that she hasn't will push people even farther into realizing that Palin and her family practice what they preach and, unlike the Obamamessiah, don't consider a baby a "punishment".

That her family will disown her? That's been a meme of the hatemongering left forever that all Christian parents disown their knocked-up daughters -- and Palin is demolishing it as we speak.

That having teenage sex means her parents are bad? How are the loony lefties going to spin that one, when they're the ones handing out condoms in elementary schools and encouraging kids to "just do it"?

The only people this would piss off are the most extreme of the extreme right wing, who are already upset about the fact that she's a woman.

8 As the parent of two, soon to be three, teenagers my heart goes out the the Palins.

You raise your children and try to instill in them the values that you want them to have. 

Sometimes they follow those values and you have no problems.

Other times, as with our oldest son, they go and do something really goof-ball stupid that is so far outside of what you have taught them that it puts you in a tail spin.

Luckily, our son didn't get anyone pregnant and his problems will go away with a short period of probation, a fine, and some community service.

Raising teens is no picnic.  What they face and are pressured with in the year 2008 is very difficult so I can understand what the Palins are going through.

9 We ask the media, respect our daughter and Levi's privacy as has always been the tradition of children of candidates," the statement concluded.

Yeah, like that's gonna happen. That only works for Democrats, like "DUI Gore the 3rd."

Best of luck to the (very) young couple, and may those who invade their privacy get what they deserve - loss.

I don't see Obama getting much traction out of this, but then I didn't see any leverage for him attacking Palin's executive experience, and there you are.

This, of course, wouldn't even be controversial at all if it was a Democrat, because there are no standards for Democrats. If there were, there wouldn't be any Democrats.

10 Anybody want to look through the nuts' statements about this for comments along the lines of "there's nothing wrong with teenage pregnancy, our concerns are with Palin's dishonesty"? Shame we couldn't rope those dopes out some more.

11 And Minx sucks.

12 Good for Bristol for keeping the baby and best of luck to them!  A new baby is always a blessing and a joy!  The order may not be correct to some, but I have less of a problem with that than an abortion.  Let's see if Obama sends condolences for this "burden" he has spoken about. 

13

Awaiting Obama campaign to come out:

"We don't want Bristol Palin punished with a baby for making this mistake do we?"

Of course the contrast is clear on this issue:

If Obama's own children became pregant, his answer is immediate abortion so his kids won't be "punished".

The Palin's are having the child.

Could also be spun in this matter:  Here we have the effectiveness of 40 years of Liberal social engineering.  Any other teen becoming pregnant would be held up by the Left as an idol of worship.  Since Palin is now the VP nominee, it's a bad thing?

14 To any Republican journalist types that might look in...relax.  Just relax.  Whatever your other journalist buddies are screaming at you about the unforgiving saber-toothed fundies out in Jesus land, ignore it.  Every family with teen aged kids just became sympathetic and supportive.  Well they should.  The only way Repubs can screw this up is if they mistreat Palin.  And the only way Republican pundits can screw up is by jumping to conclusions about the red states and about Palin based upon what their belt way journalist friends tell them.  When and if it comes out that McCain knew about this and didn't care women are going to like him more, not less.  All is well.

15 Good thing you didn't post this over DrewM's post.

16 Everybody needs to stop talking about this now.  Just leave her alone, she is seventeen and not running for office. 

17

You know if Palin would have stayed home, this probably wouldn't have happened.

sarc off/

18

Okay, so the father is a warlock?

The baby is a witch?

I'm so confused.

 

19

Okay. About five minutes ago I posted the following:

Meh. None of my fucking business.

...and no one else's either.

And so I refreshed the page, and the comment was there. (And yes, I'm posting on the "real" site, not the mu.new site.) I exit Ace, to go to NRO (they had their heads up their butts over Palin, but that doesn't make them teachable ...and still a valuable conservative resource). Nothing. I come back here (I'm having my morning tea, and this is my "morning paper", as it were). In the meantime, I see that Ace has added to the main piece. And that my comment has gone missing.

So I've reached the only logical conclusion: Ace hates me.

...does this mean I'm not invited to the hobo hunts anymore?

20  OK, not that this private matter is anyones business, but...

If the Left side wishes to pursue this issue, and if Bristol is indeed having the child, doesn't this shine a light back on the Obama vote for infanticide?

21

ND 30, the people who are complaining the most about Palin being a woman are on the left. I'm pretty far right, and I think her pick was a home run.

All this issue shows me is Palin and family are human. Unline those on the left, they seem to live up to that whole personal responsibility thing they talk about. The parents are getting married and keeping the baby. Now I see why the left hates Sarah. You mess up, you fix it. Not the Government.

Anyone on the right who has a issue with this ought to go read that Book about that Jesus fellow.  Something about "You who are without sin Cast the first stone" was in it. And a lot about forgiveness. And personal responsibility.

The Left will be the ones jerkin their gerkins to this story. Not the Right.

22 Some are insinuating in various places that McCain didn't know about this before the announcement. There's no way...nobody is that stupid.

Maybe I'm trying to put the best face on things, but I think the glee from the left will boomerang back on them in a Rovian jujitsu kind of way. What woman doesn't know someone who has faced this, or had a pregnancy scare, or whose daughter had this problem? If the left goes overboard and starts crying "slut" or saying that Sarah should have stayed home and raised her kids, this will have blowback where women are concerned.

This doesn't affect my enthusiasm but I guess I'm a little worried about how the social cons in the party will react - I don't know them that well. I'm guessing (hoping) that most will forgive this.

We'll see.

23 I question the timing

24 Ace hates me.

Use that as your sock puppet until his will breaks.

25 I'm not going to look at Milky Loads, but fortunately I don't need to. We already know what the leftist spin on this is going to be:

(1) Gov. Palin supports abstinence-only education [is that true? --ed.], and somehow this makes her a hypocrite.
(2) If she can't keep her own daughter from fucking around, how's she going to run the country. SHE'S A BAD MOTHER!!1!!111!cos2pi!!!
(3) I question the timing!
(4) The Fundies and Jesustards are going to HATE her now. They advocate STONING women who have sex outside of marriage, and if they don't stone Bristol, they're teh hypocrites!!!!eleventy!!!2!!! Just like they hate her for participating in a beauty pageant and showing a little leg!!!111!!one!!!two!!!

26 It took the media 2 days to break this story but it took almost a year on John Edwards and his love child?  Geez.

27 You raise your children and try to instill in them the values that you want them to have. Posted by: Well Hung Chad heh.

28 How uncouth!

29 Clearly this is a setup by Rove to make the "burden" statement blow up in Obama's face.  KRYMB.

30 I'm not going to look at the Corner.  But I will say this.  If the NRO is supportive of Palin on  this they are doing the right thing.  They are being good and compassionate people and they are doing the politically intelligent thing as well ( not always the same thing, but the same thing in this circumstance.)  If they aren't Republican contributors and politicans whose association with the NRO reflects on them should reconsider their assocaition with that publication.  It would be a sister Souljay mojment that would do the Republoicans a great service with women, working families and the Red States.  That's all I can say.

31 This is a great opportunity for Biden to have a Johnny Edwards moment in the VP debate.  Remember this gem from 2004 from the Breck Girl about Mary Cheney?

"Now, as to this question, let me say first that I think the vice president and his wife love their daughter. I think they love her very much. And you can't have anything but respect for the fact that they're willing to talk about the fact that they have a gay daughter, the fact that they embrace her. It's a wonderful thing. And there are millions of parents like that who love their children, who want their children to be happy."

C'mon Slow Joe, surely you can come up with a similar condescendingly backhanded compliment that really means "Hey Palin, your daughter's a slut."

32 We need a new base. Our current base is too busy having teenage sex to focus all of its energy on the war.

33

I'm an idiot. Two fucking threads, and Ace posts the same faaake on both. Which doesn't mean that Ace isn't out to get me, you unnerstan'.

...and CDR-M makes the only point worth making about this: as just another illustration of the duplicity of the media.

34 Davis,

Check the post below. They look strangely similar.

35

I just heard about this on Fox news, and my initial reaction was OH SHIT.  I wondered why McCain made this selection knowing this all along.  I've calmed down now and after thinking about it a bit more it doesn't seem to be the catastrophe I first thought.  Many families (Dem & Rep) deal with this sort of thing, and are savvy enough to realize that no matter how a child is raised, when their hormones are jump started as teenagers they are liable to make stupid decisions.  No matter how strict or attentive an upbringing is, parents simply can't control everything that a teenager does, and I think a lot of people will appreciate that. 

However, it still doesn't look good.  Let's hope Palin gives a stellar acceptance speech.  She is going to have to to allay concerns about her.

 

P.S.:  Andrew Sullivan is a lowlife.

 

36 That's it, I could never vote for a woman whose daughter got pregnant.

37 This doesn't affect my enthusiasm but I guess I'm a little worried about how the social cons in the party will react - I don't know them that well. I'm guessing (hoping) that most will forgive this.

Social cons have kids that get preggers out of wedlock. Many social cons have had sex outside of marriage. It's about forgiveness, condemnation. This happens all the time in real life. The people aren't going to really care except to wish the kids and their bun in the oven the best.

38 Andrew Sullivan keeps going

"Now all we need is confirmation from the obstetrician who delivered Sarah's baby, Trig."

No Andrew.  We do not need confirmation.

39 in #37
condemnation = not condemnation

40 Crazy idea, but hear me out:

We know the left (and Milky "Power Glutes" Loads) is going to attack Bristol for um... doing what 85% of us did in high school, and the other 15% were trying to do but couldn't because we were awkward, geeky, or foul-smelling. So after they call her a slut, have her cut an ad:

"Unlike Senator Obama, I don't view my unborn child as a 'punishment.' I already love him or her completely. And if I happen to give birth while in Illinois, I will not exercise the right that Senator Obama preserved for all mothers in Illinois: the right to leave my new baby to die in a linen closet."

41 I for one welcome our reproducing overlords

42 Attention Morons!

The new protocol regarding Andrew Sullivan is as follows:

He is ONLY to be referred to as "Power Glutes," "Milky Loads," "HARDNSOLIDDC," or something similar related to his barebacking ads.

Ace, back me up.

43 I'm an Evangelical Christian and I have to say upon hear this news I am very disappointed.  I will not be voting for McCain/Palin after all, because if Palin can't control her own kids, how can she handle being VP, and possibly the Presidency?  She's unfit as a mother and unfit to lead this country.

Just kidding.  =D

The truth is I'd rather Palin had a picture perfect family, but the depths of one's character is oft determined by how a person reacts to a time of crisis.  And in this instance, where she is keeping the baby and marrying the father, with the support of her entire family behind her, I don't think this could have possibly been better handled.

This is how a true conservative Christian family deals with an unexpected teen pregnancy:  with love, forgiveness, and the enlightened belief that bringing a baby into this world no matter the circumstance is a blessing, not a punishment.

