May 30, 2015

Saturday Politics Thread: And On We Slog [Y-not]
— Open Blogger

Actually, I lie. I'm not going to do much of a slog on the immigration issue this weekend. Between the short week and some family obligations, I didn't make much headway on further analysis of the candidates' positions on illegal immigration, amnesty, and work permits.

Fear not! There's still some political news for us to chew on today.

Via the New York Times, here's a handy tool to help you track Who Is Running for President:

GOPcandids.jpg
We didn't discuss them in any depth when they happened, but Ben Carson, Carly Fiorina, and Mike Huckabee announced their candidacies during the first week of May.

Rick Santorum announced last week:

Senator Santorum's announcement speech was held in Cabot, Pennsylvania, which could make Meatball happy, I suppose. (OK, I'm sure Santorum isn't Brandon's cup of tea, but still... Pennsylvania!)

I did find this interesting:

Former Sen. Rick Santorum of Pennsylvania says that even his father, who was stuck for some time in Benito Mussolini's Italy, wasn't upset with America for his situation.

"I'm the son of an immigrant, I believe in immigration, but my dad spent seven years in fascist Italy under Mussolini because my grandfather couldn't bring him into this country until he became a citizen and when he did, he brought him over," Mr. Santorum, a 2016 GOP presidential candidate, said this week on Fox News' "The Kelly File."

"I said, 'Were you ever upset with America because they separated you from your dad for seven years?'" he said. "He said, 'No -- America was worth the wait.' And so I look at it as someone who's said you know what? America is worth the wait -- it's worth doing it the right way."

Look, he's not my guy. I find his candidacy mildly annoying, frankly. But I'll give him credit for expressing support for legal immigration and for WAITING IN LINE. This sentiment should require no courage for a politician to express.

Also announcing this week... Former Governor George Pataki. Here's a bit of what he said:

"They say we are against the middle class. This too is nonsense," he said. "Unless by middle class, they mean someone who left the White House 'dead broke,' and 10 years later had $100 Million. Unless by middle class they mean someone who charges a poor country $500,000 for a half-hour speech. That's their party's candidate. She speaks for the middle class? They are the party of privilege; we are the party of the middle class."

"They say we, are anti-immigrant," he said. "We, the proud children, grandchildren, and descendants of immigrants, know that immigration has and will continue to enhance the greatness of this country."

He also said the first part of immigration reform "must secure the border," which is a common position among Republicans. But the son of immigrants who speaks Hungarian, Spanish, French and German, also sent a message that his is not anti-immigrant. He spoke a line of Spanish in his speech and implored that "everyone coming here is coming not to harm us, but to be a part of a better America."

Again, Pataki's candidacy is unlikely to go anywhere. (Apparently he's pro-abortion, which is usually the death-knell to a GOP primary candidate.) But if he wants to hammer on Hillary for a while and unapologetically defend his fellow Republicans as being pro-immigrant while supporting border security, I'm happy to have him on board for a little while.

BTW, Lindsey Graham is expected to announce his candidacy next week.

Rick Perry will make his announcement on June 4th. He will be joined by Taya Kyle (Chris Kyle's widow) and Marcus Luttrell (author of Lone Survivor).

As long as we're talking about the GOP Primary field, I enjoyed this column by Bill Whalen over at Ricochet. It's called "Sorting the Republicans' 2016 Kingdom" and in it he comes up with a novel way to categorize the GOP hopefuls. Here's an excerpt:

There are at least three ways to sort the Republican candidates.

You can do it by national polls, such as this most recent one by Quinnipiac University.

Or you can look at what's going on in the early-primary shaping/re-shaping states, such as this CNN New Hampshire poll from earlier in May showing how various GOP contenders stack up versus Hillary Clinton.

Here's yet another way to divide the field: taxonomically -- i.e., by the many phyla that exist within the political kingdom that is the Republican Party.

I liked this one:

Attack/Retreat. A group that includes Senator Lindsey Graham and Kentucky Senator Rand Paul. Defining traits: the polar extremes of U.S. foreign policy as viewed through a Republican lens -- no one rattles a saber quite like Graham (he think it's time for a new surge in Iraq), whereas the non-interventionist Paul would have you believe that it's his own party that paved the way for ISIS' land grab in Syria and Iraq (in his words, GOP hawks "created these people"). In Latin: Bellum Ostrichus Nukum Avoidum.

Heh.

OstrichMushroom.jpg

Senators Rand Paul and Lindsey Graham

Related, Jay Cost went on an epic Twitter rant yesterday. He's incensed by the Smart Set's (my term, not his) handling of the GOP debates. Here's a sample:

JayCostRant1.jpg

He really hits the nail on the head, imho, when he points out that "The @GOP leadership is unelected by the party voters nationwide. Why should it play such a role in deciding?"

Why indeed.

Finally, a couple of more infographics about the GOP field:

And this one, which I believe I've posted before:

So how are you feeling about the GOP field as it is currently shaping up? Do you think the conservative vote will get split, allowing a "RINO" to slip in or do you think there's hope?


*UPDATE: People are discussing Rand Paul's recent statements about ISIS. Here are a couple of links to help you come up to speed:

Rand's remarks here:

JOE SCARBOROUGH, MORNING JOE: A guy that works very closely with John McCain that is going to be running against you, we think, he's going to be a heat-sinking [missile against Rand] the entire campaign. Lindsey Graham, Lindsey Graham would say, ISIS exists because of people like Rand Paul who said let's not go into Syria, what do you say to that?

SEN. RAND PAUL: I would say it's exactly the opposite. ISIS exists and grew stronger because of the hawks in our party who gave arms indiscriminately, and most of those arms were snatched up by ISIS. These hawks also wanted to bomb Assad, which would have made ISIS' job even easier. They created these people. ISIS is all over Libya because the same hawks in my party loved Hillary Clinton's war in Libya, they just wanted more of it.

Krauthammer's reaction here.

FWIW, Rand slightly walked back from his initial remarks. I can't find the link, but basically he just softened the 'created ISIS' thing without really changing the core of his accusation.

Posted by: Open Blogger at 03:25 AM | Comments (244)
Post contains 1232 words, total size 11 kb.

1 First

Posted by: TheQuietMan at May 30, 2015 03:29 AM (DiZBp)

2 We are going to get our asses handed to us. That's how we are feeling about it.

Posted by: goon at May 30, 2015 03:30 AM (gy5kE)

3 oh boy...lot's to read Thanks Y-not

Posted by: Village Idiot's Apprentice at May 30, 2015 03:30 AM (VPLuQ)

4 Sons of a thousand fathers, all bastards, just like them.

Posted by: Tuco at May 30, 2015 03:31 AM (IGx7i)

5 Here's how to sort out the GOP candidates: "If you aren't Scott Walker, please go home."

Posted by: Michael Haz at May 30, 2015 03:33 AM (zjnVk)

6 Forgot to mention the excellence of your post and the gratitude felt for arming us with real information. Super good.

Posted by: goon at May 30, 2015 03:33 AM (gy5kE)

7 Isis in Palmyra: Civilians forced to watch execution of 20 men at amphitheatre




But a bunch of people holding signs and flags in front of a mosque is the epitome of evil according to the left in this idiot country

Posted by: TheQuietMan at May 30, 2015 03:34 AM (DiZBp)

8

I like what was said on the podcast.  Fox should just announce now who they are going to give a TV show to so those people can drop out of the race.

Posted by: buzzion at May 30, 2015 03:34 AM (zt+N6)

9 Not a bad candidate placement by 538. My only thought is that Jindal should be lower than Rubio in the Establishment circle.

Posted by: WisRich at May 30, 2015 03:34 AM (xWQFH)

10 And how about that.  Rick Perry really is Gen. Eric Republican.

Posted by: buzzion at May 30, 2015 03:35 AM (zt+N6)

11 Yeah, I'm not seeing how Jindal and Fiorina as solid members of "the Establishment" as depicted here.

Posted by: SamVonSam at May 30, 2015 03:37 AM (cqtAK)

12 It's early, I like Cruz, Walker, Jindal, and Perry if he can stop fcuking up. My must haves are stopping ILLEGAL Immgration, and 2nd amendment. If we can find one candidate that is good on both it will be a miracle. That is how far the nation has fallen.

Posted by: rd at May 30, 2015 03:38 AM (u/eTl)

13 I like a few of the candidates. I dislike a few of them. To be frank, my least favorite may be Rand Paul, but I might be holding his father against him. And it might offend many here at Purity Central, and though I despise the Republican Establishment, there's about a 99.99% chance that I will be voting for the Republican nominee in the election no matter who it is, as I have since 1992 (the first presidential election I was eligible to vote.)

Posted by: I Work for Dick Jones at May 30, 2015 03:41 AM (LxhYr)

14 Did I break the blog?

Posted by: rd at May 30, 2015 03:41 AM (u/eTl)

15 The chart confirms a number of things and yet has a few surprises.

Posted by: J.J. Sefton at May 30, 2015 03:42 AM (St6BJ)

16 Another scalp I guess:

http://ricktempest.com

Posted by: tedave at May 30, 2015 03:42 AM (jcpQL)

17 The RINO won't slip in, Y-not. He'll be carried in, triumphantly, on the shoulders of the GOPe, a few Democrat mischief-makers and Poppin' Fresh and the rest of the "conservative" punditry.

I know some people here have the hots for Jindal and teh Cruz Missile, but looking at all the wannabes in a row nauseates me.

We (by which I mean Conservatives) are gonna get our butts whupped bad in '16. So will Republicans, but they're asking for it.

The only questions left, IMO, are: 1) will Choom Boy actually leave office willingly? and 2) who will Hitlery pick as her veepee?

Posted by: MrScribbler[/i] at May 30, 2015 03:42 AM (P8YHq)

18 On this ring "map," Perry is a triple threat, which could be useful. I've also noticed his negatives seem rather low in the polling I've looked at. But I think we are ALL waiting with bated breath to see if he can overcome the hole he dug for himself last run, as well as that bogus indictment. I don't understand how Fiorina can even be rated given her almost complete lack of a political record. I'll probably have to do backgrounder on her.

Posted by: Y-not at May 30, 2015 03:43 AM (RWGcK)

19 It's still a year and a half away. I am already tired of the hype.

Posted by: Infidel at May 30, 2015 03:44 AM (kCq6U)

20 "my least favorite may be Rand Paul, but I might be holding his father against him" I think that is illegal in 14 states.

Posted by: Y-not at May 30, 2015 03:44 AM (RWGcK)

21 So, Mike Huckabee and Tim Pawlenty are more conservative than Ronald Reagan? OK.

Posted by: I Work for Dick Jones at May 30, 2015 03:44 AM (LxhYr)

22 Huckabuckle is more conservative than Reagan?

Posted by: Muldoon, a solid man at May 30, 2015 03:44 AM (NeFrd)

23 @21- Heh, I noticed the same thing. Great minds and all that...

