December 30, 2013

Good News: The NSA Can Hack Every iPhone, Remotely
— Ace

I cannot summarize this article because I don't understand it, beyond the headline information.

"DROPOUT JEEP is a software implant for the Apple iPhone that utilizes modular mission applications to provide specific SIGINT functionality. This functionality includes the ability to remotely push/pull files from the device. SMS retrieval, contact list retrieval, voicemail, geolocation, hot mic, camera capture, cell tower location, etc. Command, control and data exfiltration can occur over SMS messaging or a GPRS data connection. All communications with the implant will be covert and encrypted."

I believe this is part of an elite NSA hacking group called either QUANTUM or QUANTUMTHEORY. I am not sure they're connected, but they have similar names, and similar missions. Der Spiegel has a long article on their capabilities.

ake, for example, when they intercept shipping deliveries. If a target person, agency or company orders a new computer or related accessories, for example, TAO can divert the shipping delivery to its own secret workshops. The NSA calls this method interdiction. At these so-called “load stations,” agents carefully open the package in order to load malware onto the electronics, or even install hardware components that can provide backdoor access for the intelligence agencies. All subsequent steps can then be conducted from the comfort of a remote computer.

These minor disruptions in the parcel shipping business rank among the “most productive operations” conducted by the NSA hackers, one top secret document relates in enthusiastic terms. This method, the presentation continues, allows TAO to obtain access to networks “around the world.”

I'm not so certain I am worried about this. I keep saying this, but we went through this in the 1970s, when the nation got upset about how the CIA had been conducing itself.

The NSA said approximately that in its defense:

Responding to a query from SPIEGEL, NSA officials issued a statement saying, "Tailored Access Operations is a unique national asset that is on the front lines of enabling NSA to defend the nation and its allies." The statement added that TAO's "work is centered on computer network exploitation in support of foreign intelligence collection." The officials said they would not discuss specific allegations regarding TAO's mission.

Are we really upset to discover that the national security apparatus has been thinking up new ways to spy on targets?

If so -- what did everyone think we were paying them to do, exactly?

Posted by: Ace at 01:18 PM | Comments (296)
Post contains 415 words, total size 3 kb.

1 1

Posted by: Misanthropic Humanitarian at December 30, 2013 01:19 PM (HVff2)

2

If you spy on everyone the same it is fair.

 

and everyone likes fairness

Posted by: The 4th A in an alternate world at December 30, 2013 01:20 PM (W6iIX)

3 I would suspect Gabe is doing fucking cartwheels wherever he is

Posted by: Misanthropic Humanitarian at December 30, 2013 01:20 PM (HVff2)

4 I dunno..., what are we paying the IRS to do? The EPA? Justice Department?

Posted by: Mike Hammer at December 30, 2013 01:21 PM (aDwsi)

5 Are we really upset to discover that the national security apparatus has been thinking up new ways to spy on targets?


 No, we're upset because the American public is part of the targets.

Posted by: alexthechick - Really Universe Really? at December 30, 2013 01:22 PM (Gk3SS)

6 >>>>

If so -- what did everyone think we were paying them to do, exactly?

 

um,

spy on known terrorists( that would be muslims, Alex) or potential terrorists?  and not everyone

 

 

 

Posted by: zipline Bob at December 30, 2013 01:22 PM (W6iIX)

7 Yay!!

Posted by: NCKate at December 30, 2013 01:22 PM (Auy5s)

8 I assume any decent intel agency can hack any piece of IT equipment that it gets physical access. If not then they suck as spies.

Posted by: Flatbush Joe at December 30, 2013 01:22 PM (ZPrif)

9 4 I dunno..., what are we paying the IRS to do? The EPA? Justice Department? Posted by: Mike Hammer at December 30, 2013 06:21 PM (aDwsi) Eww, eww raises hand. To screw over John Q. Public Mr. Hammer?

Posted by: Misanthropic Humanitarian at December 30, 2013 01:23 PM (HVff2)

10

"Are we really upset to discover that the national security apparatus has been thinking up new ways to spy on targets?

If so -- what did everyone think we were paying them to do, exactly?"

 

I don't like being one of their targets, is all.

Posted by: troyriser at December 30, 2013 01:23 PM (O66NZ)

11 If we were more serious about immigration laws 9/11 does not happen.

And the rebuttal to all of this spying is - The Tsanarov brothers.