44

Not at all relevant except for the "haters" like Milky Loads, and frankly at this point, I want the politically insane hating on us.

To use a WWII analogy, it's a blown tire on the road to Berlin. Stick to the task at hand and lets the left-wing nuts beclown themselves-which they will.

45 ND 30, the people who are complaining the most about Palin being a woman are on the left. I'm pretty far right, and I think her pick was a home run.

Totally agreed. I was thinking of the extreme right in which they insist that women should never lead or instruct males "because the Bible says so", ignoring such salient examples as Deborah and Timothy's mother and grandmother.

But then again, given that the Democrat Left thinks that Iran is progressive in its treatment of women, point well taken.

The reason Boxer, Pelosi, and Shrillary are shitting themselves over Palin is simple; she's cracking a glass ceiling all right, but it's the one they've used to convince women that, in order to advance in the world, they have to ditch their religious beliefs and sense of morality and recenter their world around loathing the baby that grows inside of you enough to kill it.

46 Masturbatin' Pete(!),

I don't disagree with you on principle, but I do question your figures. Looking around this site I would venture a guess that 85% of these morons were not getting any in High School.

47 I think #7, um, nailed it. The contrast between Obama's hypothetical about not wanting to see his daughters "punished with a baby", and the Palins' real-world response to a real situation, is stark, and will not go unnoticed.

48 Burden? He said he didn't want his daughters PUNISHED with a baby. Pretty amazing that Rove got him to say that, isn't it? Amazing to see the whole plan coming together.

49 Again, all is well.  Red-Staters, especially fundies will be very sympathetic and compassionate...This is not going to play the way the MSM folk think. Andrew Sulllivan and Kos and CNN if they follow him will give McCain another five points in the polls with this by the time it's all said and done...

50 (4) The Fundies and Jesustards are going to HATE her now. They advocate STONING women who have sex outside of marriage, and if they don't stone Bristol, they're teh hypocrites!!!!eleventy!!!2!!! Just like they hate her for participating in a beauty pageant and showing a little leg!!!111!!one!!!two!!!

You are in error.  I am a follower of Jesus Christ and have children of various ages.  Everyone I know is very happy with the Palin choice, and something of this nature will have absolutely no bearing on her competency as a mother or civil leader.

You train a child but ultimately they are not some Pavlovian dog that is bound by behavioral conditioning.  We all ultimately make our own decisions and live with the consequences.  Every single one of us has done things we regret at some point.   The real issue is how we learn from and respond to those decisions and move on.

51 My question is a very simple one -- Does Sarah Palin have time to be Vice President?   It's a kind of demanding job.  

And now it seems she has a wedding to help plan as well as a special needs newborn to care for.  But maybe she'll hand those tasks to others

Or, maybe she's just going to not do much as a veep.  Confidantes to McCain have said he certainly doesn't want to follow the Cheney model so maybe McCain's job description for Palin was exactly what he made jokes about on late nite TV.  McCain said, ''The vice president only has two duties. One is to break a tie vote in the United States Senate. The other duty is to inquire daily as to the health of the president.'"

And she may have accepted that job description because she has said that she really didn't know what the VP did.

52

I expect Michael Moore to pop up any moment to document the rudeness and self-centeredness and lack-of-concerned-ness of the Palins to announce this while there is a hurricane going on.  Must mean God is on the Democrats' side, eh?

53 valid points. A bump in the polls is not out of the realm of possibility. Palin's next few public speeches will tell the tale. Personally, I hope she wipes the floor with the left. And Biden, if I were you, I'd were a steel codpiece in a debate with this woman. Just a FYI.

54 We should make our McCain/Palin'08 lawn signs out of diapers to show our support.

55

Which doesn't mean that Ace isn't out to get me, you unnerstan'.

Don't blame Ace. Ask yourself what you've done to piss off Rove.

56

We know the left (and Milky "Power Glutes" Loads) is going to attack Bristol for um... doing what 85% of us did in high school, and the other 15% were trying to do but couldn't because we were awkward, geeky, or foul-smelling.

I just have to say that this is complete BS.  It may be true for a guy, but not every chick in high school was trying to get some...and if they were, being awkward, geeky, or foul-smelling wouldn't have been an impediment; some teenage guy would have obliged.

I do think that the parents hold some responsibility for Bristol's pregnancy and I am disappointed.  This is dysfunctional family territory.

But, that's their personal business.  Ronald Reagan brought up some pretty twisted kids and I don't think it hampered his ability to govern.

57 Karl Rove, you magnificent bastard! You impregnated her yourself, didn't you?

All sorts of leftist pukes will overreach trying to slime her on this, and rally every decent person around Palin and her daughter, you just watch.

58

51 My question is a very simple one -- Does Sarah Palin have time to be Vice President?   It's a kind of demanding job.  

And now it seems she has a wedding to help plan as well as a special needs newborn to care for.  But maybe she'll hand those tasks to others

Add chores like chopping wood, making soap, scrubbing floors and the like and she'll never have the time.

59 It's just an unforced error. I wish this were known about Palin's daughter before the VP pick. Then it would have made little difference. But since it comes as a surprise after McCain judged and chose, you can already smell the witches' brew over there on the left... it's the hypocrisy! Their favorite attack. I won't use my oiliest dKos voice, I'll tell you what the most even-tempered of the left will say. That pro-abstinence Christians, who pride themselves on chastity and forbearance, can't seem to raise a child who makes smart decisions. If we, the left, had educated her, she would have had all the benefits of Planned Parenthood. Now Bristol will have a baby with no way to support it, and if she takes one cent of public support or benefit, the hypocrisy is doubled. We all know conservatives love babies in the womb, but hate to pay for them once born. How can you trust people with judgment like this? Obama's beautiful, telegenic, angelic children haven't become pregnant. And at least they have the Right To Choose. Well, that's what the least acerbic of the left will say. And of course they are never hypocrites, given that they consider no personal standards of behavior better than any other. For those of us outside of official campaigns, if they want to run with this, it's time to talk, loudly, about the number of times Biden's kids have been arrested. By the way, Andi Sullivan is still dancing, and I think he's singing a medley of show tunes. But with a rap beat, to keep it fresh, y'all.

60

Jane, you contradicted yourself in one post. Great job. All the VP does is serve as President of the Senate and wait on the POTUS to die. If you will show all of Palin's comment, you will see that she had no idea what JOHN MCCAIN would want as a VP. At the time she said that, Mccain had not picker her. I guess she should have played Kreskin with the questions

Why no concerns about the Obamamessiah? His wife works outside the home, he is running for POTUS, and they have two small children. I guess they will grow up fine with both parents working. Maybe Rev. Wright can raise them for the Obama's. He seems to have been a good influence on their dad.

61
The fingerwagging left: what a bunch of pricks.

62 DCox:

I totally agree with you. But that's what the left is going to say.

runninrebel:

They given my name is "Masturbatin' Pete," do you think I was in the 85% that was getting some in high school, or the... other 15%?

jane:

The "what does the VP do?" comment has been completely distorted. Palin was saying that she's used to getting things done as a governor, and all the VP does is break ties. The "what does the VP do?" thing was a rhetorical question.

63 And so it begins......

64 Folk like Jane should be welcomed into the debate and even encouraged to scream this stuff from the national stage.  McCain will win all fifty seven states.

65 You are the next hobo hunt, davis, br.

66 I do think that the parents hold some responsibility for Bristol's pregnancy and I am disappointed.  This is dysfunctional family territory.

Oh, fuck you. You raise your kids the best you can. Some of them turn out great, some of them turn out awful. Happens to the best parents. But all children, no matter how good their parents are, make mistakes, and some of these mistakes have life-changing consequences.

67 Please folks, no more links to Ko$. Thats where Power Glutes gets his talking points.

68 And it continues......

69

I'm sure the media will give the Palin's every benefit of the doubt just like they did John Edwards.

70 Sorry for the Kos links, just thought you might want to see that the shits already started.

71

Oh, fuck you. You raise your kids the best you can. Some of them turn out great, some of them turn out awful.

Spoken like someone who shouldn't be speaking.

Bristol's a CHILD, genius.  The parents are responsible for her behavior.  Stop playing with yourself and deal before embarrassing yourself further.

 

72 I will not be voting for McCain/Palin after all, because if Palin can't control her own kids, how can she handle being VP, and possibly the Presidency?

You're right. If she can't stop her own teenage daughter from having sex with a young man, how can we expect her to look Vladimir Putin in the eye and demand that he not have sex with a young man? Huh?

McCain / GMILF '08

73 I can't pretend that I wish Bristol Palin wasn't pregnant, for the mere sake of politics.  There is nothing technically wrong here - seriously, if the Kossites think that McCain will lose conservative votes over this they really, really don't understand what we're all about - but I've already reached the breaking point of scandal fatigue.  Fake scandal fatigue, but scandal fatigue.

74 I just think how I would feel and what I would say if someone I know well told me his teenage daughter was pregnant and getting married.

Congratulations!!!

75 Life finds a way. Whether you're 17 or 44, life finds a way. It's just that simple.

It's what you choose to do with that life that matters. The Palin's have obviously instilled in their daughter the more important moral quality: choose life.

Congrats to the Palins and Bristol and Levi.

76 Bristol's a CHILD, genius.  The parents are responsible for her behavior.

I wouldn't call a 17-year-old a "child," or even a "CHILD," but whatever.

Parents are responsible for all aspects of all their daughter's actions? You don't really believe that, do you?

77

Bristol's a CHILD, genius.  The parents are responsible for her behavior.  Stop playing with yourself and deal before embarrassing yourself further.

 

 

She is 17. Soon to be 18. She bears the responsiblity for getting pregnant. Along with the father. No one else.

78

Loose morals and stewed mooses!

Vetted? Not! 

(Lack of) Focus on the Family once again by those preaching pundits of moral paudacity!  More hypocracy from the immoral majority! 

Seems Palin should be keeping an eye out for who's goosing her kid instead of shooting defenseless mooses with the NRA!

For shame!  If you can't keep your family on track you can't keep America on track! 

Seems some birth control education is sorely lacking in the Palin household!

79 It's Moby time.

80 None of this changes the fact that Palin's hot.

81 Expect this to get lots of play, seen at HotAir: Todd Palin, DUI 1986 Look, if CBN reports this it's probably now fair game for the Leftards. I'm telling you, it's time to dredge up every pecadillo in Biden's family's life. If this is how they want to play it, then let's play it that way. And then go after every one of Obastard's relatives, and Harpy the Michelle as well. Don't forget what they did to Bush with the October DUI surprise. This is going to be the dirtiest fight since Lincoln/Douglas, and we had better fight dirty, but only if it looks sure to succeed.

82 Both of them.

83

Good point.

Obama would not want his daughter 'punished' with a baby.

The Palins happily anticipate the birth of the next member of the family.

 

Maverick and SaraCuda are going to be in Colorado Springs Saturday morning. I'm thinking about going.