Posted by: Muldoon, a solid man at May 30, 2015 03:45 AM (NeFrd)

24 I want to like Rand Paul. My biggest problem with him is Daddy Paul. Because I know that about October 20, 2016, Luap Nor would open his mouth and say something stupid about Nazis or the Klan. Or the MSM would "discover" the Paul Newslatters from way, way back when. And that would be that.

Posted by: rd at May 30, 2015 03:47 AM (u/eTl)

25 Rand Paul is as dangerous as Fredo

Posted by: Nevergiveup at May 30, 2015 03:48 AM (/tNwW)

26 My annoying, daily two cents: No Fiorina. Not now, not ever.

I respect the attack-dog thing. I do not respect her.

Posted by: Bob's House of Flannel Shirts and Wallet Chains at May 30, 2015 03:48 AM (yxw0r)

27 I just want to know which candidate is going to provide free beer and brauts at the 4th of July parade. I'll be there.

Posted by: Sunshine Galopidous at May 30, 2015 03:49 AM (qrn54)

28 Hey J.J. I owe you a few drinks for your Birthday. Hey you going to the Parade on Sunday?

Posted by: Nevergiveup at May 30, 2015 03:49 AM (/tNwW)

29 >>Yeah, I'm not seeing how Jindal and Fiorina as solid members of "the Establishment" as depicted here. Oh good, it's not just me. Complaints (outside of LA) about Gov. Jindal are usually about how he's a social conservative, *gasp*.

Posted by: Mama AJ at May 30, 2015 03:49 AM (0xTsz)

30 *slides straight razor over to MrScribbler* My mood was very black (I denounce myself) yesterday. But I'm fundamentally an optimist, so I tend to pull myself out of that mood after a while. It takes energy to stay that gloomy.

Posted by: Y-not at May 30, 2015 03:50 AM (RWGcK)

31 >>I think that is illegal in 14 states. Posted by: Y-not

And icky in all of them.

Posted by: Aviator at May 30, 2015 03:50 AM (sQzB6)

32 I do not respect her. Posted by: Bob's House of Flannel Shirts and Wallet Chains at May 30, 2015 08:48 AM (yxw0r) Did you have an HP Computer that crashed?

Posted by: Nevergiveup at May 30, 2015 03:50 AM (/tNwW)

33 Seems Rand's foreign policy tendencies run in the same vein as his father. Apple;Tree.

Posted by: Infidel at May 30, 2015 03:50 AM (kCq6U)

34 Large yellow ball in the sky hurts my eyes and warms my skin. Me scared! Must go give tribute to the chariot driver and do a training session with the doggie dog. Later gators!

Posted by: Muldoon, a solid man at May 30, 2015 03:50 AM (NeFrd)

35 So MamaAJ, Do you have any intel on when/if Jindal will announce? I'm looking forward to his candidacy. Of all of the hopefuls, Perry and Jindal are the two about whom I'd feel confident as a commander-in-chief.

Posted by: Y-not at May 30, 2015 03:51 AM (RWGcK)

36 Perry's placement on the first graphic makes no sense unless you think the past 10 years of Texas history have been only as conservative as our shit for brains congress.

Posted by: Lauren at May 30, 2015 03:51 AM (DLBJh)

37 If there were ever a poster boy for "Big Government Conservatism" it's Mike Huckabee. He strikes me as the type of guy who'd have an endless litany of government programs to solve problems. (That wouldn't work, of course.)

Posted by: I Work for Dick Jones at May 30, 2015 03:51 AM (LxhYr)

38 The blog is acting strange for me. Everytime I refresh it goes back to post 14, rather than the last post like it usually does. I am using Win 7 and IE 11.

Posted by: rd at May 30, 2015 03:51 AM (u/eTl)

39 Seems Rand's foreign policy tendencies run in the same vein as his father. Apple;Tree. Posted by: Infidel at May 30, 2015 08:50 AM (kCq6U) You can't be just a little crazy. It's like being a little pregnant. You just can't trust a man like that. The crazy will out on every issue eventually.

Posted by: Nevergiveup at May 30, 2015 03:52 AM (/tNwW)

40 The blog is acting strange for me. Everytime I refresh it goes back to post 14, rather than the last post like it usually does. I am using Win 7 and IE 11. Posted by: rd at May 30, 2015 08:51 AM (u/eTl) Me to. It's not just you. But of course it is your fault

Posted by: Nevergiveup at May 30, 2015 03:53 AM (/tNwW)

41 When Rand Paul blamed ISIS on Republican hawks earlier this week, he took himself out of consideration.  I was willing to cut the guy some slack and not blame him for his father's issues but this is an unforced error he did on his own.

Posted by: Obnoxious A-Hole at May 30, 2015 03:53 AM (QHgTq)

42 I've given up on voting for someone I agree with about everything. If I had to have that I should probably run. Umm no. No chance I'll vote for Bush or Fatboy from Jersey in the general. No chance.

Posted by: weirdflunkyonatablet at May 30, 2015 03:53 AM (MfLHV)

43 The blog is acting strange for me. Everytime I refresh it goes back to post 14, rather than the last post like it usually does. --- Click on the last comment number in the thread, then hit refresh. It should jump/refresh at the last number you clicked.

Posted by: Y-not at May 30, 2015 03:53 AM (RWGcK)

44 "He strikes me as the type of guy who'd have an endless litany of government programs to solve problems. (That wouldn't work, of course.)" For sure. Santorum as well.

Posted by: Lauren at May 30, 2015 03:53 AM (DLBJh)

45 Just got back from "chores" but before I could even get out of chair brother called while he has free phone time and wanted to chat.  An hour later I was able to get to chores.  Now read new post.

Posted by: Vic[/i] We Have No Party at May 30, 2015 03:53 AM (GpgJl)

46 When Rand Paul blamed ISIS on Republican hawks earlier this week, he took himself out of consideration. I was willing to cut the guy some slack and not blame him for his father's issues but this is an unforced error he did on his own. Posted by: Obnoxious A-Hole at May 30, 2015 08:53 AM (QHgTq) It's not an unforced error. He is what he is, not matter how much he tries to hide it.

Posted by: Nevergiveup at May 30, 2015 03:54 AM (/tNwW)

47 Of the eight announced, I wish four of them weren't.

Of the seven probables, I wish four of them weren't.

I fully support all the not-runnings, and hope to increase their ranks soon.


Posted by: Pappy O'Daniel at May 30, 2015 03:55 AM (oVJmc)

48 But of course it is your fault. I accept the blame, as I am a heterosexual white Christian male, and my betters keep telling me that everything is my fault.

Posted by: rd at May 30, 2015 03:55 AM (u/eTl)

49 Although I gave up my membership, I will say that the interface at Ricochet, especially the commenting and editor boxes, is very nice. But... not the same great group of commenters.

Posted by: Y-not at May 30, 2015 03:55 AM (RWGcK)

50 44 "He strikes me as the type of guy who'd have an endless litany of government programs to solve problems. (That wouldn't work, of course.)" For sure. Santorum as well. Posted by: Lauren at May 30, 2015 08:53 AM (DLBJh) I'm not a Santorum supporter, but he's actively campaigning on abolishing the IRS and instituting a flat tax. Also, curbing the EPA. You can accuse him of a lot of things, but being in favor of big government is not one of them, at least from everything I've ever heard of the guy.

Posted by: J.J. Sefton at May 30, 2015 03:55 AM (St6BJ)

51 46 It's not an unforced error. He is what he is, not matter how much he tries to hide it. Posted by: Nevergiveup at May 30, 2015 08:54 AM (/tNwW) He has exposed more and more of himself over the past couple of years. I thought he was not like his loon dad, but this is clearly not the case. He's done.

Posted by: J.J. Sefton at May 30, 2015 03:57 AM (St6BJ)

52 There is a long way to go. At this time when Reagan was running they were all making fun of him for that monkey movie he made. There is a long way to go.

Posted by: Nevergiveup at May 30, 2015 03:58 AM (/tNwW)

53 "But I'll give him credit for expressing support for legal immigration and for WAITING IN LINE. This sentiment should require no courage for a politician to express."

I give him credit for being the only candidate who has committed to reducing legal immigration (he wants to cut it by 25%, which isn't enough but would be a good start). Excessive legal immigration is a much bigger problem than illegal immigration, since legal immigrants vote, and they vote 80-20 Dem.(yes, some illegals vote too, but in far smaller numbers). And it doesn't matter if the cheap imported labor is here legally or illegally, it drives down wages either way.

Posted by: Jon (not the troll) at May 30, 2015 03:58 AM (HA+/6)

54 21 So, Mike Huckabee and Tim Pawlenty are more conservative than Ronald Reagan?

OK.

Posted by: I Work for Dick Jones at May 30, 2015 08:44 AM (LxhYr) 

 

Actually, if you look at it compared to their time period, Ronald Reagan is a sooper purity tru-con! for the 1980's compared to the congressional Republicans  yet he won the presidency.  Whereas Pawlen-zzzzzz.....

 

...Huh, where was I?  Oh and Huckabee are right in line with Republicans today.

 

Of course the thing to also remember is that the congressional Republicans and other candidates are at that point today because of what Reagan did.

Posted by: buzzion at May 30, 2015 03:59 AM (zt+N6)

55 Click on the last comment number in the thread, then hit refresh. It should jump/refresh at the last number you clicked. Posted by: Y-not at May 30, 2015 08:53 AM (RWGcK) Nope, does not work. I just need to remember the last comment # and scroll down. Is that a first world problem?

Posted by: rd at May 30, 2015 04:00 AM (u/eTl)

56 I'm not a Santorum supporter, but he's actively campaigning on abolishing the IRS and instituting a flat tax. Also, curbing the EPA. --- Also not a Santorum supporter, but I liked some of what I read about his rollout last week. I don't mind a big field early if they focus on attacking the Democrats and/or expressing a conservative (or even Republican) principle well, which is why I can't stand Rand. He directs too much fire at the GOP. It's like he's saying, "I'm the GOPer you can trust, unlike THOSE assholes who are borderline racists obstructing voting rights and fostering the growth of ISIS."

Posted by: Y-not at May 30, 2015 04:00 AM (RWGcK)

57 Rand Paul was #Hacked!

Posted by: The ISISing on the cake at May 30, 2015 04:00 AM (IGx7i)

58 He has exposed more and more of himself over the past couple of years. I thought he was not like his loon dad, but this is clearly not the case. He's done. This. I have always been suspicious of him. The apple never falls far from the tree. I also don't like the commercials his dad has been doing. It's just creepy.

Posted by: Infidel at May 30, 2015 04:01 AM (kCq6U)

59 As long as John McLame doesn't enter the race, I'm good.

I believe there should be NO divvying up the debates by polls. (why should we trust polls?)

Have a free for all. No moderator. Each Candidate gets 3 minutes to yack without interruption then a set of questions is asked for all of them to answer as they see fit. No long answers. Cut their mike if they take more than 1-2 sentences. (yes/no/maybe questions only).

THEN take some polls.

Either that or a melee with wooden swords.