And fuck you NSA!!!

Posted by: Kreplach at December 30, 2013 01:23 PM (Xkr8I)

12

.Are we really upset to discover that the national security apparatus has been thinking up new ways to spy on targets?

>If so -- what did everyone think we were paying them to do, exactly?

---ace


I expect the NSA to spy on foreigners, whom are usually smelly and rife with disease.

Posted by: Dr Spank at December 30, 2013 01:23 PM (DpEwG)

13 Good question, actually. What the hell is the point of the CIA?

Posted by: soothsayer at December 30, 2013 01:23 PM (ki07/)

14 Article doesn't say they spy on every iPhone. Also, not clear that they can hack it remotely. Seems to imply they need physical access to install hack -- then they can *activate* the hack remotely. Two very different things.

Posted by: Flatbush Joe at December 30, 2013 01:24 PM (ZPrif)

15 Yeah, I’m not sure what the uproar is here. This program appears to be one that targets specific individuals and only hacks the phones of those specific individuals? And requires physical access to the phones to implement? That’s nothing like grepping or even storing the entire domestic communications network. It’s the difference between tracking everyone’s movements or just putting a tracer on a single car.

Posted by: Stephen Price Blair at December 30, 2013 01:24 PM (WX3R9)

16

If so -- what did everyone think we were paying them to do, exactly?

 

PEOPLE !!

Do not go there !! totes serious

V
V
V
V
V
V
V
V

seriously, serious

Posted by: Justice John Roberts at December 30, 2013 01:25 PM (W6iIX)

17 Eww, eww raises hand. To screw over John Q. Public Mr. Hammer? Posted by: Misanthropic ------------------- No, no...., nothing so crass as that. The idea, rather, is to suppress dissidents, by whatever means necessary.

Posted by: Mike Hammer at December 30, 2013 01:25 PM (aDwsi)

18 More specifically, do we really need obama's CIA?

Posted by: soothsayer at December 30, 2013 01:25 PM (ki07/)

19 Also, ZeroHedge is increasingly just InfoWars with bond market jokes.

Posted by: Flatbush Joe at December 30, 2013 01:25 PM (ZPrif)

20 I bought a 9 buck trakfone with double minutes. I keep it in the car for emergencies. It costs 80 bucks a year to maintain. I have about 3000 minutes accumalated. People shd just stop carrying cell phones. You're not that special.

Posted by: Bean Pies, ey? at December 30, 2013 01:26 PM (Qev5V)

21 Executive Summary:  they use the phone's texting capability to send data out of the phone and deliver new payloads onto it.

Posted by: Purp[/i][/b][/s] at December 30, 2013 01:26 PM (70Unk)

22 17 Eww, eww raises hand. To screw over John Q. Public Mr. Hammer? Posted by: Misanthropic ------------------- No, no...., nothing so crass as that. The idea, rather, is to suppress dissidents, by whatever means necessary. Posted by: Mike Hammer at December 30, 2013 06:25 PM (aDwsi) Resolution, I will not be so crass, it will not be so crass.

Posted by: Misanthropic Humanitarian at December 30, 2013 01:27 PM (HVff2)

23 As all the terrorists just ran out for androids.

Posted by: NCKate at December 30, 2013 01:27 PM (Auy5s)

24 I told you I was HACKED!!

Posted by: Anthony Weiner at December 30, 2013 01:28 PM (RJMhd)

25 But they still need physical access first, right?

Posted by: Flatbush Joe at December 30, 2013 01:28 PM (ZPrif)

26 @21

And the beauty part is your probably paying for the payload to be inserted and extracted from your phone.

Posted by: Kreplach at December 30, 2013 01:28 PM (Xkr8I)

27 As all the terrorists just ran out for androids.

Posted by: NCKate at December 30, 2013 06:27 PM (Auy5s)

 

 

v

v

v

v

v

v

we got a back door for that

Posted by: Google at December 30, 2013 01:29 PM (W6iIX)

28 I'd like the NSA to find out who's leaking this stuff before I trust them to wash my car.

Posted by: Dr Spank at December 30, 2013 01:29 PM (DpEwG)

29 You're not that special. Posted by: Bean Pies, ey? at December 30, 2013 Yes i am. According to the 4th amendment I am.

Posted by: Misanthropic Humanitarian at December 30, 2013 01:29 PM (HVff2)

30 @25

Your kidding right?