84

Orwell,

 

McCain knew about the pregnancy before he offered her the job.

 

There's been a "jane" concern troll on every thread on this topic on every right wing site I've visited today.

It's a talking point.  She (or her doppleganger) calls herself "Booklady1" on Lucianne.

85 Since some of you are willing to "take the bullet" for me and keep an eye on the kos kidz and DU so I don't have to, I'll keep refreshing the corner.nationalreview.com so that you don't have to sully your pristine mononosity with their elitistism. istic. I'll keep you updated is what I mean.

So far, no denoucing of the witch teenager. Yet.

86

Eh, I am pro-choice & will for McCain/Palin. 

I am pissed at the crazy attacks on Palin so I go to donate a minor sum to McCain and after wading through the hurrican link page, found out I can not donate directly any more. 

But I can donate to to his Compliance Fund!

Quote what it is: ".[McCain]..is participating in the presidential public funding system, it will not raise private campaign contributions after August 31, 2008. However, federal law allows the Campaign to establish the Compliance Fund to defray legal and accounting compliance costs and preserve the Campaign's public grant for media, mail, phones, and get-out-the-vote programs."

So I did via credit card and put in the  "referred" blank "Bristol Palin" just to try and signal some support for their choices. 

87

I do think that the parents hold some responsibility for Bristol's pregnancy and I am disappointed.  This is dysfunctional family territory.

How much do you actually know about their family? You have no idea what led to this. They could be great parents or not so much.

I'm a stay at home mom. My decisions have certainly been different than hers to go on a work trip late in pregnancy and go back to work 3 days after giving birth. That doesn't mean I think she made wrong decisions. I hope that all they have done and will do is good for the family. If the kids are neglected by both their parents, that would be bad. I'm not jumping to that conclusion, though.

 

88

More hypocracy from the immoral majority! 

lol!

89 In an un-cruel (lack of left wing) world, this is virtually a non-story. I don't think this affects conservative or Republicans. I'm concerned on the reaction of indy's and undecideds. Man, talk about getting the wind knocked out of me. From Friday's elation to today's trepidation. Okay, take a deep breath and HANG TOUGH!!!

90 Moby is out, more on the way. Someone hand me that Browning Automatic Rifle, I just had its scope reset and I'd like to give it a whirl.

91 Yeah good point, fredas. CONGRATULATIONS, BRISTOL PALIN!

92

Quiz: How many Congressional seats will attacking Bristol cost the Democratic Party?

93 She's having a baby, and getting married. Enough angst, that is some joyful shit right there.

94 It is an unforced error.  Still, I really think that it allows a favorable comparison to Obama's Infanticide vote.

The Talk Radio topics will be all over this tomorrow.  We'll see how it plays out.

95 Also, we should start a betting pool.

How many days before a leftist questions the timing?

96 Balrog, I understand the McCain knew previously. But what concerns me is that the rest of us didn't know. It's of no importance to me, but the "surprise" of the matter gives Leftards an opening to play the noxious hypocrisy card again, that may sway undecideds. I only think that if everyone knew of this before the pick, the effect would be blunted. But I can certainly be wrong. And remember: Lift with your legs, not with your back, and don't feed the trolls.

97 Yes, it's bad that her daughter was sleeping around before being married and even worse she got pregnant. That's wrong and she should have not only known better, but her parents should have raised her better.

That said, it doesn't really affect my view of Governor Palin's governing ability or ideas. It just makes me sigh at how children so often tend to suffer from their parents' successes and advancement.

98 The Palins seem like a very good family to me. The daughter Bristol is doing the right thing. Didn't some dude say something a long time ago about splinters in people's eyes. To err is human, to forgive is divine. This news increases my enthusiasm and support for McCain/Palin.

99 Miss Palin is 17.  She may be a "child," but any parents trying to exercise 24/7 control over a 17-year-old is a tyrant.

Miss Palin 1) accepts responsibility 2) is going to keep her baby and 3) is going to marry the baby's father.

I don't consider this "dysfunctional" at all.  A challenge, yes, a situation the shoulda/coulda/woulda been avoided, yes, but it's how people DEAL WITH THEIR CHOICES THAT MATTERS.

100

Yeah, Biden will mention Sarah's impending grandmother-ness in the debate, just as when Cheney's lesbian daughter got dragged into a 2004 debate. Biden won't be able to help himself.

Mav's vp pick has ignited a shitstorm. I hope the Palins are up for it.

101 Oh yes, it's teh hypocracy!!!11!!!one!!!!cos 2π!!!

Let's unpack the "hypocracy" charge here a little bit:

-Gov. Sarah Palin says "don't bang before you're married."
-Gov. Palin's daughter bangs before she's married

How in blazes does that make Gov. Palin a hypocrite?

The only way it's possible is if Gov. Palin publicly said "don't bang before you're married," then privately encouraged her daughter to screw.

I said it once, I'll say it again: Trig Palin will never say anything half as retarded as what we routinely hear from the left.

102

Very hard to get my head around this news.  As a mother of a teenage boy and an 11-year-old girl, I really do not relish having yet another celebrity teen pregnancy splashed across the front pages.  I'm glad the Palins are going to be there for their daughter and her new family, and I am glad they aren't gooing to kill the baby, but it's a terrible example for other teens.  I feel I might as well just give up even trying to teach my kids abstinence and just march them down to Planned Parenthood right now for the birth control pills and condoms.  Thanks, Sarah. 

103 morbo, it'll be minutes or hours, not days. If not already...

104 Also, we should start a betting pool. How many days before a leftist questions the timing?

I'll take zero.

105 If you will note some of the posts, the "Christians are hypocrites" garbage is rolling in, right on schedule. The one good thing about this is that the trolltards are firmly cementing the conservative base to McCain with this bitter spin.

106 While I see no need to condemn Bristol for getting pregnant -- it happens

That's where you should have stopped, Moby. This is none of your business, and has no bearing on Gov. Palin's fitness for office.

107

#98 but her parents should have raised her better.

hey dipshit- my parents raised me fine. Taught me respect for authority and how success only comes from hard work. I STILL got a girlfriend pregnant, spent a weekend in jail, and wrecked a few cars.

And that was just September 1983.

108

but it's a terrible example for other teens. 

 

OK. Daughter has sex and gets pregnant. Her and the father are getting married and will have to raise the child together.

I think that is called taking responsibility for your actions. Not being a single mom or murdering your unborn child. You do this, and this is what happens. Great teaching moment if you ask me.

 

 

109 Hey, leave me outta this!

110 >>If this is how they want to play it, then let's play it that way. When did we stop? Seriously, have you been following this campaign? Every aspect of Obama's life, including the idiotic birth certificate thing, has been dissected, probed and it will continue. By us. Yesterday, many were aghast that Palin's daughter would be dragged into a Presidential campaign. This morning, Team McCain drop kicked her right smack dab into the middle of this. In this thread, opinion has gone from "We should give her privacy" to "I bet we can use this to our benefit". This is exactly why some of us have been saying this was an extremely risky pick. Palin has not been vetted in any serious way and now tons of shit are going to come rolling out of the woodwork. Surprised? In a Presidential campaign? I could give a crap what her kids do. I want a President to care about National Security, doing smart things to enable the economy and follow the Constitution. I want the VP to basically stay the hell out of the way just as they have always done. What their kids do matters less to me than the scores of the English Premier Soccer League. But you are kidding yourself if you don't think that every aspect of a candidates life won't be used by both sides.

111 rockmom, Bristol Palin is NOT a celebrity.  She is accepting the consequences of her actions and growing up to deal with them.  Avoiding behavior that results in these consequences is the ideal, of course, and she is still an example of that, as well as how the choices of teens impact the entire family, not just them.

112

wouldn't call a 17-year-old a "child," or even a "CHILD," but whatever.

Of course you wouldn't.  You've yet to demonstrate any appreciation of fact.

Parents are responsible for all aspects of all their daughter's actions? You don't really believe that, do you?"

Pete, one day on the news: "Oh, my poor little 17-year-old Timmy, he takes drugs and just raped and murdered my neighbor's son, but I did the BEST I COULD, so I'm not responsible, not even a teeny tiny little bit!"

Brilliant.

She is 17. Soon to be 18. She bears the responsiblity for getting pregnant. Along with the father. No one else.

Simple.  That's BS.  No female wakes up and starts to have intercourse on their first date.  It's a gradual process, like the whole 1st-2nd-third base system of rating implies.  Bristol has had a casual attitude about sex for some time, and that goes along with upbringing.

And uh, who's to say what sort of upbringing this girl has had?  You assume that she hasn't been permitted to run around, stay out without a curfew, set her own rules.  Please cite your source for this information.

113 102 Oh yes, it's teh hypocracy!!!11!!!one!!!!cos 2π!!! Cos2∏!!! You guys are making me spit 1.5*10E-1 liters of coffee on my keyboard. Cut it out!

114 JackStraw:

The birth certificate thing was dumb, but it wasn't about Obama's kids. It was about Obama.

115

Palin has not been vetted in any serious way and now tons of shit are going to come rolling out of the woodwork. Surprised?

 

So basically you are saying Palin was not investigated by the McCain people at all? McCain knew about the pregnancy, you do realize this don't you? What is this ton of shit you refer to? Her kid, who is almost 18, got knocked up and is marrying the father and keeping the baby? If that is the worst thing about Palin, hell, I'll send them even more money.

 

116

How much do you actually know about their family?

Let's see, I know that their teenage daughter is pregnant and unmarried.

You have no idea what led to this.

I know EXACTLY what led to this.  Would you care for a diagram?

They could be great parents or not so much.

You're exactly right, but you know, great parents tend to raise teenage girls who are not pregnant.

117 rockmom, I'm a parent,too. My daughters are 23 and 19. Their Mom and I did our best to teach them to make good choices. So far, we have been successful. But, there is no known way to ensure a good outcome. You just have to persevere and keep your fingers crossed. Please do not despair or be angry with the Palins. Shit happens to any and all of us.

118

And uh, who's to say what sort of upbringing this girl has had?  You assume that she hasn't been permitted to run around, stay out without a curfew, set her own rules.  Please cite your source for this information.

 

You are the brainiac about the Palin's, you show me yours, and I'll show you mine.

119 The ;">Corner Update:

Still no denouncing of the pregnancy at the corner.nationalreview.com. Not so far. Still waiting ...

120 Masturbatin' Pete- Ok, that made me feel dirty typing that. Obama's kids are a little young for a scandal but they have been used as props throughout this campaign. If they were a little older and this had happened to one of his daughters, we on the right would be all over it like stink on shit. Do you remember the "scandal" about Chelsea Clinton going to Sidwell Friends while her parents were preaching about the public schools? Hell, it was McCain who coined the joke about Chelsea looking like her dad, Janet Reno, during the 2000 campaign. Families of politicians in today's world are part of the package. That's just the way it is and we should stop pretending its not the case.