OR

Do a one on one matchup like March Madness. Till they winnow the field. (draw straws for placement)

Posted by: Bitter Clinger and All That at May 30, 2015 04:02 AM (zRby/)

60 The apple never falls far from the tree. I also don't like the commercials his dad has been doing. It's just creepy. Posted by: Infidel at May 30, 2015 09:01 AM (kCq6U) The older I get I realize I am my Dad. In almost every way. Ya just can't escape it. It's just weird realizing good old Dad was as mush of a pervert as I am?

Posted by: Nevergiveup at May 30, 2015 04:03 AM (/tNwW)

61 I'll only vote for the candidate that watches futbol.

Posted by: artisanal 'ette at May 30, 2015 04:03 AM (zqrZE)

62 43 The blog is acting strange for me. Everytime I refresh it goes back to post 14, rather than the last post like it usually does.
---

Click on the last comment number in the thread, then hit refresh. It should jump/refresh at the last number you clicked.

Posted by: Y-not at May 30, 2015 08:53 AM (RWGcK)

 

Twitter embeds can fuck with it too.  You refresh the page and it loads all the text and drops you down, then it sticks in the twitter interface graphics which keeps you in the "same spot" but all the text shifts down to accommodate the tweet size.

Posted by: buzzion at May 30, 2015 04:03 AM (zt+N6)

63 Sorry that refresh trick doesn't work. Try exiting the thread. Refresh main page. Come back into the thread and see where you "land." ---- "There is a long way to go. At this time when Reagan was running they were all making fun of him for that monkey movie he made." Yeah, it's a marathon, not a sprint. But Fox etc can really sway things with their debate lineups.

Posted by: Y-not at May 30, 2015 04:04 AM (RWGcK)

64 It takes energy to stay that gloomy. Posted by: Y-not at May 30, 2015 08:50 AM

At least for me, it takes paying attention to stay gloomy about the Prospective 'Publican Preezies. I could see each one of them at the debates aiming a .357 directly at his/her own foot.

Too much Opportunistic Hackery running around for my taste. Even Cruz, who I would have supported at one point, muffed it badly when he went out on the road begging for loot and making Grand Pronouncements instead of staying in D.C. to do his job.

Do any of these candidates have a record of accomplishment? Well, they've all raised money so they could run for office. I guess that counts for something.

Of all of them, I'll still put Perry at the head of the list, no matter what Our Betters in the Commentariat say. Some others, I could vote for when it comes right down to it.

But this is still a pathetic bunch of lifer government drones.

Posted by: MrScribbler[/i] at May 30, 2015 04:05 AM (P8YHq)

65 Damn, buzzion, that could be the problem. I can screen capture those tweets and embed them as pictures if it's causing a big problem for people. Let me know.

Posted by: Y-not at May 30, 2015 04:05 AM (RWGcK)

66 I get more like my mom every year, but I'm not a freak. No, really. I'm.Not.

Posted by: Infidel at May 30, 2015 04:05 AM (kCq6U)

67 Fox wants Jeb.  They've got all the lotion and Kleenex ready to go in a giant warehouse.

Posted by: buzzion at May 30, 2015 04:05 AM (zt+N6)

68 Jindal just formed an exploratory committee a week or so ago. But what that means for future timing, I don't know.

Posted by: Mama AJ at May 30, 2015 04:06 AM (0xTsz)

69 65 Damn, buzzion, that could be the problem.

I can screen capture those tweets and embed them as pictures if it's causing a big problem for people. Let me know.

Posted by: Y-not at May 30, 2015 09:05 AM (RWGcK)

 

It always does it.  Its just noticeable when there are a lot of tweets or big pictures in them.  Frankly I'm used to it happening.  So for everyone else, suck it up buttercup.

Posted by: buzzion at May 30, 2015 04:07 AM (zt+N6)

70 "Have a free for all. No moderator." Get Nikki Haley and Sarah Palin to run, then add jello.

Posted by: Y-not at May 30, 2015 04:07 AM (RWGcK)

71 Quislng Stooge category: Jeb, Krispy, Kasich, Pataki and Graham Kook Kategory: Huckabee, Santorum Flip Flopper category: Rubio, Carson, Perry X-Factor Yet Still Intriguing category: Jindal, Fiorina So Far So Good category: Cruz, Walker For me, it's Cruz and Walker as my first stringers. Next up would be Perry and possibly Jindal. The Quislings represent the Sefton-Stays-Home group, as well as Huckabee. The other remaining categories I would need a huge clothespin for the nose. NOTE: A) Everyone of my favorites has made a few stupid and/or questionable moves but on aggregate they seem to have the right temperament and mindset to get my vote. B) We are still a long way off and the list is bound to change as a result of as yet unforeseen factors.

Posted by: J.J. Sefton at May 30, 2015 04:07 AM (St6BJ)

72 The Israeli organization IsraAID will be sending a team to help relief efforts in Texas which has been hit with massive flooding that has killed at least 21 people and that has prompted evacuations. IsraAID will be mobilizing its relief team from Israel to support the thousands of people impacted by these latest storms, said Shachar Zahavi, IsraAIDs Executive Director. A team of ten IsraAID volunteers will depart for Texas on Sunday where they will help with removing debris from damaged houses, Zahavi told The Jerusalem Post. The organization will be partnering with US disaster relief organization Team Rubicom and will be helping people in the Austin area. The house clearing work will assist homeowners to turn to the the Federal Emergency Management Agency (FEMA) to receive assistance, Zahavi said. He added that the mission to Texas was not the first time that IsraAID has been involved in US disaster relief. Zahavi listed the floods in Denver and Detroit, wild fires in Washington, hurricanes in Oklahoma, Hurricane Sandy in New York and Hurricane Katrina in New Orleans as other events where his organization lent assistance. ??? How many of Fredo's besets friends, like the turks, Iran, and the muslim brotherhood, are sending aid? I'll give you 2 guesses, but ya'll only need one

Posted by: Nevergiveup at May 30, 2015 04:08 AM (/tNwW)

73  I like that first chart with the three colored balls.  However for those governors who have no "congressional voting record" it should include their record as governor. If it did Huck would be a lot lower and Perry would be a lot higher. That is based on the white paper I did for the 2012 elections.


As for political statements made I note the sometime huge difference between statements and records.  This is why I place little faith on red meat thrown out during primaries.  As the old saying goes, "talk is cheap I want to see the rubber hitting the street".


Right now I have not hardened in on any candidate.  Cruz and Perry are my leads as long as Haley is not in the race.   We seem yo have had some disappointments in Cruz recently but I haven't delved too deeply in those and don't know enough about them to say whether it is Cruz or just twisted propaganda from the MFM.  I caution all to beware of that.

Posted by: Vic[/i] We Have No Party at May 30, 2015 04:08 AM (GpgJl)

74 "'m the GOPer you can trust, unlike THOSE assholes who are borderline racists obstructing voting rights and fostering the growth of ISIS."" Exactly. As for Santorum my image of him as a big government guy comes from my understanding that he was really supportive of the whole Conpassionate Conservative thing, but I guess that's more a reflection of when he was politically active than anything.

Posted by: Lauren at May 30, 2015 04:08 AM (DLBJh)

75 71 - Left out Rand from the Kook Kategory.

Posted by: J.J. Sefton at May 30, 2015 04:08 AM (St6BJ)

76 Indeed. Long way to go. Four or five I like. I feel no desire or need to back a particular candidate yet.

Posted by: I Work for Dick Jones at May 30, 2015 04:09 AM (LxhYr)

77 I am from MN. I like Pawlenty, everything I saw, he was a decent guy. A squishy establishment Republican, but a nice guy. After he quit the '12 presidential race, he has disappeared into the private sector. MN could have used his support in 2014. But he was invisible. And I am glad, even overjoyed he is not running in '16.

Posted by: rd at May 30, 2015 04:09 AM (u/eTl)

78 Me I'm just sitting here wondering how they're going to fcuk us THIS time.

They're very creative. Somehow they manage to commit unforced errors and stand there with that Erkel look on their faces saying "did we do that?"

So although I have high hopes, I have no great expectations.

Posted by: Bitter Clinger and All That at May 30, 2015 04:09 AM (zRby/)

79 70 "Have a free for all. No moderator." Get Nikki Haley and Sarah Palin to run, then add jello. Posted by: Y-not at May 30, 2015 09:07 AM (RWGcK) I'm in favor of big dusky lady-parts.

Posted by: J.J. Sefton at May 30, 2015 04:10 AM (St6BJ)

80 "Too much Opportunistic Hackery running around for my taste. Even Cruz, who I would have supported at one point, muffed it badly when he went out on the road begging for loot and making Grand Pronouncements instead of staying in D.C. to do his job." So you won't support him because he's campaigning?

Posted by: Lauren at May 30, 2015 04:10 AM (DLBJh)

81 Did you have an HP Computer that crashed?

Posted by: Nevergiveup at May 30, 2015 08:50 AM (/tNwW)

**********************

Humor noted, but I was actually on the ground managing contractors for HP during her tenure. I watched HP employees training their replacements from Bangalore. I saw her $500-a-day makeup invoices, while paper clips had to be signed out from the locked supply closet. I had to fire an accounts-payable clerk who didn't know who Carly was, and was simply following through on her irregular charges. Through a freak of circumstance (and a few gin fizzes) I heard how she tried to use Walter Hewlett's cello performances against him with the board.



$40 million severance for almost killing a major U.S. company?



She's bad medicine.

Posted by: Bob's House of Flannel Shirts and Wallet Chains at May 30, 2015 04:12 AM (yxw0r)

82 Y-not for debate moderator or I ain't watching.

Posted by: Mama AJ at May 30, 2015 04:12 AM (0xTsz)

83 Posted by: Vic We Have No Party at May 30, 2015 09:08 AM (GpgJl)

Geez vic, there's 5 balls(circles). Pay attention will ya.

You're giving us geezers a bad name.

Posted by: Bitter Clinger and All That at May 30, 2015 04:12 AM (zRby/)

84 OK, I'm going to say something silly (again)... I kind of like Santorum's logo.

Posted by: Y-not at May 30, 2015 04:12 AM (RWGcK)

85 Posted by: Bob's House of Flannel Shirts and Wallet Chains at May 30, 2015 09:12 AM (yxw0r) Yes my comment was just a joke. I actually know little of her tenure at HP, but have heard not so great things. And I will bow to your expertise.

Posted by: Nevergiveup at May 30, 2015 04:14 AM (/tNwW)

86 81 She's bad medicine. Posted by: Bob's House of Flannel Shirts and Wallet Chains at May 30, 2015 09:12 AM (yxw0r) Yeah, but she's OUR bad medicine! Seriously, I like how she slaps around the MFM, but we have a number of much better qualified people as well as personalities to choose from. Agreed not to support her.

Posted by: J.J. Sefton at May 30, 2015 04:14 AM (St6BJ)

87 The Red Eagle.

Dai Shar Manetheren.

Posted by: Bitter Clinger and All That at May 30, 2015 04:15 AM (zRby/)

88 72, gives me a warm fuzzy! And not much does anymore. Bless them.