Posted by: Kreplach at December 30, 2013 01:29 PM (Xkr8I)

31 I'm glad Ace is awake.

Posted by: Bean Pies, ey? at December 30, 2013 01:29 PM (Qev5V)

32 I told you I was HACKED!!

Posted by: Anthony Weiner at December 30, 2013 06:28 PM (RJMhd)

 

 

you and me both, bro

Posted by: Carlos Danger at December 30, 2013 01:30 PM (W6iIX)

33 ZeroHedge was pushing that fake Fukushima Is Gonna Kill Us All story hard a few days ago. It was linked here on the sidebar even.

Posted by: Flatbush Joe at December 30, 2013 01:30 PM (ZPrif)

34 32 I told you I was HACKED!! Posted by: Anthony Weiner at December 30, 2013 06:28 PM (RJMhd) you and me both, bro Posted by: Carlos Danger at December 30, 2013 06:30 PM (W6iIX) *********** I knew it. The NSA was after pics of my ----!

Posted by: Brett Favre Inserts his knowledge into U at December 30, 2013 01:31 PM (RJMhd)

35 Anyone who criticizes "backdoor access" is a vile homophobe who must be fired!!11!

Posted by: wooga at December 30, 2013 01:31 PM (f+0kK)

36 I would suspect Gabe is doing fucking cartwheels wherever he is Posted by: Misanthropic Humanitarian at December 30, 2013 06:20 PM (HVff2) No he isn't.

Posted by: The NSA at December 30, 2013 01:31 PM (AymDN)

37

The NSA was after pics of my ----!

Posted by: Brett Favre Inserts his knowledge into U at December 30, 2013 06:31 PM (RJMhd)

 

Just the watch yo!

Posted by: The NSA at December 30, 2013 01:32 PM (W6iIX)

38 So now the terrorists will just pay retail at Best Buy and walk out with no NSA bugs.

Posted by: Lincolntf at December 30, 2013 01:32 PM (ZshNr)

39 The true question becomes, just how deep into the NSA's control are various companies. Its entirely possible to implant monitor software using the Update process.... as most everyone updates their software.... The only way to find out what your computer or phone is sending? Put it in a sanitized sandbox and monitor what data it is sending out.... Its like the LG Smart TV... if its connected to the net it sends packets EVERY time you change channels, to an LG site... it was discovered by a Brit who saw some weird traffic on his network while busting packets...

Posted by: Romeo13 at December 30, 2013 01:32 PM (lZBBB)

40 Unfortunately "targets" these days is the Tea Party.

Posted by: Beagle at December 30, 2013 01:32 PM (sOtz/)

41 "Of course ya do it. Everybody does it. I just did it, and I'm ready to do it again!"

Hoard, tis the season to drop a $20 in Ace's pot... DO IT!

Posted by: OG Celtic-American at December 30, 2013 01:32 PM (vHRtU)

42 I was going to see Dropout Jeep open for The Who in Cinci back in '79, but...

Posted by: itchytriggerfinger at December 30, 2013 01:32 PM (XwN3V)

43

Posted by: The NSA at December 30, 2013 06:31 PM (AymDN)

 

you're next you little sock steeler!

Posted by: The NSA at December 30, 2013 01:33 PM (W6iIX)

44 3 I would suspect Gabe is doing fucking cartwheels wherever he is Posted by: Misanthropic Humanitarian

Cartwheels? Gabe is more of a jazz hands type celebrator.

Posted by: Dr Spank at December 30, 2013 01:33 PM (DpEwG)

45 40 Unfortunately "targets" these days is the Tea Party. Posted by: Beagle at December 30, 2013 06:32 PM (sOtz/) Or anyone who disagrees with the regime

Posted by: Misanthropic Humanitarian at December 30, 2013 01:33 PM (HVff2)

46 The issue is less they can do this than it is they're doing it w/o a warrant or w/in some overly-broad Patriot Act, NSA legislation.

Posted by: rdbrewer at December 30, 2013 01:33 PM (Iyg03)

47 I have no problem with them being able to spy.  But if it's Americans were talking about, get a warrant. 

Posted by: rdbrewer at December 30, 2013 01:34 PM (Iyg03)

48 E911 is required by law for all mobile/cellular devices and carriers, so location tracking has been around for over a decade. So tracking is basically required by law for "safety". Also, physical access to any computer device, including smart phones, means it can be rooted by any kind of expert in Computer Security/Intrusion.