121 The parents are responsible for her behavior.

 So, I presume, then, that you support laws that won't let minors get abortions without parental consent?  How odd, for a Leftard.

Does anyone care what "stacy" (funny name for a guy, but those Leftards are a strange group) thinks/says?

122 Jack, don't act so dour about Palin. It's a KRYMB moment, seriously.

Just in 5 minutes in the comments in the MSM article I read this in, are so many examples of ugly, sexist hatred from leftists that any person with any decency would have to feel compelled to support Palin and her family.

I hate to be this cynical about this, but her election stocks will be pushed even higher by this.

The most important thing is that we show a united front in supporting Bristol's right to privacy and defend Sarah Palin from anyone who is enough of a shitbag to attack her by attacking her daughter, and we simply cannot help but look good.

123 George Orwell:

I do like cos 2π, but I think my favorite is -(e^(-πi))

124 Bristol has had a casual attitude about sex for some time, and that goes along with upbringing. And uh, who's to say what sort of upbringing this girl has had? Apparently you are, it only takes one time to get pregnant genius. You assume that she hasn't been permitted to run around, stay out without a curfew, set her own rules. Please cite your source for this information. And you assume she has, please cite your source for this information. And no, her being pregnant isn't an adequate answer. As i pointed out earlier, it only takes one time. So feel free to tell us all how you know how she was brought up.

125 I want the VP to basically stay the hell out of the way just as they have always done. What their kids do matters less to me than the scores of the English Premier Soccer League. But you are kidding yourself if you don't think that every aspect of a candidates life won't be used by both sides. I think I agree with you, really. But I think any of the front runner VP choices were risky in their own ways. Even Pawlenty, risky because of being such a cipher and generating little excitement. I only think it would have helped if this were known before the pick. BTW the Obastard birth certificate thing was pretty silly stuff. What I don't find silly are the self-confessed behaviors of certain adults who spent, oh I dunno, twenty years giving money to and at the feet of a racist bigot preacher. And now said certain adults are permitted to just say "Oh, never mind." Meanwhile said adult sends UofC Medical Center boxcars of fresh public money, and wifey of said certain adult gets a fat raise to the $300K stratosphere, from the same institution... But it's them fucking Godbags who are the hypocrites. So it goes!

126 My father, who is both a "Christianist" (which I hear is the cool term to use these days) and possibly the most cynical person ever when it comes to politicians, just shrugged and said, "Shows she has problems just like the rest of us".  Then he promptly returned to eating his bacon cheeseburger.

I think this will be OK.

127 JackStraw:

Do you remember the "scandal" about Chelsea Clinton going to Sidwell Friends while her parents were preaching about the public schools?

That's about her parents' direct hypocrisy, not really about Chelsea per se.

Hell, it was McCain who coined the joke about Chelsea looking like her dad, Janet Reno, during the 2000 campaign.

That was wrong. It was also eight years ago, and the Clintons are out of this campaign.

128 >>McCain knew about the pregnancy, you do realize this don't you? No, I don't know this and neither do you. We know that McCain said he did, what else would he say? "I am shocked, shocked I tell you to hear of this news!" Yea, that would have played well. None of us know crap about this woman compared to every other candidate in this race. McCain met this woman twice before he offered her the job. This from the guy who famously only likes to surround himself with people he knows and trusts. In today's world of 8x25 media, the internet, blogs, etc., etc., it is beyond risky to drop somebody into the race 2 months before the election. Shit will come out. Shit always comes out. And if there isn't time for the public to absorb it, deal with it and move on then it could sink McCain.

129 I do like cos 2π, but I think my favorite is -(e^(-πi)) Oh yeah? Well, I'll see your -(e^(-πi)), and raise you one inaccessible cardinal number... Goddamn it, I can't find unicode for aleph-null! See you at the Hilbert Hotel.

130

You're exactly right, but you know, great parents tend to raise teenage girls who are not pregnant.

I wish that were true. I really do. Life is not that simple. I've known quite a few people who got pregnant as teens and there is no commonality about their parents at all.

 

131

129 >>McCain knew about the pregnancy, you do realize this don't you?

"No, I don't know this and neither do you. We know that McCain said he did, what else would he say?"

 

So McCain and his people are lying now? Gosh, you must be really in the know with the McCain people. Can you ask him for me why he is favor of amnesty for illegal aliens?

132 I've been trying to think of any family I know who hasn't dealt with a teen age pregnancy, So far, I've got zero. Maybe that says more about the people I hang out with more than anything else, but I think what it boils down to is that this situation is going to speak more to the average American family, not negatively, but by casting the Palins as a family dealing positively with something that many, many families have had to deal with themselves.

133 Too Much  .. Peter puller,  Trig has Downs..  Does not mean mental problems.
Could.. but not "must"

Still, a Dick thing to say..

Catman

134 Joaquintall wrote: "Seems Palin should be keeping an eye out for who's goosing her kid instead of shooting defenseless mooses with the NRA!" The plural of "moose" is "meese." Fucking dickhead loser troll cocksucker (DRINK!)

135

You are the brainiac about the Palin's, you show me yours, and I'll show you mine.

Sure.  First thing's first; please replicate every statement I have made that indicates I have ever claimed to an expert on the Palins.  Include specific quotes.  And, when you don't find any -- because there are none -- feel free to join Pete in his hobby, this time in a literal sense rather than rendering it by bandwidth.

I have stated that having a pregnant and unmarried teen in the family is dysfunctional family territory.  You disagree?  I don't give a turd.  Maybe knocked-up teens are normal in your family.  Who knows or cares.

So, I presume, then, that you support laws that won't let minors get abortions without parental consent? 

I am in full support of parental notification.

How odd, for a Leftard.

I'm a constructionist, you choked up hairball.  I've been posting here for years.

136 The Corner Update:

Flash: the National Review's Kathryn Jean Lopez is now denouncing ... that's right I said denouncing some dimwitted bimbo dumbass Planned Parenthood.

That is all.

137 Very interesting take, from Althouse, spotted by HotAir: MadisonMan said: I think the way to support a child through a pregnancy is to be there for them, not to embark on a national campaign -- sure, it's "only" 2 months -- that will shine the spotlight on the child. Anyway, that would be my reaction as a parent. Oh, that looks like a meme. Sarah Palin must stay home with her special needs baby. Sarah Palin must stay home with her about-to-be-married, pregnant daughter. Ladies: Put your career on hold until everything in you're family stops happening. I know, MM is a man and he's saying he'd stay home too, but would he? Would a man forgo his career to be there for a family member who is experiencing an important life transition? Remember when John Edwards decided to go on with his campaign after his wife got a diagnosis of inoperable cancer? Now, I think Elizabeth Edwards was probably excited about the campaign and wanted to go on with it. In that light, why are you assuming that Bristol Palin isn't excited about her mother's campaign? Unlike Elizabeth Edwards, Bristol is not facing her last days. She's just starting out -- all caught up in life. Presumably, she's intense and positive about her pro-life beliefs, her love for the baby's father, her impending wedding, and the new baby on the way. I imagine her eager to run around with the campaign, spreading the pro-life message to young people. Why should you think she would prefer to mope around the house, feeling ashamed, absorbing maternal comforting? On the campaign trail, she will be a loved and praised pro-life heroine, and she -- and her mother -- are likely to convert others to the pro-life side, with their glamorous and very positive image. Pro-choicers beware.

138

I wish that were true. I really do. Life is not that simple. I've known quite a few people who got pregnant as teens and there is no commonality about their parents at all.

...except for them not being very good ones.  And you know, if they were decent parents they wouldn't be bragging about the fabulous job they did raising their pregnant daughters.

139

Jack,

You are a little discombobulated, IMO.  Yes, shit will come out.  On anybody.  You choose your running mate in part based on what the shit that comes out on them will be.

So far, on Palin, we've got:

1. Pregnant daughter, who is keeping the baby and getting married.

2. Husband had a DUI in the 1980s.

3. She got on a plane and flew home when she discovered she would be giving birth soon.

4. That laughably retarded "Is Trig really her kid" smear.

Well, fuck me, we're sunk.

140

I'm a constructionist, you choked up hairball.  I've been posting here for years.

 

 

You sound like Andrea Mitchell to me. Hope you don't act like her.

141

You sound like Andrea Mitchell to me. Hope you don't act like her.

Come now, you lost an argument, it's not like I killed your dog/boyfriend.  There's no need to get nasty.

142 Brilliant snark from Herr Goldstein: Lesson: teenage sex is good and shouldn’t be discouraged provided we have a mechanism to kill off whatever we call that thing inside that acts as a “punishment.” I mean, who knew it would be the left who saw sin growing in a young woman’s womb? First, Marcotte proves to be a Calvinist — and now the argument of the left appeals to hardcore Catholicism? Wow. Strange days, indeed. Wonder how the product of a single mom, Barry O!, will treat this shameless wilderness hussy…?

143

OK, now I have calmed down a little.

Gov. Palin was very private about her own pregnancy and I would imagine she had hoped to be private about this one.  I guess if I am angry, I am angry about the a-holes who fanned the rumors until Gov. Palin was forced to announce Bristol's pregnancy.

144 I like the Cantor Set. Even better, I like the Cantor function, which increases only on the cantor set. It has a derivative of zero almost everywhere (cantor set has lebesgue measure zero), is continuous, and increases from 0 to 1. Pretty nifty.

145

Ironic, is it not, that the supposedly intolerant Christianists are forgiving and supportive of young Ms. Palin, is it not?

/The Hypocrisy!

146 So far, on Palin, we've got You forgot to add that we now know she was for the bridge to nowhere before she was against it and she took the $400 million in pork anyway. You also forgot to add that its been 3 days over the Labor Day weekend. I'm glad you're confident there is nothing else coming. I'm not. The first rule of picking a VP is 1) Do no harm. This is why virtually everyone has picked a known quantity since the modern day selection process began. This pick is hugely risky. I hope you are right.

147 George Orwell:

Trig identites work great!
cos^2 x + sin^2 x

Beyond that it gets hard, though. I've tried to do limits of functions, but that's always a terrible mess:
lim (x -> 0) (sin x)/x

I don't think there's unicode for Aleph numbers. Alas!
(2^Aleph-null)/(Aleph-one)

148 Okay, OT, but I am amazed at the breadth of knowledge that leaks out on this blog. I'm no mathematician, but I've read a great layman's book on infinities by Rudy Rucker, "Infinity and the Mind." A real trip, and an endless one, heh heh...

149 Poor girl, punished with a baby...

-J

150 The K-Lo Update:

Kathryn Jean Lopez:
In choosing a young conservative like Palin, John McCain acknowledges that there is a whole movement, a key component in the Republican party’s base, that he does not well represent on his own — and that there is a whole segment of the population that listens to Five for Fighting and gets their news online and is married to their high-school sweetheart and are struggling to balance it all, while enjoying every minute of it. If my conversations this past weekend in the Twin Cities are any indication, the choice of Sarah Palin isn’t insulting identity politics, but clever reality politics.