Posted by: Infidel at May 30, 2015 04:15 AM (kCq6U)

89 Twitter embeds can fuck with it too. You refresh the page and it loads all the text and drops you down, then it sticks in the twitter interface graphics which keeps you in the "same spot" but all the text shifts down to accommodate the tweet size. Posted by: buzzion at May 30, 2015 09:03 AM (zt+N6) i think that is causing my problem.

Posted by: rd at May 30, 2015 04:15 AM (u/eTl)

90 >>Posted by: Mama AJ at May 30, 2015 09:12 AM LOL! Funny thing is, I rarely watch the debates. I usually read up on them afterwards (transcripts if I can find them). But they do seem to be important in winnowing the field, so I am miffed about this GOPe push to limit the field early on. I may watch them this time.

Posted by: Y-not at May 30, 2015 04:16 AM (RWGcK)

91 It will depend on the venue and the mods. (yes I know they'll have one. They can't help themselves.)

Posted by: Bitter Clinger and All That at May 30, 2015 04:17 AM (zRby/)

92 The "debates" are utterly worthless. I only watch them to make cracks on Twitter or here.

Posted by: I Work for Dick Jones at May 30, 2015 04:17 AM (LxhYr)

93 Posted by: J.J. Sefton at May 30, 2015 09:07 AM

I'm not gonna make a final decision 'til the election, Birthday Boy. Every candidate -- well, most some a few of them, anyway, can get my attention in either a bad or good way.

And I'm not talking about total agreement on a whole bunch of issues. Three or four basics will do. I can put up with a candidate who doesn't agree with me about protecting teh Spotted Owl. A different view about immigration, Israel or the size/power of government? No freekin' way, Bunky. On the basics, they had better get their minds right before soliciting my vote.

Posted by: MrScribbler[/i] at May 30, 2015 04:18 AM (P8YHq)

94 Hey. it's saturday. It seems fairly nice weather all over the country and so far we're above ground.

Let's be positive.

Positive we're screwed but we'll go out with a smile.

Posted by: Bitter Clinger and All That at May 30, 2015 04:18 AM (zRby/)

95 >>The "debates" are utterly worthless. I only watch them to make cracks on Twitter or here. IIRC last time there was a "candidate forum" early on - before Perry had announced, *I think* - that a lot of people here really liked. I can't recall who ran it, but I want to say it was one of those Evangelical preacher types or something. Anyone know what I'm thinking of?

Posted by: Y-not at May 30, 2015 04:19 AM (RWGcK)

96 Honestly, I think Fiorina's just making a play for Commerce or whatever.

Her value is as a stalking horse for Hildebeest, and I'm actually happy to have her in that role because she's being very effective.


Posted by: Pappy O'Daniel at May 30, 2015 04:19 AM (oVJmc)

97 >>But I'll give him credit for expressing support for legal immigration and for WAITING IN LINE. Okay, what if we didn't dislike Santorum already... Ugh, we might end up liking him this year. Quick, someone list all the reasons we don't like him.

Posted by: Mama AJ at May 30, 2015 04:20 AM (0xTsz)

98 95, Was that a Rick Warren thing?

Posted by: I Work for Dick Jones at May 30, 2015 04:20 AM (LxhYr)

99 Please. I have no expertise in anything, 'cept being a schlep.


Again, though, I like the attack-dog thing. Not sure what job she's angling for, but it's good to have someone going after Hillary! who can't be accused of sexism.

Posted by: Bob's House of Flannel Shirts and Wallet Chains at May 30, 2015 04:20 AM (yxw0r)

100 If they'd just stop having open primaries, I might be able to dredge up some hope other wise, NO.

Too much opportunity for the game to be fixed.

Posted by: Bitter Clinger and All That at May 30, 2015 04:20 AM (zRby/)

101 Oh, Vic, since you're here. I had dinner with a South Carolinian a couple of nights ago. He works in a lot of financial and political circles. Filled me in on SC politics and Nikki Haley. Let's just say it confirmed my worst fears about how awful the SC GOP is. (He likes Haley, but was telling me about his encounters with some of her enemies.) Such a shame. I still wish she'd run.

Posted by: Y-not at May 30, 2015 04:20 AM (RWGcK)

102 Posted by: Y-not at May 30, 2015 09:19 AM (RWGcK) wasn't it a senator? Demint?

Posted by: rd at May 30, 2015 04:21 AM (u/eTl)

103 I am intrigued by Flora because she's going after Hillary! Both barrels. I think she's pushing for veep positioning and may well get there.

Posted by: small town girl, crusader at May 30, 2015 04:21 AM (UYkjZ)

104 85 Posted by: Bob's House of Flannel Shirts and Wallet Chains at May 30, 2015 09:12 AM (yxw0r) Yes my comment was just a joke. I actually know little of her tenure at HP, but have heard not so great things. And I will bow to your expertise. Posted by: Nevergiveup at May 30, 2015 09:14 AM (/tNwW) I haven't had HPs. Because I refuse to and try to persuade others to avoid them. I've had friends have them crash. And under her they bought compaq. Which I did have extensive experience with. From high school to college. They were the shittiest buggiest slowest computers I've ever used.

Posted by: Buzzion at May 30, 2015 04:21 AM (J9Y7k)

105 "it's good to have someone going after Hillary! who can't be accused of sexism" Well, there's always Lady Lindsey!

Posted by: Y-not at May 30, 2015 04:21 AM (RWGcK)

106 DAVE Brat,
Now there a guy who shows some RWB conservative colors, he truly is a %100 conservative and stands on his principles unlike others such as Miss Lindsay who wears a lacy shawl of deception on all the time. Dave Brat is a 1% of politicians I could get behind.

Posted by: Mr Coffee at May 30, 2015 04:22 AM (/WmRg)

107 93 Posted by: MrScribbler at May 30, 2015 09:18 AM (P8YHq) Amen. Spoken like a gentleman, sir. And thanks.

Posted by: J.J. Sefton at May 30, 2015 04:22 AM (St6BJ)

108 g'mornin', 'rons

Posted by: AltonJackson at May 30, 2015 04:22 AM (KCxzN)

109 wasn't it a senator? Demint? -- You could be right. Boy, my mind is failing. I hope they have internet access in the Home.

Posted by: Y-not at May 30, 2015 04:22 AM (RWGcK)

110 Lindsay Graham for King of the Forest. Rrruuufff! Cruz Walker would be tempting for spanish double entendre. Cruz is spanish for Cross. The ticket would be, ahem, Cross Walker.

Posted by: Anthropology Guy at May 30, 2015 04:24 AM (ob0uz)

111 >>I hope they have internet access in the Home.

Must have, MUMR was able to get on from there.

Posted by: Aviator at May 30, 2015 04:24 AM (sQzB6)

112 Okay, what if we didn't dislike Santorum already... Ugh, we might end up liking him this year. Quick, someone list all the reasons we don't like him. --- Heh. I will probably do a candidate backgrounder on him and Fiorina. Anyone else? Should I bother with Lindsey Graham?

Posted by: Y-not at May 30, 2015 04:24 AM (RWGcK)

113 Santorum: "I said, 'Were you ever upset with America because they separated you from your dad for seven years?'" he said. "He said, 'No -- America was worth the wait.' And so I look at it as someone who's said you know what? America is worth the wait -- it's worth doing it the right way."


Yeah, that's not made up.

Posted by: flounder at May 30, 2015 04:25 AM (ecDRv)

114 Ugh, please don't bother with Graham, Y-not.

Posted by: no good deed at May 30, 2015 04:26 AM (GgxVX)

115 This field would be too big at half the size.

If Carson, Huckabee, Graham, Bush, Christie, Kasich, Santorum and Pataki would've stayed home, it would be about right.

Posted by: Pappy O'Daniel at May 30, 2015 04:26 AM (oVJmc)

116 >>Should I bother with Lindsey Graham?

Only if by "bother with" you mean wrap in chain and concrete blocks with a boat trip on the Atlantic.

Posted by: Aviator at May 30, 2015 04:26 AM (sQzB6)

117 101 Oh, Vic, since you're here. I had dinner with a South Carolinian a couple of nights ago. He works in a lot of financial and political circles. Filled me in on SC politics and Nikki Haley. Let's just say it confirmed my worst fears about how awful the SC GOP is. (He likes Haley, but was telling me about his encounters with some of her enemies.) Such a shame. I still wish she'd run.

Posted by: Y-not at May 30, 2015 09:20 AM (RWGcK)


The SC Republican Party used to be controlled by the Graham faction.  Right now from what I gather the Haley faction is supposed to be dominant but I still see a lot of crap making it through the legislature that shouldn't; like that 10 cent a gallon tax increase.



My best estimate right now is that nobody has firm control and it is dog eat dog.  And SC has some of the dirtiest politics in the country.

Posted by: Vic[/i] We Have No Party at May 30, 2015 04:28 AM (GpgJl)

118 Yeah, that's not made up. Posted by: flounder at May 30, 2015 09:25 AM -- It may be, but if his biographical details fit the story, who cares? I had a similar "Yeah, riiiight" reaction to Walker's supposed come to Jesus talk with Senator Sessions. Walker never had a conversation about illegal immigration with a border GOP governor at one of those Republican Governors Association things? Really? How incurious is the guy? So I guess I'd just say that at this stage everything is spin. That's why we really do have to dig through their records.

Posted by: Y-not at May 30, 2015 04:28 AM (RWGcK)

119 Anyone else? Should I bother with Lindsey Graham? Posted by: Y-not at May 30, 2015 09:24 AM (RWGcK) It is nice to have the facts when you are trying to convince someone that their favorite candidate is an idiot, kook, or RINO. And as for Lindsey Graham, I do not think he is gay, despite the name, never being married, and never having heard any romantic rumors about him and women in D.C.

Posted by: rd at May 30, 2015 04:29 AM (u/eTl)

120 115 This field would be too big at half the size.

If Carson, Huckabee, Graham, Bush, Christie, Kasich, Santorum and Pataki would've stayed home, it would be about right.

Posted by: Pappy O'Daniel at May 30, 2015 09:26 AM (oVJmc)


This.  

Posted by: flounder at May 30, 2015 04:29 AM (ecDRv)

121 No. We already know too much about Miss Graham.

Posted by: Infidel at May 30, 2015 04:29 AM (kCq6U)

122 OK, how about Fiorina, Santorum, and Pataki? I like to do these backgrounders in threes, being a Dirty Papist and all. LOL

Posted by: Y-not at May 30, 2015 04:30 AM (RWGcK)

123 Does anybody have a link to Rand Paul's statement that has everyone in a tizzy?

Posted by: rickl at May 30, 2015 04:30 AM (sdi6R)

124 If Jen Psaki married George Pataki . . .

Posted by: J.J. Sefton at May 30, 2015 04:30 AM (St6BJ)

125 I would not think DeMint would be an enemy of Haley.  I would think he would be an enemy of Graham. I firmly believe he resigned because of the RNCe and people like Graham controlling the national Party.