Because I want to give back to the moronoshpere so you don't have to go read it for yourself.
f.

Who is Five for Fighting?

151 The problem I have is this is a family values person. This goes right to Obama about unwanted pregnancies. Also there are rumors that her daughter was into drugs and alcohol during this. I personally don't care if a 17 year old gets pregnant but it is my business when the veep nominee is her mom. I want to know who the father is. I want to know why she wasn't in school 4-5 months. why she got in a car accident during this time. Why her mom flew 12 hours to give birth in a small hospital after going into labor even though she claims she new it was going to be a down syndrum baby. There are so many questions just on this subject alone it shows that McCain didn't vet her. Also it shows how arrogant she is. She knew that her daughter who was not of age was pregnant and agreed to bring her into the public eye. I feel sorry for her, I mean its bad enough that she got pregnant and apparently has had problems with drugs and alcohol but now she has to be brought into the public eye because her mom things she is important enough to be a heartbeat away, and the one thing she is known for is family values. I mean come on.

Then there is troopergate. Its common knowledge that she tried to get her ex-bro-in-law fired and then when she couldn't she fired the guy that wouldn't do it. Then she lied about it.

then there is the bridge to nowhere. There are newspaper clips (not secret tapes or secret meetings but public newspaper quotes) saying that she supported it until she found out that it would cost the state money but when the feds were going to pay for it she didn't care.

Not to mention the fact that she is on the radio laughing and not disputing when the radio show she was on was trashing a state senator calling her a cancer (she had beat cancer).....

152

The age of consent is defined as 16 years old, according to Alaska statutory rape laws. If a person who is at least 18 years old engages in sexual activity with a person who is 16 years old or younger, he or she will be charged with sexual abuse of a minor in the first degree. This charge is a felony in Alaska. And remember, it does not matter if you did not force or threaten the other person into performing this sexual act with you. It is still a crime under Alaska statutory rape laws.

Any person who is 16 years old or older who has sexual intercourse with a minor who is 13-, 14-, or 15-years-old will be charged with sexual abuse of a minor in the second degree. Again, this charge is also a felony.

You can also be charged with a felony – sexual abuse in the third degree – if you are at least 16 years old and you have sex with anyone who is age 13-15, or if the person is a minor at least three years younger than you. In addition, Alaska statutory rape laws declare that anyone who is 18 years old or older who has sex with a person who is 16 or 17, or who is at least three years younger than the offender, can be charged with sexual abuse in the third degree. This is also a felony.

Alaska statutory rape laws carry punishments that include imprisonment and fines.

153

I'm glad you're confident there is nothing else coming. I'm not.

Me, neither.

This pick is hugely risky.

Ditto.

 

154

Obama's kids are a little young for a scandal but they have been used as props throughout this campaign. If they were a little older and this had happened to one of his daughters, we on the right would be all over it like stink on shit.

That is the unfortunate truth from JackStraw once again. 

More dirt will be dredged up/made up. That's the nature of a campaign.  All we can do is stick with the truth, hoping that the truth doesn't cause too much damage.

155 I wish Gabe would go away and never come back, lawyer scumbag

156 moronoshpere

That is the correct spelling.

157

My mother got pregent at age 17.  My father married my mother.  My mother carried my sister to term.   She had me 2 years later.   My mother and father just celebrated their 42th wedding anniversity.  they have had a happy marriage and have had many joys and sorrows in their lives like other family.   Having a baby at 17 is not a curse.   If my mother would have listened to BHO neither my sister nor I would be on this earth.  My mother and father would not have had the joy of their daughter for the last 42 years.  

My vote for McCain/PAlIN just was secured.     

 

  

158 (1) Gov. Palin supports abstinence-only education [is that true? --ed.], and somehow this makes her a hypocrite.
(2) If she can't keep her own daughter from fucking around, how's she going to run the country. SHE'S A BAD MOTHER!!1!!111!cos2pi!!!
(3) I question the timing!
(4) The Fundies and Jesustards are going to HATE her now. They advocate STONING women who have sex outside of marriage, and if they don't stone Bristol, they're teh hypocrites!!!!eleventy!!!2!!! Just like they hate her for participating in a beauty pageant and showing a little leg!!!111!!one!!!two!!!

Precisely, my self-abusing brother. Spot on. It took DKos about 5 minutes to come up with the "Bristol Palin should've had real sex-ed and used a condom!" meme. How, exactly, do they know she didn't have a condom that just didn't work? But, they would not understand any woman who makes a bad decision and takes responsibility for it rather than rushing off to Planned Barrenhood to suck her baby's brains out.

I'm closer than I've ever been in my life to feeling real, visceral hatred for the Left. God help us all.

159 JackStraw, meet Joe.

160 May I humbly suggest we keep our eyes on the ball here? Why fret over the not-so-uncommon behavior of the VP candidate's daughter when we have a POTUS candidate on the Left who spent TWENTY YEARS as an adult praising a racist anti-American preacher, gave him thousands of dollars, had him married, had him baptize his kids, listened to his tapes to study his delivery and oratory, named one of his books after said bigot's favorite phrases? And we have Ayers who helped launch his first big campaign, Rezko his slumlord buddy, and Obama's cronies getting contracts from the government at his behest, his wifey getting payola in the form of a ridiculous raise after her employer got state funds from Obama, his use of disqualification tactics to win elections, his empty-headedness on the 57 states and the breathalyzers for asthma and the instant solution to gas prices, proper tire inflation, and on and on... In the big picture, if anyone can find the GOP ticket lacking on account of this Bristol situation, yet be just fine with St. Barry O'Guiltwhite's past, then someone is in need of a serious neurological examination.

161 Obama Fun Facts: 

Barry Obama was left to die on a gurney in a linen closet, but his typical white racist grandparents salvaged his thankless ass so that he could become the Messiah!

"True story."

162 Very interesting take, from Althouse, spotted by HotAir: MadisonMan said: I think the way to support a child through a pregnancy is to be there for them, not to embark on a national campaign -- sure, it's "only" 2 months -- that will shine the spotlight on the child. Anyway, that would be my reaction as a parent. Oh, that looks like a meme. It's a meme allright (sorry for the kos link, last one i promise) - The fact is Sarah Palin had NO RIGHT accepting the offer to be VP -- she has a teenage daughter who is pregnant, she has 4 other children - including one with special needs -- a child with Down's Syndrome requires a lot of attention and time and energy - from BOTH PARENTS - she should not be traipsing off to cabinet meetings and state funerals while dumping the 5 kids on the lap of her husband. Here's the best part - This is the worst crime of it all -- the frigging whole campaign of mccain should be tossed in jail for endangering a minor I find his/her lack of self awareness amusing.

163 The Corner Update:

Flash: The denouncing, .... that's right I said denouncing of PP is now removed from the corner.nationalreview.com. Its gone!

That is all.

164 How nice that Gov. Palin knew about her daughter's pregnancy and decided to accept VP nomination. "Hey, Bristol, you think having a baby at 16 will be hard. How about I turn the entire country's ire on you?" What mother would do that to her daughter. You gotta question Palin's judgment. That is just mean to parade her daughter through the mud for her own opportunity.

165

Valued Val

 

You are an idiot

166 I'm closer than I've ever been in my life to feeling real, visceral hatred for the Left. God help us all.

I can't look at their crap. It fills me with rage, and it's just not healthy to have that kind of anger inside me. Anger is one of the seven deadly sins for a reason.

Of course, self-abuse is also a sin, but I'm working on that. Poorly.

167 I think Althouse was pointing out the Hypocrisy™!1!! of criticizing Palin on account of her family's situation, she just forgot the "/sarcasm" tag: Sarah Palin must stay home with her about-to-be-married, pregnant daughter. Ladies: Put your career on hold until everything in you’re family stops happening… Would a man forgo his career to be there for a family member who is experiencing an important life transition? In other words, are the Leftards saying women can't have it all? Bring it on.

168 Well, this calls into question the kind of "family values" she would bring to the White House -- having a teenage daughter that got knocked up by an 8th grader.  Clearly, those hard-core Christian values were not at play in the Palin household. What was McCain thinking?  I guess it locks up the Alaska white trash vote. 

169 god you people a pathetic leave them alone their is nothing wrong with her being pregnant I'm 21 with a 2yo daughter and I'm fine and any one of you jack asses who think she should kill that baby should burn in hell!!!!!!

170

Centreparkguy

 

another idiot heard from.

 

171 Hey Pete, if you can lay off the monkey-spankin' for a second, I'm distinctly noting that perhaps there is an upside to this thing... We all saw how the Leftards came unglued at the Palin pick, and if you make your enemies incensed, you must be doing something right. The Bristol situation seems to have redoubled the vitriol and hatred from Moonbat Mordor. Again, if it makes them sprout like vile weeds, even on this blog, perhaps we're doing something right... Think I'll try some of that monkey-spankin' myself, maybe for 10E8 microseconds or so.

172 I'm over it (see #73) now.  Fuck anyone who tries to attack the Palins over this.  We can take 'em.

173 Nice, McCain.  What kind of soldier uses a pregnant 17-year-old girl as a political shield?  You knew what this was going to do, how it would divert attention away from your policies.  You are throwing Bristol under the bus.

174 Wow the leftist idiots are out in full force still I see. You guys stink of fear, to quote Hyde.

175

Lucas

 

Yet another Idiot heard from.  when did this board become infested with idiots?

176

Jeff B

 

I'm with you.   Time to protect our women it would seem.  

177 A mistake made by two people that an innocent third party won't have to die for to make right?

I've got no problem with that.

178

Lucas: Who's using the Palin family for political purposes?

(because I can) zOMG 111!1 -exp(i*pi)

179

Apparently you are, it only takes one time to get pregnant genius.

Wipe your drool off your monitor, please, it's inhibiting your reading skills.  You've missed a LOT that was said.

And you assume she has, please cite your source for this information. And no, her being pregnant isn't an adequate answer.

Yes, it is. Just because you declare it otherwise doesn't change the fact.  I've got that fact backing up my opinion, and you have...well, not a dang thing.  Oh, okay, you have some cuddly family photos and public statements likely scripted.  Build your house on THAT.  Shades of the Algonquin Round Table is what we have here.

As i pointed out earlier, it only takes one time.

I know, that was MASTERFUL!  Wholly irrelevant, but masterful.

So feel free to tell us all how you know how she was brought up.

YAY, straw man!  That took a little longer than expected.

Like I've already said, if you are so amazingly stupid to believe that a child's pregnancy isn't the responsibility of the parents, I don't give a turd.  Not a single one.

180 Barbelle, Do you think only bad parents face this situation?

181

eman, if they're Republican then they're bad parents by definition. They're bad everything. I suspect they don't even have souls.

/s

182 Is Barbelle a troll, a moby?

183 Catfish Whisker:

You are an idiot.

Parents can't control which pieces of their advice their children follow.

184 Eman, that's just too funny.  I had to change my ID recently.

185 Wipe your drool off your monitor, please, it's inhibiting your reading skills. You've missed a LOT that was said. Come now, you lost an argument, it's not like I killed your dog/boyfriend. There's no need to get nasty. Just because you declare it otherwise doesn't change the fact. Oh, the irony. I know, that was MASTERFUL! Wholly irrelevant, but masterful. What? You think that pointing out a biological fact that completely undercuts your premise that any girl who gets pregnant is a slut who had to have been raised by horrible parents is irrelevant? Shocking. So feel free to tell us all how you know how she was brought up. YAY, straw man! From your comment at 1:58 - Bristol has had a casual attitude about sex for some time, and that goes along with upbringing. Like I've already said, if you are so amazingly stupid to believe that a child's pregnancy isn't the responsibility of the parents, I don't give a turd. Not a single one. Yeah, we can tell you don't care by the way you keep commenting and telling anyone who dares to disagree with your profound insight stupid.

186

Gov. Palin was very private about her own pregnancy and I would imagine she had hoped to be private about this one.  I guess if I am angry, I am angry about the a-holes who fanned the rumors until Gov. Palin was forced to announce Bristol's pregnancy.

The a-hole McOldfart is the one that fanned the rumors.  He should have just left this family alone instead of making his hasty, last-minute decision.  It's only going to get worse for Bristol and Eli if Sarah accepts the nomination.  These young teens deserve better.

187
Is Barbelle a troll, a moby?

A Google search on the hash code (qF8q3) at http://minx.cc gives us a second AOS identity for him/her: bbeck.

FWIW.

188 Barbelle, Please, answer my question.

189 bbeck? The bbeck?

190

bbeck?

The bbeck?

That's what I got on my Google search. Check out the Super Bowl Poetry Contest Results! thread.

I'm no Intarweb detective but bbeck's hash code matches Barbelle's.

191 It was just a big misunderstanding When Governor Palin said "Drill!" Her daughter obeyed And quickly got laid But forgot her birthcontrol pill.

192

Do you think only bad parents face this situation?

Define "bad parent."

193

Yes, it's me.  I had to shed my real name for personal reasons, so please let's just drop that.

And eman, you KNOW I'll answer whatever questions I get.

194

Oh, my.  Perhaps this really won't play well with the social cons.  I mean we have all these new commenters here like joe and bob and lisa and steve who clearly bothered by this pregnancy.

195

. . . you KNOW I'll answer whatever questions I get.

How did you grow up to be such a stupid cocksucker?

Gonna blame it on your parents?

196

Jackstraw -  The first rule of picking a VP is 1) Do no harm. This is why virtually everyone has picked a known quantity since the modern day selection process began ....

And that is applicable in this case, how?

The extent of the problem McCain faced made actually following that generally admirable precept an impossibility. All the known veep choices under public discussion (prior to announcing Palin) were going to create "harm" of one sort or another, weren't they?

And unless there's some science of precognition that is actually true that's floatin' around someplace, there's absolutely no way other than 20/20 hindsight and some kind of equally unknown multi-verse viewer to tell which pick would have resulted in the least harm. Talkin' about teh what-ifs and buck will ...crap, no that's not enough to buy a cuppa joe these days.

But there's 7 million and growing reasons - starting last week - why Palin maybe was the "least" harm. That is easily fact-checked. A lot of us are approving of her in the one way that even a politician understands: with our - now - open pocketbooks.

And any of the other choices I've heard bandied about (and I do pay attention), and I - and apparently quite a few others - would have stayed home. But her story has created a buzz out in the hustings that has made quite a few of us ...like, "the base" ...show some actual enthusiasm, and in a manner and for a reason that seemingly originally escaped those pussys at NRO (save Steyn ...and granted that they were blind-sided by her, and the positive effect it's had on the base).

I like Palin, and the conservatism that I see in evident in her story. And her being an outsider: bonus. And her being smart and charming and the rest: gravy.

...and this little contretemps? like I've said twice: none of my effin' business. Nor no one else's either.

So the only real "answer" to whether this, that, or the other actually hurt McCain at this point ...is "we'll see".

And I give not a fuck what the smarmy leftards in the "reality based" community think and say: they hate us anyway. Haters. Fuck 'em.

Ditto for the Mainstream Media cluebats, where I've just heard for the nth fricking time today about this non-issue.

But kudos to Obama: who just reiterated "...the families are off-limits".

 

197 Define "bad parent." You are being evasive.

198 Here's another demographic for POW/WOW.  Men who love their wife and daughters.  I have been totally blown away by Sarah and Todd, and their beautiful family.  They have my support and love forever. 

199

Teenagers have sex.  They think about sex, they enjoy sex.  Some wait for marriage and some don't.  Some people  think that 18 year olds are old enough to vote, to fight for our country, to drive a car, to have credit cards, to go off on their own to college  yet for some reason some of those people think that an 18 year old is not able to have a baby?  

 

18 is a wonderful age to start a family in almost all ways except financial.  

200 The only problem can see with this is if the father is 20-something. To me, marrying the girl cancels out the statutory rape problem. Others may not see it that way. 

201

How did you grow up to be such a stupid cocksucker?

Gonna blame it on your parents?

No, but I'm sure going to blame your Daddy provided you know who it is.  Run along now, and let the grownups discuss.

You are being evasive.

Hardly.  We have to esablish a common definition in order to discuss it.  So go ahead.

 

202 The pregnancy is punishment for having sex without a condom. This is a prime example of why parents should talk to their kids about sex.

203

Oh, the irony.

Hey, he's the one who flinched, Sweetie.  That ain't irony.  Look it up.

What? You think that pointing out a biological fact that completely undercuts your premise that any girl who gets pregnant is a slut who had to have been raised by horrible parents is irrelevant? Shocking.

Hmm, you may think those are gloves coming off, but really, you should remove the blinders.

Bristol has had a casual attitude about sex for some time, and that goes along with upbringing.

Yes, I did say that. And?

Yeah, we can tell you don't care by the way you keep commenting and telling anyone who dares to disagree with your profound insight stupid.

Do you really BLAME me?  Look how stupid your response was.  I've been doing this for a LONG time pal, I can recognize a Lost Cause pretty fast and don't waste my time trying to reason with those who can't be reasoned with.

204 Negative. If you find the word "bad" too stifling, try incompetant or inattentive or lazy or hypocritical or self-absorbed or cynical or negligent. You can answer the question without my help.

205 davis,br >>And that is applicable in this case, how? I've said it pretty clearly but I'll say it again. We. Don't. Know. Shit. About. Her. Look at how much we have learned in the first 3 days. Some of it is troubling, her nuancing of her position on pork, some is potentially troubling, trooper gate and some like her daughter are slimy and the political implications are unknowable at this point. This is why nobody picks an unknown for VP. Does the name Thomas Eagleton ring a bell? All the big names and fully vetted people like Kennedy, Mondale and Humphrey turned McGovern down and he went with a little known senator from MO and 2 weeks later, after reports of his hospitalization surfaced, Eagleton was out and McGovern was toast. Yes, all of the other candidates had issues but we know about them. That is the whole point. McCain himself should know this better than anyone. Last summer, his candidacy was almost over but he had time to overcome his issues with the public and get back in enough people's good graces to get their vote. There is no time for a comeback for Palin if a serious issue comes out. We have two months till the election and as we all know, perception often trumps reality. I hope that there is nothing more to come out but I am skeptical. Oh, and it just came over the news, Palin just hired a lawyer to represent her in trooper gate.

206 No, but I'm sure going to blame your Daddy provided you know who it is.

Posted by: Barbelle at September 01, 2008 05:15 PM (qF8q3)

". . . your Daddy . . ."

Go away. You belong on Usenet, where mouthbreathers  cheer your style of "wit".

207

djjohanf

 

yet another idiot.  condems work some of the time.  Birth Control pills only work 98% of the time.   A baby is not a curse you left wing nutcase.  A baby is a gift.   You assine idiot.   Is teen pregnecy good?  No because of money.  If the money is there an 18 year old having a child is not bad far from it "destroying" the woman's life it brings a new deminsion and a new start to the next leg of her life. 

 

True she won't be able to go party her ass off in college and fuck around and do the drugs etc.   but she can still get an education, can still have a family, can still do 80% of what other 18 tear olds are doing. 

 

How do you know she didn't want to have a child?   Maybe her and her future husband want this child.  Maybe it wasn't an accident.   Maybe they planned this so they could get married at a young age

208 She is 17, so statutory rape is not an issue. (15 gets you 20.)

And what baby, what child? She is carrying tissue, not an unborn baby, just tissue.

As the father of a college age daughter, her getting pregnant before getting married, is my worst fear.

209

I know its common, and i have 2 daughters, but to be honest if theyre fucking around and getting preggers at 17 ill be devastated (their 4 and 2 now)

Hope my threats work

 

210

Negative.

If you find the word "bad" too stifling, try incompetant or inattentive or lazy or hypocritical or self-absorbed or cynical or negligent.

You can answer the question without my help.

I don't need your HELP, Eman, I need your DEFINITION.  See, the answer can be a simple "Yes" Or "No" depending upon what you mean.  I am merely attempting to establish what you mean by bad -- or incompetent, or inattentive, or lazy, or hypocritical, or self-absorbed, or cynical, or negligent -- parents.

What you don't like is the fact that I am requesting a definition up front because, once it's given, I can probably yield an unequivocal answer that you can't argue with.  If however, you leave the question vague and I answer, you can then play word games and twist my response into something I didn't say.  It's a standard tactic.

I don't think my request in unreasonable, to ask for clarification on a posed question that leaves open too much room for interpretation.

211

Go away. You belong on Usenet, where mouthbreathers  cheer your style of "wit".

You thought I was being witty?  No seriously, Kid, do what you're told.

212

And what baby, what child? She is carrying tissue, not an unborn baby, just tissue.

As the father of a college age daughter, her getting pregnant before getting married, is my worst fear.

Is that you, Barry O?

Let us know when that undifferentiated mass of tissue -- which, curiously, springs forth from the uterus as a human being and not a baked potato, 100% of the time -- becomes a "baby" in your estimation, OK?

The girl is five months pregnant, pal.  That's a "baby" no matter how you want to dismiss it.  Anyone who could see an ultrasound at five months and deny the humanity of the kid is depraved.

213

Barbella? - You're one of the legends around here. But this don't seem like one of your better days or better arguments.

If you have some text or theory or holy writ  or something that you're referring to that says that every teenage pregnancy is absolutely the result of bad parenting (and not bad choices by said teen) - presumably because human teenage children are little programmable robots that were-or-are subject to rigid rules of environmentally proscribed behaviour that "good parents" can easily provide for (and I can posit no other theory of behaviour that would support that thesis) - I'd be really, really interested in a link to that little gem of parenting advice and direction. Because somehow it has so far escaped me.