Posted by: Vic[/i] We Have No Party at May 30, 2015 04:30 AM (GpgJl)

126 122 OK, how about Fiorina, Santorum, and Pataki?

I like to do these backgrounders in threes, being a Dirty Papist and all. LOL

Posted by: Y-not at May 30, 2015 09:30 AM (RWGcK)


I like that Fiorina can attack from the vagina.  I have no use for the others.

Posted by: flounder at May 30, 2015 04:31 AM (ecDRv)

127 @116

Why, whatever do you mean?

Posted by: Ricardo Kill at May 30, 2015 04:31 AM (I2CG4)

128 I'm seriously annoyed that SMOD isn't listed.

Posted by: IllTemperedCur at May 30, 2015 04:31 AM (ynQIy)

129 126 I like that Fiorina can attack from the vagina. I have no use for the others. Posted by: flounder at May 30, 2015 09:31 AM (ecDRv) The teeth are capped.

Posted by: J.J. Sefton at May 30, 2015 04:31 AM (St6BJ)

130 Kal must not have gotten a paycheck this week.

Posted by: buzzion at May 30, 2015 04:33 AM (zt+N6)

131 I hate this myth that the Republicans now are much more conservative than in the best. Yes, there has been an ideological shake-out that has made the parties more homogenous, but both parties have moved to the left, as has the country, over the years.

Posted by: Emmett Milbarge at May 30, 2015 04:33 AM (nFdGS)

132 On cold nights, you can still hear him moaning, "I'm not gaaaay! I'm not gaaaaaaay!!!!!"

Posted by: Chef at May 30, 2015 04:33 AM (yxw0r)

133 Should I bother with Lindsey Graham? Only if by "bother with" you mean wrap in chain and concrete blocks with a boat trip on the Atlantic. Posted by: Aviator at May 30, 2015 09:26 AM (sQzB6) You forgot the netting. Keeps the smaller bits from floating away after decomposition. At least, that's what I've heard....... *shifty eyes*

Posted by: IllTemperedCur at May 30, 2015 04:34 AM (ynQIy)

134 "If Jen Psaki married George Pataki . . ."


And if they made an appearance in New Jersey.....Psaki-Pataki in Hackensack. 

Posted by: Ricardo Kill at May 30, 2015 04:34 AM (I2CG4)

135 If we want to win, probably a Walker/Rubio ticket. Walker beat the unions in Wisconsin, can probably win Ohio-and Rubio wins Florida, along with peeling away Hispanics from the Democrats.

Posted by: Jeffrey Carter (@pointsnfigures) at May 30, 2015 04:34 AM (LnE5F)

136 Wasn't Fiorina an advisor for John McCain? That puts her in the hell no category for me. I do like her attacks on Hillary though.

Posted by: no good deed at May 30, 2015 04:35 AM (GgxVX)

137 Walker/Rubio????


Two amnesty advocates on the same ticket????


Pardon me while I vomit.

Posted by: Vic[/i] We Have No Party at May 30, 2015 04:35 AM (GpgJl)

138 Does anybody have a link to Rand Paul's statement that has everyone in a tizzy? Posted by: rickl at May 30, 2015 09:30 AM (sdi6R) It's not just one statement. he is an ultra isolationist and has made a whole host of borderline crazy comments on many topics, from foreign policy to race relations. He is at best, unstable. The comment you are talking about is that he blamed ISIS, in part, on the Republican Party

Posted by: Nevergiveup at May 30, 2015 04:36 AM (/tNwW)

139 135 If we want to win, probably a Walker/Rubio ticket. Walker beat the unions in Wisconsin, can probably win Ohio-and Rubio wins Florida, along with peeling away Hispanics from the Democrats.       If Mitt Romney had won 70% of the Hispanic vote he would still have lost in 2012.

Posted by: buzzion at May 30, 2015 04:36 AM (zt+N6)

140 And if they made an appearance in New Jersey.....Psaki-Pataki in Hackensack. Posted by: Ricardo Kill at May 30, 2015 09:34 AM (I2CG4) Nope, in Piscatiaway

Posted by: Nevergiveup at May 30, 2015 04:36 AM (/tNwW)

141 Regarding legal immigration, I prefer quality over quantity.

Last year we let in more immigrants from Nigeria than Britain.


Posted by: Grampa Jimbo at May 30, 2015 04:37 AM (V70Uh)

142 I'm not only anti-illegal immigration, I want a hiatus on legal immigration. And the elimination of birth-right citizenship. In this age of easy transportation, we need to do something different.

Posted by: Grump928(C) at May 30, 2015 04:37 AM (rwI+c)

143 The more left the GOPe goes, the more I find myself going right. Or maybe I have always been there, the GOPe is just moving to left faster. It's not the party I signed up for in 1980.

Posted by: Infidel at May 30, 2015 04:37 AM (kCq6U)

144 141 Regarding legal immigration, I prefer quality over quantity.

Last year we let in more immigrants from Nigeria than Britain.


Posted by: Grampa Jimbo at May 30, 2015 09:37 AM (V70Uh)

 

I'm fine with more Chique de Afrique's over boulder terlit hobos.

Posted by: buzzion at May 30, 2015 04:38 AM (zt+N6)

145 I've updated the post with links to Rand's statement and Krauthammer's reaction to same.

Posted by: Y-not at May 30, 2015 04:38 AM (RWGcK)

146 If we want to win, probably a Walker/Rubio ticket. Walker beat the unions in Wisconsin, can probably win Ohio-and Rubio wins Florida, along with peeling away Hispanics from the Democrats. Posted by: Jeffrey Carter (@pointsnfigures) at May 30, 2015 09:34 AM (LnE5F) I do not see Rubio or Cruz making great headway into the Hispanic vote. I know a few (less than a dozen) Cuban-Americans and Mexican-Americans. They do not seem to really like each other all that much?

Posted by: rd at May 30, 2015 04:38 AM (u/eTl)

147 Sen. Bob Menendez (D-N.J.) slammed the Obama administration on Friday for removing Cuba from the list of state sponsors of terrorism, calling the decision dangerous and misguided. Weasel Zippers I guess those federal charges ain't being dismissed ha?

Posted by: Nevergiveup at May 30, 2015 04:39 AM (/tNwW)

148 134 "If Jen Psaki married George Pataki . . ."


And if they made an appearance in New Jersey.....Psaki-Pataki in Hackensack.

Posted by: Ricardo Kill at May 30, 2015 09:34 AM (I2CG4)



Playing hacky-sack while reading Boris Pasternak?

Posted by: Bob's House of Flannel Shirts and Wallet Chains at May 30, 2015 04:39 AM (yxw0r)

149 143  It's not the party I signed up for in 1980.

Posted by: Infidel at May 30, 2015 09:37 AM (kCq6U)


Think of how I feel.  I can remember a huge debate on whether or not the federal government could bail out NYC with loans.  The general feeling was that it was unconstitutional.  It did not happen then (early 60s IIRC).

Posted by: Vic[/i] We Have No Party at May 30, 2015 04:39 AM (GpgJl)

150 >>Kal must not have gotten a paycheck this week. heh Yeah, he really seems to be on someone's payroll, doesn't he?

Posted by: Y-not at May 30, 2015 04:41 AM (RWGcK)

151 I don't understand how Fiorina can even be rated given her almost complete lack of a political record. I'll probably have to do backgrounder on her. Posted by: Y-not at May 30, 2015 08:43 AM (RWGcK) Yeah, I'm grudgingly starting to like her. But, I'd like an interview with her being asked directly her positions on all the major issues. Maybe Ace and the Friday Podcast crew can get her. No, I'm not joking. She's running a guerrilla campaign. This should be right up her alley, if she's really got the grit. Otherwise, I think she's doing the smart thing which is running essentially for VP - ie. get a mentor to show you the ropes. I like the thinking process in her run. It shows intelligence.

Posted by: naturalfake at May 30, 2015 04:41 AM (KUa85)

152 Think of how I feel. I can remember a huge debate on whether or not the federal government could bail out NYC with loans. The general feeling was that it was unconstitutional. It did not happen then (early 60s IIRC). Posted by: Vic We Have No Party at May 30, 2015 09:39 AM (GpgJl) I thought that was when President Ford was in Office. I remember the headlines in the NY Papers" Ford to NY: Drop Dead So that would be the 70s

Posted by: Nevergiveup at May 30, 2015 04:41 AM (/tNwW)

153 Cruz or SMOD! Meanwhile, back at public school house. Teacher Aide Found In Bathroom Allegedly Had Syringe In Arm http://goo.gl/u7njUE Democrats should never be in positions of authority, involving money or around children.

Posted by: Buckeye Abroad at May 30, 2015 04:42 AM (kdJud)

154 Think of how I feel. I can remember a huge debate on whether or not the federal government could bail out NYC with loans. The general feeling was that it was unconstitutional. It did not happen then (early 60s IIRC). Posted by: Vic We Have No Party at May 30, 2015 09:39 AM (GpgJl) Mid- 70s. Ford to New York: Drop Dead! (NY Post?)

Posted by: rd at May 30, 2015 04:42 AM (u/eTl)

155 Ok Vic. Getting off your lawn. Some days it just seems futile, then other days I want to pound heads.

Posted by: Infidel at May 30, 2015 04:42 AM (kCq6U)

156 142 I'm not only anti-illegal immigration, I want a hiatus on legal immigration. And the elimination of birth-right citizenship. In this age of easy transportation, we need to do something different.

Posted by: Grump928(C) at May 30, 2015 09:37 AM (rwI+c)


Y-not, put Grump928 at the top of the field. 

Posted by: flounder at May 30, 2015 04:42 AM (ecDRv)

157 Posted by: rd at May 30, 2015 09:42 AM (u/eTl) Beat ya. But Great Minds Think Alike

Posted by: Nevergiveup at May 30, 2015 04:43 AM (/tNwW)

158 I thought that was when President Ford was in Office. I remember the headlines in the NY Papers"

Ford to NY: Drop Dead

So that would be the 70s

Posted by: Nevergiveup at May 30, 2015 09:41 AM (/tNwW)



I am sure there was one even before that.

Posted by: Vic[/i] We Have No Party at May 30, 2015 04:44 AM (GpgJl)

159 Morning horde. Pool party at mi casa today. Yes, you must wear shorts. (Ette's excluded of course.... burkha for you) Now to read the thread and see who are savior will be.

Posted by: RWC - Team BOHICA at May 30, 2015 04:45 AM (XAFOu)

160 I am sure there was one even before that. Posted by: Vic We Have No Party at May 30, 2015 09:44 AM (GpgJl) That was the big one. Big News, Big headlines

Posted by: Nevergiveup at May 30, 2015 04:46 AM (/tNwW)

161 Here's how to sort out the GOP candidates: "If you aren't advocating Goldwater style deportations, please go home." FIFY

Posted by: SpongeBobSaget at May 30, 2015 04:47 AM (zauWW)

162 Posted by: Nevergiveup at May 30, 2015 09:43 AM I am the slowest typist in the west.

Posted by: rd at May 30, 2015 04:47 AM (u/eTl)

163 >>I like the thinking process in her run. It shows intelligence. I like that, but I just can't get past the lack of a record. Even for the VP slot. And when we have a great woman politician like Haley, and even a good one in Martinez, on the bench... it just irritates the shit out of me. Fiorina's candidacy seems to be something drawn up by the GOPe dudes in a boardroom somewhere. That aspect of it, the feeling that some establishment men got together and decided she should be the token woman, offends me.

Posted by: Y-not at May 30, 2015 04:47 AM (RWGcK)

164 Damn, meant to say, Eisenhower.

Posted by: SpongeBobSaget at May 30, 2015 04:47 AM (zauWW)

165 Well gotta shower and get not he Road to the Commissary at West Point before Fredo and our Republican "Friends" in the Senate totally kill the whole system.

Posted by: Nevergiveup at May 30, 2015 04:47 AM (/tNwW)

166 Let's face it, if Fiorina had ANY record, she couldn't run this type of attack dog campaign. It's the fact that she has no record to defend that enables her to do what she's doing.

Posted by: Y-not at May 30, 2015 04:48 AM (RWGcK)

167 Anyone else? Should I bother with Lindsey Graham? Posted by: Y-not at May 30, 2015 09:24 AM (RWGcK) Eh, Graham is there to be be McCain's surrogate. The happy couple expect a butt baby shortly after coffee this morning. Seriously though, his is a fake candidacy. He's there to torpedo non-hawks (Paul) and tea party conservatives (Cruz, Jindal, Walker, Carson). For all his horse-toothy goofiness, Miss Lindsey is smart and unlikely to be deluded about his non-chances. He's there to knock-off candidates unapproved by the "Gang of" coalition.

Posted by: naturalfake at May 30, 2015 04:48 AM (KUa85)

168 I'm not only anti-illegal immigration, I want a hiatus on legal immigration. And the elimination of birth-right citizenship. In this age of easy transportation, we need to do something different. Posted by: Grump928(C) at May 30, 2015 09:37 AM (rwI I guess you weren't polled for that crap they were pushing yesterday - majority are starting to think illegals should have the right to vote. I'd laugh heartily and FYNQ if I was asked that.

Posted by: RWC - Team BOHICA at May 30, 2015 04:48 AM (XAFOu)

169 I am the slowest typist in the west. Posted by: rd at May 30, 2015 09:47 AM (u/eTl) Well that happens as you get older, the flow....oh sorry read that as "Peeist" Never mind

Posted by: Nevergiveup at May 30, 2015 04:48 AM (/tNwW)

170 That aspect of it, the feeling that some establishment men got together and decided she should be the token woman, offends me. Posted by: Y-not at May 30, 2015 09:47 AM

Is that why you're considering "bothering with" Lindsey Graham?

Posted by: MrScribbler[/i] at May 30, 2015 04:49 AM (P8YHq)

171 I can't find the one I was thinking about from the 60s.  I did find the one about Ford.  Despite that quote they did get that bailout from the feds.


Another reason why talk is cheap.

Posted by: Vic[/i] We Have No Party at May 30, 2015 04:50 AM (GpgJl)

172 And when we have a great woman politician like Haley, and even a good one in Martinez, on the bench... it just irritates the shit out of me. Yes, THIS.^^^^^ However- There is a tide in the affairs of men. Which, taken at the flood, leads on to fortune; Omitted, all the voyage of their life Is bound in shallows and in miseries. On such a full sea are we now afloat, And we must take the current when it serves, Or lose our ventures. And unfortunately, Haley don't surf. I like her a lot and more or less feel this is her moment, but...

Posted by: naturalfake at May 30, 2015 04:51 AM (KUa85)

173 Is that why you're considering "bothering with" Lindsey Graham? Posted by: MrScribbler at May 30, 2015 09:49 AM (P8YHq) -- Nah. I just think i have to do a backgrounder on Fiorina, whom I had planned on ignoring. So given that, I want to do a couple of the others, like Santorum (to remind ourselves why we don't like him) and someone else. It's just a mode of working that I like to do when I'm digging through reference materials. So maybe Pataki can be the third, instead of Graham, simply b/c I know almost nothing about him.

Posted by: Y-not at May 30, 2015 04:52 AM (RWGcK)

174 And as for Lindsey Graham, I do not think he is gay, despite the name, never being married, and never having heard any romantic rumors about him and women in D.C.
Posted by: rd at May 30, 2015 09:29 AM (u/eTl)


Once upon a time, pretty much starting with Jackson, the method for winning high office was to be a "Westerner or Northerner with Southern leanings". This was supposed to be the Van Buren strategy, and it has been built upon since then: it a two-party electorate it is a means of building a coalition without having to build a coalition. This specific strategy ended about Lincoln's term, pretty much because it came to be viewed as being "Pro-Slavery" (True or not, I refuse to argue this here)

The next gasp of this strategy was to be a constitutionalists with statist/populist -> progressive leanings: This has played out in a number of variations from Free Silver, to FDR to the Great Society.  It looks to getting a bit shop worn and a lot of people are seeing it as becoming "Fascist", but it seems to be winning elections based on promises of continued bread and circuses....  I mean transfer payments.

Looking at some of the interesting things coming to light and rumors of others in state and federal levels...

I wonder if  "closeted" is the new iteration of this strategy.

Posted by: Kindltot at May 30, 2015 04:52 AM (t//F+)

175 Posted by: Nevergiveup at May 30, 2015 09:48 AM (/tNwW) It's not the flow, It is the limited volume that keeps me running to and fro.

Posted by: rd at May 30, 2015 04:52 AM (u/eTl)

176 Great, informative posts, Y-not. I like the idea I read up-thread -- Y-not as debate moderator. How about a debate run by AceofSpades and PJmedia? Anyone got big bucks to buy cable time?

Posted by: pyromancer76 at May 30, 2015 04:52 AM (zvcr8)

177 167  Eh, Graham is there to be be McCain's surrogate.

The happy couple expect a butt baby shortly after coffee this morning.


Seriously though, his is a fake candidacy. He's there to torpedo non-hawks (Paul) and tea party conservatives (Cruz, Jindal, Walker, Carson).

For all his horse-toothy goofiness, Miss Lindsey is smart and unlikely to be deluded about his non-chances.

He's there to knock-off candidates unapproved by the "Gang of" coalition.

Posted by: naturalfake at May 30, 2015 09:48 AM (KUa85)



Yes, he is a fake candidate, but he is there to assure knocking out any real conservative candidate after SC.  Conservatives will get no votes in IA or NH and SC is their first chance.  The RNCe is hoping the Lady Lindsay will keep them from getting any votes in SC too (proportional primary).

Posted by: Vic[/i] We Have No Party at May 30, 2015 04:54 AM (GpgJl)

178 Haley I surety awesome.. I'd want her to run just so these can cause massive microaggressions and need trigger warnings whenever viewed. http://tinyurl.com/myuozmr

Posted by: RWC - Team BOHICA at May 30, 2015 04:55 AM (XAFOu)

179 Thanks autocorrect.

Posted by: RWC - Team BOHICA at May 30, 2015 04:55 AM (XAFOu)

180 I'm not sure of this mythical time so many of you seem to think rock-ribbed conservatives were running the GOP. Bob Dole, Howard Baker and Everett Dirksen? Maybe you're thinking of the 1920s.

Posted by: I Work for Dick Jones at May 30, 2015 04:56 AM (LxhYr)

181 I think one of the conservative candidates can win. Then, he'll start talking about compassion and doing whatever the Chamber of Commerce says while diddling the interns on top of piles of dirty money. Maybe two out of the whole batch are not sleazebags. They are all politicians.

Posted by: Old Hob at May 30, 2015 04:56 AM (ZufZo)

182 Great, informative posts, Y-not. I like the idea I read up-thread -- Y-not as debate moderator. How about a debate run by AceofSpades and PJmedia? Anyone got big bucks to buy cable time? Posted by: pyromancer76 at May 30, 2015 09:52 AM (zvcr A website, server to live stream, and post it all on You Tube? Kill the networks, Hollywood, and their socialist minions.

Posted by: rd at May 30, 2015 04:57 AM (u/eTl)

183 The RNCe is hoping the Lady Lindsay will keep them from getting any votes in SC too (proportional primary). Posted by: Vic We Have No Party at May 30, 2015 09:54 AM

I'm thinking Graham sees that running for President has been berry, berry good for Shuckabee -- that sweet Fox gig, etc. -- and wants to get a seat on the Gravy Train.

In fact, I'm pretty sure that's what's driving several of the "Republican" wannabes.

Hell, I'd run if I thought I could tap into all that cash that's wasted spent on big-time political campaigns....

Posted by: MrScribbler[/i] at May 30, 2015 04:58 AM (P8YHq)

184 Whenever I hear Ms. Lindsey I am reminded of the gay guy on Family Guy. Ohhhhh noooo.

Posted by: RWC - Team BOHICA at May 30, 2015 05:02 AM (XAFOu)

185 And O'Malley is about to announce.

Posted by: RWC - Team BOHICA at May 30, 2015 05:03 AM (XAFOu)

186 >>I'd want her to run just so these can cause massive microaggressions and need trigger warnings whenever viewed.

A Cruz/Haley ticket certainly would turn them inside out. I'm sure the Left would find a way to explain away the diversity the ticket would embody, but not without making total fools of themselves.

Posted by: Lizzy at May 30, 2015 05:03 AM (q6kiT)

187 This whole mess looks no different than American Idol/Survivor. Let's all root for our guy! Maybe he'll win!! Sure, you get to vote, but do you really think you have any say in the results?

Posted by: BurtTC at May 30, 2015 05:04 AM (Dj0WE)

188 Remember Mississippi.

Posted by: GOPe Loves Jeb at May 30, 2015 05:04 AM (uGrec)

189 Yes, he is a fake candidate, but he is there to assure knocking out any real conservative candidate after SC. Conservatives will get no votes in IA or NH and SC is their first chance. The RNCe is hoping the Lady Lindsay will keep them from getting any votes in SC too (proportional primary).

Posted by: Vic We Have No Party at May 30, 2015 09:54 AM (GpgJl)

 

That's why I figure Huckabee is running too.  Sure he has the ego to run but whoever it was that urged him to do it this time is because they know he has no shot other than to siphon votes in IA and SC, helping to ensure the establishment candidate chances.

 

And that gets to the whole myth of the myth of the establishment bullshit.  The establishment exists.  If you're spouting its a myth then you're a delusional fuckwit or a dickbag that loves it.   If it didn't exist there would be no such thing as the RNC.  And if it didn't exist the RNC would have no purpose.  You don't think they have contacts at the state levels?  And don't know which staffers are reliable and tell them which campaign to join and know the volunteers to tap for ground game and GOTV efforts? 

Posted by: buzzion at May 30, 2015 05:06 AM (zt+N6)

190 183  I'm thinking Graham sees that running for President has been berry, berry good for Shuckabee -- that sweet Fox gig, etc. -- and wants to get a seat on the Gravy Train.