I for sure hope that theory  ALSO includes why children in BAD homes end up making GOOD choices ...after all, good science is falsifiable science (note: "falsifiable" doesn't mean false ...think of it as meaning testable or verifiable, if you that makes more sense to getting your arms around the concept ...and I'm not including you Barbella).

Because in my experience (and dearie, I got teh bunches at this point), children past the Hormonal Divide of teen-dom are a crap shoot when it comes to what personal and life choices the little darlin's are going to make when their parents aren't looking, "in the instant". Good kids can make bad choices. Bad kids can do the right thing. And that observation includes whether I think the parents were "good", "bad", "indifferent", "terrible", "devout", "religious", "rigid", "loose", or what-the-hell-ever.

The point I'm making is that in this case, it's just as absurd to say that teen pregancy is evidence of "bad parenting" as it would be to say there's evidence of the reverse by the lack thereof. Sometimes (as a parent) you get lucky. Sometimes crap happens. You deal with it as best you can as it arises.

And as far as exchanging "bad parenting" with "parental responsibility" goes ...hell, sounds like they're doing what good parents do (and as the song goes) "...making the most of a bad situation, guess I'd do the same if it were me."

...said with all due respect.

214 You thought I was being witty?

See: "scare quotes", Mr. Klown.

215 Barbelle, I have no ulterior motives. My question was straightforward. Recall your earlier posts where you voiced a strong opinion about the quality of the Palins as parents. But, I'll rephrase my question. What do you think Bristol's pregnancy indicates about Bristol's parents?

216

Good luck with barbelle successfully arguing to the several million single-moms out there that  they are sluts.

Good luck with barbelle successfully arguing to middle-age Hillary supporters, many of them mothers to such unwed moms, that (a) their daughters are sluts and (b) they, the moms, were "bad" parents in "letting" them get pregnant.

Yeah, those arguments will really, really fly!!!  LOL.

Especially since (according to Time magazine) Obama's mom was 3-months pregnant when she married Barack, Sr.    Barbelle, you think Barack thinks of his mom as a slut?

Also, I'm wondering if bbeck/barbelle isn't the vainglorious and fatuous billy beck of Usenet, a cretin who continually offered loaded questions or those that assumed what they had not yet proven.  He too mistakenly thought himself a Master of Logic

Wouldn't surprise me. barbelle is no different here.

217 Ace, back me up.

Posted by: Masturbatin' Pete

Does he need to wear a condom?

218

Expect this to get lots of play, seen at HotAir: Todd Palin, DUI 1986 Look, if CBN reports this it's probably now fair game for the Leftards. I'm telling you, it's time to dredge up every pecadillo in Biden's family's life. If this is how they want to play it, then let's play it that way.

Let them bring it.  The guy on their undercard is a serial plagiarizer with a penchant for making some of the dumbest, most insulting, most dishonest statements in a modern political environment characterized by those very types of statements.  And how many parole officers does Slojoe keep on speed-dial so that his kids have play-dates on the weekend?

And Barry O's smears write themselves.  Affirmative action flunky, no professional or political accomplishments of any kind, tied to the hip of the most corrupt political machine in the nation, and counts among his most important and influential friends and political allies terrorists, militant anti-American racists, and organized criminals.

But at least they've got a 22-year-old DUI and a 17-year-old's pregnancy courtesy of her soon-to-be husband.

Roll with it, dumbasses.  Pretty please.  Watching you dipshits pretend that the real America (i.e. the one outside of the carefully constructed and meticulously reinforced group psychosis you call your "community") is anywhere near the bizarro retardland that you stereotype it to be is the #1 reason you shitheads are despised by everyone with even the vaguest sense of decency.

Smell that November failure yet, lefties?  Brings back old memories, don't it?  Old, painful, searing, and hilarious memories.

219 Uh, guys. Barbelle is a 1) a woman and 2) a long time commenter here. She is not a troll just because you don't agree with her. She and I have had a few tussles but I can tell you she always argues her beliefs in good faith. She has always had strong opinions and argues them well. If you think you are going to intimidate her by snarking at her, put on your asbestos underwear.

220 "Posted by: JoaquinTall at September 01, 2008 08:42 AM (TsipR)"

OH, go blow it out your ass, you pompous condescending bitch.  I suspect the windows of your glass house have been duct taped together so many times it looks like a fricken' spider web. 

221

But this don't seem like one of your better days or better arguments.

Pfft, I just needed some better foils.

The point I'm making is that in this case, it's just as absurd to say that teen pregancy is evidence of "bad parenting" as it would be to say there's evidence of the reverse by the lack thereof.

So you're saying there's no correlation between bad parenting and teen pregnancy?  I would disagree in that the better the parenting, the less the opportunity for teen pregnancy to occur.  There's a definite connection between the two.

Sometimes (as a parent) you get lucky. Sometimes crap happens. You deal with it as best you can as it arises.

Getting kids out of their teenage years without getting kcocked up just isn't a function of luck.  If it were, then what is the point of parenting at all? 

See: "scare quotes", Mr. Klown.

Uh, what?

What do you think Bristol's pregnancy indicates about Bristol's parents?

Shoot, that's not a Yes or No.  I think it indicates a real possibility that they screwed up and permitted their child more leeway than they should have, believing her to be more responsible than she actually was.  Hence -- as was my original point for those of you playing along -- they share some of the responsibility.  You can argue and say that "even with boundaries blah blah blah good parents blah blah crap happens" but your argument refers far more to the Exception than the Rule.

Good parenting can still lead to Crap Happening, and I would state that, in the case of teen pregnancy, Crap Happening is rare.  Bad parenting is far more likely to lead to Crap Happening.  And here, we see Crap Happened.  Why is it so very odd to consider the Crap springing from the more likely reason?

222

Uh, guys. Barbelle is a 1) a woman and 2) a long time commenter here. She is not a troll just because you don't agree with her. She and I have had a few tussles but I can tell you she always argues her beliefs in good faith.

Thank you, Jack, I appreciate that.

She has always had strong opinions and argues them well. If you think you are going to intimidate her by snarking at her, put on your asbestos underwear.

I'd rather not pollute Ace's site with posters who couldn't flame if they had Johnny Storm on their side.

223 Pete, how do you high-level mathematics with all that masturbating going on?

224 Thank you, Barbelle, for answering my question. The Palins may be fucked-up parents, but Bristol's pregnancy is not enough to prove that or to suggest it is likely. IMHO

225 >>Thank you, Jack, I appreciate that. No worries. Nice to see you again.

226 Two teenagers got horny and now there's a baby? Holy Shit! That's gotta be the news scoop of the year. Come on down and get yer Pulitzer. There's a vending machine in the employee cafeteria at the Washington Post that spits them out like a Pez dispenser.

227

The Palins may be fucked-up parents, but Bristol's pregnancy is not enough to prove that or to suggest it is likely.

IMHO

Yeah, SURE it's humble.

Just kidding.

Good, bad...it still isn't a reflection of Palin's ability to govern.

No worries. Nice to see you again.

Thanks, and you.  I'm hanging around because I'm still trying to find a reason to vote for McCain.

228 The "H" wasn't for humble, it was for hysterical.

229 "Congratulations?" For what, exactly? An unplanned pregnancy? A shotgun marriage at 17? Most of us are not fully formed people at 17, and are not in the position to make life-altering, permanent decisions. This girl will miss the opportunity to go to college, grow up, and figure out who she is. Instead, she'll be saddled with a kid. Pathetic. Do we really want this trailer trash in office?

230

It is unfortunate but like so many families the mistakes of teens are born by the entire family.  Clearly Bristol Palin needs counceling, but that has no bearing on Sarah's ability to lead.  My only prayer is for Sarah to come clean with the American public and admit that Bristol is the mother of the first child (Obviously) and that the daughter is two to three months along now.  The American people can take and handle the truth, but do require honesty.  I think Sarah will weather this storm but she must be honest.  We can't find out through a leak on November first that Bristol is Trig's mom.  Let us know now so we can adjust.  I pray for the family and know this must be difficult.  I hope this strengthens her candacy and faith as a Christian. 

 

Bill

231 >>are you "protecting" a putative female? No. I was protecting you. Barbelle does not need any protecting by me or anyone else. But if you want to continue to assert that Barbelle is a guy from Usenet instead of a woman who's been around here about as long as anyone, have at it.

232 Is it true that the dad is in 8th grade?

233 Who knows - maybe we will find out next that Bristol’s baby and Trig have the same father. Those Alaska nights get pretty cold, and Mr. Palin often goes off for extended trip working the oil fields, snowmobile races etc. and for Eskimos wife sharing is one of their customs.

234

Wow.

Look at all these cocksucking "concern trolls."  Pure vermin.

Hey, guys? All your comments do is expose how ugly you all are. And make us more determined to defeat you.

235 Wow!  It's crazy that Palin's daughter is knocked up.  There is no way McCain knew this when he picked her, unless he's incredibly stupid.  I think Palin should stop worrying about being a VP and stay home and be a better mother to these children she decided to have.  Maybe instill some morals into the younger ones before they become loose sluts like her oldest daughter.

236 Do we really want this trailer trash in office?

Heh.  Day four of Obama campaign talking points, and the smell of liberal fear piss.  I'm loving it.

237

You want snark, you got it. 

WHERE???

If she wants to respond "on the merits" to what I said, let her...

You've said nothing WITH merit, Jackhole.  Why do you think I don't bother with you?

More gratuitous snot.  

THAT was gratuitous???  Sheesh, you wouldn't survive long.

barbelle, you're looking for foils??   Choose yer fricken weapons!!

As the Man said, I don't have a battle of wits with an unarmed opponent.

But wait!  WE ALL KNOW NOW that you will simply say "who cares?" when challenged. LOL!

No, actually I say that when I really don't care. 

Seriously, now, seriously. 

Are you paying attention? 

You sure? 

I really, honestly just don't give a single solitary rat's patootie about you, much less your opinion. 

Honestly, 100 percent. 

This is me. 

This is me not caring.

See the differenence?

No?

Well, that's because there is no difference. 

I just don't care.

Pinky swear.

Hey that rhymes!

You could become King of the Planet, or you could become the most horrific story ever featured in the Darwin Awards, and the Give-A-Crap-O-Meter wouldn't budge.

Not one iota.

'K?

Of all the points I brought up in this thread, this is really the most basic, the easist for you to understand, and you're having an incredibly difficult time getting this.  So, is it any wonder more complex concepts are wasted on you?

Truly, please, just reach out with one delicate but effective cerebral tendril and wrap it around this last, elementary phrase...

"I...don't....care."

238

No. I was protecting you.

Heh. Fuck you, pal. 

 Barbelle does not need any protecting by me or anyone else.

Yeah, so where IS this Barbelle-who-brags-but-doesn't deliver?  This Barbelle from whom I need protecting?

"But if you want to continue to assert that Barbelle is a guy from Usenet instead of a woman who's been around here about as long as anyone, have at it."

Sorry, but that arrogant cocksucker is no woman. 