In fact, I'm pretty sure that's what's driving several of the "Republican" wannabes.

Hell, I'd run if I thought I could tap into all that cash that's wasted spent on big-time political campaigns....

Posted by: MrScribbler at May 30, 2015 09:58 AM (P8YHq)


We are not that lucky.  After he loses out in massive defeat he will just go back to the Senate and continue stabbing us in the back.

Posted by: Vic[/i] We Have No Party at May 30, 2015 05:06 AM (GpgJl)

191 A Cruz/Haley ticket certainly would turn them inside out. I'm sure the Left would find a way to explain away the diversity the ticket would embody, but not without making total fools of themselves. Posted by: Lizzy at May 30, 2015 10:03 AM

As far as the Democrats and MFM are concerned, Republicans have no particular races or genders. They all all simply racist neocon KKK-loving H8ers. There is n such thing as "diversity" except on the liberal side. See their treatment of Condoleeza Rice.

That said, I hope the Republicans don't make their choices based on Historic First-style pandering. It is reprehensible when anyone does it.

Posted by: MrScribbler[/i] at May 30, 2015 05:08 AM (P8YHq)

192 " And O'Malley is about to announce." This is the guy who as the Mayor of Baltimore, and the champion of "Zero Tolerance" policing, managed to see arrests almost equal to the entire population of the city of Baltimore. Think about that for a moment. Arrest totals almost equaling the entire population of a city.

Posted by: Village Idiot's Apprentice at May 30, 2015 05:09 AM (VPLuQ)

193 We are not that lucky. After he loses out in massive defeat he will just go back to the Senate and continue stabbing us in the back.  Posted by: Vic We Have No Party at May 30, 2015 10:06 AM

Why should he be any different? All the defeated candidates, no matter the party, are drawn back to slurp at the Public Trough. It's what they do.

Members of our political class are the biggest welfare queens on the planet.

Posted by: MrScribbler[/i] at May 30, 2015 05:11 AM (P8YHq)

194 Cruz/Haley would be awesomesause.

Posted by: Lauren at May 30, 2015 05:12 AM (DLBJh)

195 >>That aspect of it, the feeling that some establishment men got together and decided she should be the token woman, offends me.


Huh. I've gotten more of a Trump vibe, that it's her ego compelling her to run, not the GOPe (but I haven't paid close attention to her).

However, this interview w/Andrea Mitchell is pure gold. Damn, I wish the other candidates would bring it like this - especially the way she turns Mitchell's attempt to get her to say the GOP is discriminating against her is masterful.
http://preview.tinyurl.com/o9fhohk

Posted by: Lizzy at May 30, 2015 05:13 AM (q6kiT)

196 "Arrest totals almost equaling the entire population of a city." Well given what we've seen over the past month, that seems about right.

Posted by: Lauren at May 30, 2015 05:14 AM (DLBJh)

197 Why should he be any different? All the defeated candidates, no matter the party, are drawn back to slurp at the Public Trough. It's what they do. Members of our political class are the biggest welfare queens on the planet. Posted by: MrScribbler at May 30, 2015 10:11 AM (P8YHq) I guess we haven't quite reached absurd levels yet, but with a field of "candidates" in the teens, it becomes rather clear that this clown show has nothing to do with actually running for President. I'm sticking with my assumption, until there is evidence to the contrary: the R Party is going to nominate Jeb, and it's already been decided by the people who decide these things.

Posted by: BurtTC at May 30, 2015 05:16 AM (Dj0WE)

198 This is the  historical political moment in the USA,

Similar to the Gregory Peck Kisses Ava Gardner in
" ON The Beach"
 A movie that may imitate reality the way things are now.

Posted by: Mr Coffee at May 30, 2015 05:17 AM (/WmRg)

199 Red State had a good rundown on Santorum in 2012 including his support for No Child Left Behind, Medicare Part D, debt ceiling increases, funding the bridge to nowhere, refusing to redirect earmark allocations to disaster relief along the Gulf Coast post Katrina, etc.

Social con; pro big gov't

http://tinyurl.com/plqa3av

Posted by: duke at May 30, 2015 05:17 AM (enhDu)

200 >>That said, I hope the Republicans don't make their choices based on Historic First-style pandering. It is reprehensible when anyone does it.

I completely agree - which is why I didn't say Rubio/Carson.

I happen to like Cruz and Haley and would be totally on board regardless of their race/gender.

Posted by: Lizzy at May 30, 2015 05:18 AM (q6kiT)

201 Walker is a life-long squish politician. He must be exposed.

Posted by: Cpaguy at May 30, 2015 05:21 AM (QSZu4)

202 Sorry for OT. Daily Mail is now blacking out the koran. Pussies. That is exactly the point of the protest yesterday.

Posted by: RWC - Team BOHICA at May 30, 2015 05:24 AM (XAFOu)

203 I saw Squish Politician open for Frankie Goes to Hollywood at the Stonewall Inn in... Wait a sec, no I didn't. I don't even know what the Stonewall Inn is, you perverts.

Posted by: BurtTC at May 30, 2015 05:24 AM (Dj0WE)

204

Posted by: Cpaguy at May 30, 2015 10:21 AM (QSZu4)

 

List your preferred candidates.

Posted by: buzzion at May 30, 2015 05:24 AM (zt+N6)

205 OK, back from picking up my cat at the groomer's. She's even fluffier and silkier than usual. I don't find Paul's remarks terribly offensive. I remember imbeciles like McCain and Graham wanting to arm "moderate" rebels in Syria. How do we know they were moderate? Why, because people like McCain and Graham said so. And there seems to have been some sort of arms trafficking in Libya. If you think the Republican leadership in Congress didn't know what was going on there, I have a bridge to sell you. They knew. That's why they didn't seem too keen about getting to the bottom of it. They held some sham hearings to placate the people, then let the matter drop. Certainly Paul should have mentioned Obama and the Democrats' role in creating ISIS, but he was responding to a question about Graham. Paul is still my second choice after Walker. I don't think it's likely that he will get the nomination, but I think he's more serious than the others about reducing the size and scope of government, and returning us to obeying the Constitution. I also maintain that he is more likely than any other Republican to peel away some of the youth vote from the Democrats, which is a not inconsequential consideration.

Posted by: rickl at May 30, 2015 05:28 AM (sdi6R)

206 Another reason I'm enjoying Fiorina despite not being particularly jazzed about the idea of her being president: she's running against Hillary.

Maybe I've missed it, but I have not heard her disparage her fellow Republicans. THIS is awesome. As before, the MSM is going to do all they can to get this group of GOP hopefuls to tear each other apart while they get busy making Hillary/O'Malley/Warren look like they're inevitable and above such petty squabbling.

Posted by: Lizzy at May 30, 2015 05:28 AM (q6kiT)

207 I haven't had HPs. Because I refuse to and try to persuade others to avoid them. I've had friends have them crash. And under her they bought compaq. Which I did have extensive experience with. From high school to college. They were the shittiest buggiest slowest computers I've ever used. HP doesn't buy Compaq, then they don't survive. Say what you want about all of the corporate politics BS (and IIRC her successors got bounced out the door one after the other a lot faster than she did), but she saved HP as a viable company and helped them survive the dot com bust. A lot of companies didn't. Oh and she was very successful at AT&T and Lucient too. And she started out as a secretary. Yea, that Carly Fiorina, boy, there's no substance to her at all, how dare she waste everybody's time.

Posted by: Weirddave at May 30, 2015 05:28 AM (WvS3w)

208 I don't find Paul's remarks terribly offensive. I remember imbeciles like McCain and Graham wanting to arm "moderate" rebels in Syria. How do we know they were moderate? Why, because people like McCain and Graham said so. ... Posted by: rickl at May 30, 2015 10:28 AM (sdi6R) The problem is, if you are going to spit out the word "hawk" like it's poison, you start to sound like every rotten leftist who worked to undermine the mission in Iraq, and then tried to blame Bush for the "failure." It doesn't just offend those asses in Congress, it offends about 75% of the people who would be voting for you in the general election.

Posted by: BurtTC at May 30, 2015 05:33 AM (Dj0WE)

209 As much as 538 strives for fact based reporting, the "fake fact" subjective views Harry Enten uses to place GOP candidates on a scale really drives me nuts. Two reasons: his characterization of old GOP candidates is context free and almost laughable, and his views of current people are entirely his bias at work. Evidence? Look at where he places Huckster, a big government social con. Fifty years ago Huck would have been a mainstream LBJ Democrat.

Posted by: MTF at May 30, 2015 05:33 AM (DkJ4E)

210 Thanks Y-Not. Lot's of good data. To the horde: It must feel good to know that we're coming to our conclusions about the candidates using Venn-diagrams, white-papers, voting records and other assorted data. Just so our vote can be negated by someone who doesn't.

Posted by: OneEyedJack at May 30, 2015 05:36 AM (XmOA9)

211 Nude.

Posted by: GOPe Loves Jeb at May 30, 2015 05:37 AM (uGrec)

212 "Just so our vote can be negated by someone who doesn't. " Obamaphone!

Posted by: Lauren at May 30, 2015 05:37 AM (DLBJh)

213 >>"Just so our vote can be negated by someone who doesn't. "

"Si se peude!"

Posted by: Lizzy at May 30, 2015 05:39 AM (q6kiT)

214 Of those guys running the only ones I really care about: Cruz, Fiorino, Walker, Rubio, Jindal, Perry. The rest really don't matter to me. In the end it doesn't really matter. The Democrat wins, whoever it is. Hillary Clinton is running on getting a majority of women and a large minority of men, which would be enough to get her past the margin of fraud for a win.

Posted by: Christopher Taylor at May 30, 2015 05:40 AM (39g3+)

215 208 It doesn't just offend those asses in Congress, it offends about 75% of the people who would be voting for you in the general election. Posted by: BurtTC at May 30, 2015 10:33 AM (Dj0WE) True, but it might also appeal to mushy moderates and even some on the left. When I read some of Paul's statements that anger conservatives, I see him attempting a sort of verbal ju-jitsu (or is it judo?) designed to broaden his appeal to people who don't normally vote Republican, and even people who would cut off their own arm before voting Republican. Maybe I'm reading too much into it, but that's the sense I get.

Posted by: rickl at May 30, 2015 05:40 AM (sdi6R)

216 TRUMP!!!!!

Posted by: fretless at May 30, 2015 05:41 AM (WlWuy)

217 201 Walker is a life-long squish politician. He must be exposed. Posted by: Cpaguy at May 30, 2015 10:21 AM (QSZu4) Still waiting you little bitch driveby troll. List your preferred candidates.

Posted by: buzzion at May 30, 2015 05:42 AM (zt+N6)

218 Another reason I'm enjoying Fiorina despite not being particularly jazzed about the idea of her being president: she's running against Hillary. Maybe I've missed it, but I have not heard her disparage her fellow Republicans. THIS is awesome. -- Yes, I like that too. If she has attacked Republicans, I've missed it. Let me see what I learn when I research her. We'll learn a lot about her motivations and temperament in the debates... if she makes the cut. That's one challenge for the Smart Set -- how to cut out guys like Jindal (if he announces) and Perry, without cutting out their only woman candidate.

Posted by: Y-not at May 30, 2015 05:47 AM (RWGcK)

219 Fiorino is not particularly conservative, but she is good at attacking hypocrisy, inconsistency, and foolishness in government. She's also good at turning questions around to the topics she wants to talk about instead of the interviewer playing gotcha. Plus, yeah, she kicks the legs out from under the Hillary campaign by forcing people to think about what sort of woman they want in office rather than just "woman president." I still say it comes down to which candidate is the most homosexual-friendly though. That one wins, regardless of who they are.

Posted by: Christopher Taylor at May 30, 2015 05:51 AM (39g3+)

220 That's one challenge for the Smart Set -- how to cut out guys like Jindal (if he announces) and Perry, without cutting out their only woman candidate. Jindal and Perry belong on that stage. Huckabee, Santorum, not so much.

Posted by: Christopher Taylor at May 30, 2015 05:52 AM (39g3+)

221 The GOPe really really really seems to want Jeb. And they want us to want him which we don't. I know he's got the money behind him but his name is a liability, pure bait for the left/media and his politics are unacceptable to the right. What, he can win Florida? Maybe? I just don't get the super push for him.

Posted by: small town girl, crusader at May 30, 2015 05:54 AM (UYkjZ)

222 @163
Y-Not, sorry to be late to this thread, but since you and I seem to agree a lot, I'll say that I think you're way off base with your assessment of Fiorina.  She doesn't give me a GOPe vibe at all, but even if we assume you're correct, she's already demonstrated that she's a lot smarter and quicker thinking than they are.  The controllers would become the controlled.

Posted by: pep at May 30, 2015 05:56 AM (LAe3v)

223 "I see no reason why anyone should be allowed to own a gun"

Posted by: Dr. Ben Carson at May 30, 2015 05:56 AM (KCxzN)

224 Walker is a life-long squish politician.
He must be exposed.
Posted by: Cpaguy

Thanks for your input.  How are things at the Wisconsin Teacher's Union?

Posted by: pep at May 30, 2015 05:57 AM (LAe3v)

Posted by: pep at May 30, 2015 05:58 AM (LAe3v)

226 Missed by that >< much.

Posted by: The Barrel at May 30, 2015 05:59 AM (uGrec)

227 >>The GOPe really really really seems to want Jeb. And they want us to want him which we don't.

Anyone else getting a Fred Thompson-ish vibe from Jeb, like his heart really isn't in it so much as he feels this is something he *should* do?

Posted by: Lizzy at May 30, 2015 06:04 AM (q6kiT)

228 Anyone else getting a Fred Thompson-ish vibe from Jeb, like his heart really isn't in it so much as he feels this is something he *should* do?

Yes, and that's why I don't really worry about him anymore.  When he first announced, virtually every talking head, including Fox, said he was all but inevitable.  He's looking very evitable.

Posted by: pep at May 30, 2015 06:05 AM (LAe3v)

229 Y-Not, sorry to be late to this thread, but since you and I seem to agree a lot, I'll say that I think you're way off base with your assessment of Fiorina. She doesn't give me a GOPe vibe at all --- Thanks, pep. That's good to hear. I will do some research into her for next week.

Posted by: Y-not at May 30, 2015 06:05 AM (RWGcK)

230 I agree that Jeb doesn't really seem to want to be president all that much. I think he was pushed into it by powers that be and cronyists, but is not all that keen on the idea.

Posted by: Christopher Taylor at May 30, 2015 06:06 AM (39g3+)

231 Someone mentioned a while back that they thought Jeb was a stalking horse for Rubio, who is the candidate the GOPe really want. I find that theory intriguing.

Posted by: rickl at May 30, 2015 06:08 AM (sdi6R)

232 I'm less worried about Jeb than I am about Rubio. Christie seems to have killed his own chances, so I am not too worried about him, either. I just don't trust Rubio at all. Not just his immigration assholery, but also this most recent "fast track" vote. If Cruz hurt/killed his chances with that vote, it should go double for Rubio. I'm sick of reading about how good-looking Rubio is and about how afraid the Dems are of running against him. I don't believe either of those things and they both remind me of the fake "buzz" that Team Mitt tried to create about him.

Posted by: Y-not at May 30, 2015 06:09 AM (RWGcK)

233 >>Someone mentioned a while back that they thought Jeb was a stalking horse for Rubio..

Yes, this makes sense. We'll see if Rubio inherits Jeb's team when he fades out.

Posted by: Lizzy at May 30, 2015 06:09 AM (q6kiT)

234 I could stand Rubio, though. We're not going to ever get a candidate that's solid on immigration, period. We're not going to see a congress that is smart on immigration. So to me that's an utterly irrelevant issue, as much as it annoys me. Its like turning down a guy because he's all wrong on fighting Chetari. Its irrelevant to the campaign.

Posted by: Christopher Taylor at May 30, 2015 06:11 AM (39g3+)

235 To me the difference between Jeb and Marco on immigration is that Rubio has at least taken the effort to lie to me. But I think we can do better on that issue. I'm particularly interested to see if Jindal catches on. Also curious to see if Walker's "conversion" is sincere or not.

Posted by: Y-not at May 30, 2015 06:14 AM (RWGcK)

236 I mean, face it, Rubio is Romney's pick. That kind of gives me the willies.

Posted by: Y-not at May 30, 2015 06:15 AM (RWGcK)

237 I'd just love to have a GOP debate stage filled with women and minorities to shove up the legacy media's uh, nose. Not for any particular merit of the gender or ethnic background, but just to make Hillary look even older and whiter, and the press and left to look even stupider than usual. But they're still trying the "old white men" gag. That New Yorker cover that tries to portray the GOP as all white men with Hillary trying to get into the club was so pathetically false and idiotic it was difficult to believe, even from that rag.

Posted by: Christopher Taylor at May 30, 2015 06:22 AM (39g3+)

238 @237 Yeah, I agree.

Posted by: Y-not at May 30, 2015 06:25 AM (RWGcK)

239 232 I just don't trust Rubio at all. Not just his immigration assholery, but also this most recent "fast track" vote. If Cruz hurt/killed his chances with that vote, it should go double for Rubio. Posted by: Y-not at May 30, 2015 11:09 AM (RWGcK) I agree completely. Making kissy-face with Schumer on amnesty should have finished him. I do believe the GOPe wants him. They're the ones who are constantly telling us that the Hispanic vote is crucial, and will become even more important in the future. Of course, that's because the border is wide open and neither party has the slightest interest in closing it. What better way to win the Hispanic vote than with a "historic first" Hispanic candidate? The stalking horse theory says that after conservatives recoil in horror from a Jeb Bush candidacy, we can be persuaded to "settle" for Rubio, who at least sounds conservativish on some things.

Posted by: rickl at May 30, 2015 06:31 AM (sdi6R)

240 Thanks, everyone, for your participation. See you next week! I gotta run to the butcher's, but gardening thread will probably go up around 1:30 Eastern.

Posted by: Y-not at May 30, 2015 06:35 AM (RWGcK)

241 >>I agree completely. Making kissy-face with Schumer on amnesty should have finished him.

Yes, that showed him to be a rube an incapable of working with Democrats without being made a doormat.

Also not cool with his saying one thing in English, and another in Spanish (on Telemundo, I think?) recently re: immigration.
F#@% that sh$t.

Posted by: Lizzy at May 30, 2015 06:45 AM (q6kiT)

242 I was a fan of Santorum when he was a Senator, but he's honestly gone off the rails with some of the SoCon crusades. I honestly think him being associated with the GOP is a lot like Al Sharpton and Jesse Jackson with the Democrat Party.

Posted by: Kal at May 30, 2015 06:54 AM (13G+x)

243 The most interesting thing about the Rand Paul "created these people" statements is how the response has consisted entirely of people getting hugely upset about it and saying how bad bad bad it is, and absolutely nobody demonstrating in any way that it is false.

Posted by: Rollory at May 31, 2015 02:30 AM (z2L/U)

244 Walker, Cruz, Fiorina, Perry and Jindal would make for outstanding Presidents. Perry and Jindal would be terrible candidates. Fiorina should be our VEEP nominee - not having held office, and being attackable in her record as CEO of HP precludes her being our POTUS candidate. The Leftist media will have no trouble painting Perry as a stupid redneck(his "Ooops" last time was no help). I love him for his, (loosely paraphrasing) 'I intend to make the federal government as irrelevant as possible in your daily lives". ALL R's should stand for this, in deed as well as on the stump. His record in TX is fantastic, with a few minor exceptions, and I trust his instincts on the issues, but the Left would destroy him in the general election. Jindal has been even better as a governor than Perry, but he's just terrible as a stump speaker. Awful. Love love love to have him as POTUS, absolute nightmare as a candidate. Paul, as Jindal points out, is to the LEFT of Democrats on foreign policy and national defense. He's a Libertarian, not a Conservative. There are BIG differences. The Amnesty supporters we need to oppose at all costs: Jeb, Rubio, Rand Paul, Christie - all of them are completely unacceptable. Best chance the D's have of passing their Holy Grail Amnesty legislation is with a supportive R POTUS like Rubio. After which, the US becomes a totalitarian socialist state, permanently, and is flooded with 3rd world immigrants - both from south of the border and by Muslims. Carson is interesting, I'd support him for Senate or Congressmen, but nowhere near ready for primetime as a POTUS candidate. There are MANY issues that he has literally given zero thought to, and when questioned reveals either ignorance or support for the liberal Democrat position. Christie and Pataki are essentially liberal Democrats on all but one issue each (for Christie, it is his opposition to the NJ Teacher's Union having a deathgrip on NJ legislature and state supreme court). Pataki is also a has been. Huckabee & Santorum - Evangelical Christian support, but we need far more than that. Also, Cruz will get the same support and is an actual Constitutional Conservative, so why would anyone support Huck or Santorum over Cruz? Graham - like McCain and Joe Lieberman, he's a liberal Democrat on EVERYTHING with the sole exception of national defense / foreign policy. Odd that a former R Potus Nominee, D VEEP nominee, and current R Potus wannabe have essentially identical voting records and political positions. Kasich - Insane for him to think that he's viable after his unilateral expansion of Medicaid, in support of Obamacare, in Ohio - in clear defiance of the express will of the R controlled legislature. No chance at all. Plus, he seems to be, personally, a reall (_!_). Bottom line, on the issues Cruz is my man. But, IMO, our best chance of a winner that will actually represent our issues is Governor Walker, and Fiorina is proving that she'd be an effective fighter as VP candidate. Going for the jugular in ways an R POTUS candidate must refrain (or get slaughtered by the Liberal controlled media). NO PRO-AMNESTY candidates. Or, kiss this country goodbye.

Posted by: Aarradin at May 31, 2015 02:55 PM (E1dWk)

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