Have you considered this is the first time anyone has outed Billy Beck by stumbling upon  that bbeck hashcode? You know, like finding  new evidence and a connection no one has made before?  Along with Billy's "tells", such as the claims of logical invincibility---except that he shows not the slightest sign of understanding reason--- and  where his illogical, ad hominem, fallacy-ridden "argument" boils down to "who gives a shit what you think"?? How he brags of looking for new foils --- but  instead of making a case just declares victory and flounces off ? 

No one else sticking up for him 'cept his bitch.

Or maybe his sockpuppet.  (who else would be stupid enough to argue that Billy argues in "good faith")?

 

 

 

239

But if you want to continue to assert that Barbelle is a guy from Usenet instead of a woman who's been around here about as long as anyone, have at it.

Yep, he's Grade A Pure Moron.  Kos is missing a fraternal twin.

240 Wow! It's crazy that Palin's daughter is knocked up. There is no way McCain knew this when he picked her, unless he's incredibly stupid. I think Palin should stop worrying about being a VP and stay home and be a better mother to these children she decided to have.

Did you really think anyone would take you seriously and be influenced by this transparent moby crap?

241 >>No one else sticking up for him 'cept his bitch. >>Or maybe his sockpuppet. (who else would be stupid enough to argue that Billy argues in "good faith")? Yea, you caught me. I'm posting as Barbelle in one place and then running to another place with a completely different internet connection, thus the different hash, just so I can fuck with you. Your drool cup overfloweth.

242 i cant believe that little slut bristol palin, how could she do this to her mother.   she go get knock up and think her mother can be v.p. get real ! what is the world coming to.

243 i got it the palins should be sluts r 'us coming soon to a town near you.

244

barbelle and Jackstraw. 

Not a substantive comment from either of you. Sheer intellectual cowardice. 

Jackstraw:  Ok, you're not his sockpuppet -- just his bitch.

You two need to rent a cabana, and sort out who gets to suck what.

barbelle -- you have the reasoning power of  a  littleneck  make that pencilneck clam.

 I eagerly await your future postings.

 

 

 

 

245 Normally, this situation should be a private family matter. But after 30 years of ChristoFascist red-neck, Bible-thumpin' manure from the far-right of the Republican Party, they deserve all the negative attention they get. "Practicing what they PREACH?" Give me a break. According to the Fundie lunatics in the former USA, anyone who has sex before marriage is ready for the everlastin' fires of Hades. . .well the chicken (embryos) are comin' home to roost. And don't get me wrong -- I'm not an Obama supporter. Wouldn't vote for either Corporate fraud party. Folks, you better start checking out the Libertarians & Greens 'cause nothin' gonna change until YOU do.

246

Not a substantive comment from either of you.

You mean substantive like accusing me of being someone AND a gender I'm not?  Substantive like accusing Jack of being someone he's not?  Then I'm happy to oblige.

Sheer intellectual cowardice. 

You mean you want to see the kind of intellectual courage it takes to bandy about provably falsely accusations just like you?  Then I'm afraid I can't oblige.

barbelle -- you have the reasoning power of  a  littleneck  make that pencilneck clam.

So does that mean you get that I don't care or not?

 I eagerly await your future postings.

Rats, guess it doesn't.

247 When in the world was teen pregnancy became a sign of a normal family!?!? It's more of a sign how the parents failed to educate and teach good moral values to their child. A daughter graduating college, getting a career, then getting pregnant IS the norm. Getting pregnant during the teenage years is such a massive failure in life. If Palin can't oversee what's going on under her house, how in the world can she even govern a whole country!

248

Otis the Senseless wrote: 239Normally, this situation should be a private family matter.

Barack Obama thinks it still should be.  Why don't you?

 But after 30 years of ChristoFascist red-neck, Bible-thumpin' manure from the far-right of the Republican Party, they deserve all the negative attention they get.

What evidence do you offer that the Palins are ChristoFascist red-neck, Bible-thumpin' manure  ?  Why do you assume the Palins are "they"?  Or are you just shooting off your yap pretending you know???

In what way are American Christians of any denomination "fascists"?  Please be specific. 

I suspect you haven't the slightest idea what fascism means, or historically how some of  its tenets have been put into practice by the left.  cf Margaret Sanger.  Woodrow Wilson.  Franklin Roosevelt.

 "Practicing what they PREACH?" Give me a break.

You will get no breaks here, sir, when you spout ill-informed nonsense.

Who is this "they" doing this preaching ?  Do the Palins preach this?  Does their church or pastor?   Has it occurred to you that "preaching" pre-marital sex is a bad idea, let alone a moral problem, is not the same as guaranteeing that everyone will follow the "preaching"?   Evidentally not. 

Do you not understand that millions of American parents who aren't the least religious  (aka liberals and athheists) "preach" the same message (no pre-marital sex) to their daughters?

Do you not understand that the basic premise underlying our Constitution is a judaeo-christian one, namely that human beings are essentially flawed, and that Perfection is beyond our reach?  That humans will strive and fail again and again , and that's the best we can hope to do?

Apparently you missed out on that essential part of what being an American is all about.

 According to the Fundie lunatics in the former USA,

  And who would they be, sir, in the former (sic) USA?

 anyone who has sex before marriage is ready for the everlastin' fires of Hades.

  Your snotty and elitist attitude ("everlastin') is here for all to see.  Again,  what is your evidence that the Palins are "fundy lunatics" who believe what you claim?  And, of course, you seem ignorant of the ideas of contrition, penance and redemption.

Bill Clinton cheated on his wife, repeatedly .  That's a violation of the Seventh Commandment. Clinton claims to be a Christian.   Is it your position that he is going to hell?  Or do you give HIM a pass?

Is it a case that if no one "preaches", there's no sin to be guilty of? 

 And, oh yes, Mr. Smartass, Hades is a Greek idea.  It has  NOTHING to do with Christian Hell.  

. .well the chicken (embryos) are comin' home to roost.

It's very telling that you quote Rev. Jeremiah Wright.  Talk about fundamentalists!!!  Talk about hell-fire!!!  Ever hear a black preacher hold forth on homosexuality?

No Jethro  Otis, you haven't.

You are one confused sumbitch.

But thanks for sharing.

249 In response to the question of if this shows example of weather or not Gov. Palin will be an effective potencial vice leader on one of the world powers allow me to leave you with this. Sara Palin governs a city with about as many people as are in my high school. Before this week her name was not one that was of any consiquence to anyone, she obviously was not wise enough to practice safe sex (being middle age) which resulted in a child with down syndrome. Mrs. Palin-if McCain is elected into office-will be Vice to the United States of America. How does her personal life give us an idea of her leadership? Well, I was taught that all major foundations as well as improvement start at home. Well, Palin apparently lacks charge of her own home; what would intimate that she could have charge of a country? You could go on and on about how this shows that she is just like every other American family that has problems of there own, but what example is that realy setting for America about teen pregnancy? Palin:"Oh, we have children that we love and support...Blah Blah Blah" Ever since Brittney Spears Hollywood has had this almost contagious baby obsession that the media only feeds off of, and we the observer are mesmerized by. ex: look at those 17 girls on the east coast that made a pact to get knocked up. And McCain had to have known about it, but was probaby banking on it not leaking out 'til after the election(cause he only wanted Palin for the Hilary voter that he sure as hell ain't getting now) so what does that really say about his judgement and leadership capabilities?

250 If Palin can't oversee what's going on under her house, how in the world can she even govern a whole country!

It seemed almost within Obama's grasp a week ago and now its slipping away.  I can smell your fear .

251 I am a feminist. I believe that women shouldn't have to choose between family and work, we can have both. But sometimes situations beyond our control come along and there is no "healthy balance." I'm from a conservative evangelical family, and so I also believe that family should ALWAYS be prioritized over personal achievement and career.

Sarah Palin has a four month old with Down Syndrome, six year old, and three teenagers, one of whom is pregnant. This family is going through a LOT right now. Special needs children are blessings, but they need so much more care, time, and attention than other children. Teenage pregnancy is very scary for the young mothers. Bristol is going to need her mother's love, advice, and assistance in caring for her baby. If I had a special needs baby and a pregnant teen (not to mention 3 other kids) I wouldn't wait tables part time if I didn't have to, and I CERTAINLY wouldn't be running for the second most powerful job in the country!

Palin's choice to accept the VP nomination bewilders me. Bristol is now going to be fodder for every comedian and gossip columnist in the country. Who will be raising Palin's baby and grand baby while she's campaigning? While shes running the country?? Her choice does not show the kind of family-first core values that I would expect from a Christian Conservative mother. Frankly, it seems like she last lost her moral bearings on her quest for power.

252 Bristol is now going to be fodder for every comedian and gossip columnist in the country.

So, you're essentially arguing that because the Obama campaign is a vile collection of misogynists, certain to lie, smear, and ridicule children, a successful women governor shouldn't seek higher office.  I'm glad you made that clear, but I don't think it would be right to give in to scum.

253

Frankly, it seems like she last lost her moral bearings on her quest for power.

That's one way to look at it.  Another way is to think that Palin looked at the bigger picture as to what would be best for her family in the long term...not to mention what would be best for the country.

254 It's so wonderful how Bristol gave of herself to present her mother with a grandchild-  if only all of our children were that loving.   Lets hope the restof her children hurry up andbless her withthe same gift-

255 It's so wonderful how Bristol gave of herself to present her mother with a grandchild-  if only all of our children were that loving.

Word.  I've been seriously nagging mine to get started.

256

The question is how old his the father of Bristol's unborn child? Has that information been vetted?

Is statutory rape a consideration?

257 18 and just graduated from high school

258 The reality is most teenagers have sex.  But come on, teach your kids to use a damn condom!!!  Sarah Palin could have spared America of another teenage pregnancy.

These teenagers are not innocent.  They know their responsibilities and they know exactly what they were doing but were stupid  not to think of the consequences.  Bristol is lucky to have supportive parents but getting pregnant at 17 is NOT OK.  It is plain STUPID.  She was only thinking of her own pleasure and not the people (her parents and her family) who will be affected by the consequences of her decision. 

McCain and Palin should sign an executive order (if at all they win) that only those who can be responsible parents can have an orgasm!!!  That's what God intended orgasm for anyway...

259

For a humorous take on Palin’s pregnancy pickle check out, http://beema.wordpress.com/2008/09/01/beema-news-september-1-2008/.

260 Sarah Palin could have spared America of another teenage pregnancy.

Pharisee ... whitewashed tombs ... deadmen's bones ... motes beams, etc

261 Could you help me. My theory of evolution is that Darwin was adopted. Help me! Need information about: drug and alcohol rehab treatment. I found only this - alcohol treatment facility. Information about the drug and alcohol addiction treatment center and the services offered. Adolescent alcoholism alcoholism is a very scary and sometimes deadly disease. Thank you very much . Marcia from Marino.

262 http://myface.com/user/signwatch/blogs