I'd be more worried about what constitues a warrant, or if that is even needed by the Government at this point.

Posted by: Hillary's Royalty at December 30, 2013 01:34 PM (rCS6C)

49 Go long on tin cans and string.

Posted by: Anna Puma (+SmuD) at December 30, 2013 01:35 PM (f1IeF)

50 Where is Weiner's chubby porn star wannabee girlfriend, Sydney, these days?

Posted by: Bean Pies, ey? at December 30, 2013 01:35 PM (Qev5V)

51 Nixon + J Edgar Hoover + Hugo Chavez = ??

Posted by: soothsayer at December 30, 2013 01:35 PM (09CLD)

52 I don't like it. I don't trust them.

Posted by: grammie winger at December 30, 2013 01:35 PM (P6QsQ)

53 But if it's Americans were talking about, get a warrant.

Posted by: rdbrewer at December 30, 2013 06:34 PM (Iyg03)

 

 

we donneed no stinking warents

Posted by: The NSA at December 30, 2013 01:35 PM (W6iIX)

54 No, we're upset because the American public is part of the targets.

Bingo.  The process matters. 

Posted by: no good deed at December 30, 2013 01:36 PM (HsJeN)

55 51 Nixon + J Edgar Hoover + Hugo Chavez = ?? ****** Hillary 2014

Posted by: Karnaq at December 30, 2013 01:36 PM (RJMhd)

56 Err, pretty sure that description doesn't say they can hack a phone remotely, just remote control it after sticking it on a bench for a while.

Posted by: Josh C at December 30, 2013 01:37 PM (XGabL)

57

Nixon + J Edgar Hoover + Hugo Chavez = ??

******

Hillary 2014

Posted by: Karnaq at December 30, 2013 06:36 PM (RJMhd) 

 

Joey B. 2016 

Posted by: zipline Bob at December 30, 2013 01:37 PM (W6iIX)

58 "If so -- what did everyone think we were paying them to do, exactly?" Well, not to discriminately profile, that's for sure. Better to infiltrate, scan, collect, hoard, and archive every bit of data possible. That way we can recreate a timeline of all the agency fcukups that ignored the obvious after the terrorists have won; and subsequently create even more invasive laws.

Posted by: AnonymousDrivel at December 30, 2013 01:38 PM (eHIJJ)

59 49 Go long on tin cans and string. Posted by: Anna Puma (+SmuD) at December 30, 2013 06:35 PM (f1IeF) Shh, We are working on that now

Posted by: NSA Research at December 30, 2013 01:38 PM (XwN3V)

60 Good News: The NSA Can Hack Every iPhone, Remotely Better news: I don't have an iPhone. Even better news: I don't even have a smartphone. Just a older slider model with basic Internet accessibility that serves my purposes adequately. Enjoy your iPhones, bitches!!!

Posted by: Blacque Jacques Shellacque at December 30, 2013 01:38 PM (G5cc0)

61

Are we really upset to discover that the national security apparatus has been thinking up new ways to spy on targets?

If so -- what did everyone think we were paying them to do, exactly?





I'm not trying to tick you off, Ace, but this would be like asking "are we really upset to discover that the US military has been thinking up new ways to kill people?" after, say, a U.S.Air Force entity remote-bombed Seattle.

The NSA is supposed to think up new ways of spying. It's not supposed to be spying on US persons--yes, that's the proper nomenclature--or US allies while based in a given allied country.

Posted by: baldilocks at December 30, 2013 01:38 PM (36Rjy)

62 People shd just stop carrying cell phones. You're not that special. ---- Because paying the same amount for a landline that doesn't play music, surf the web, or work while you're running is a smart idea.

Posted by: Jenny Kind of Likes Her Phone at December 30, 2013 01:38 PM (5JhS+)

63 I am so sorry I asked: http://goo.gl/Qt8Cza

Posted by: Bean Pies, ey? at December 30, 2013 01:39 PM (Qev5V)

64 Yeah and the response of the "domestic targets" in the 70s backlash was a nutpunched intel community. Help me out here, if it was okay for the very fucking hippy generation now in charge to hamstrong our capability in a nuclear level contest with a tier one power what is the risk here? I love the circles the left has gotten to argue in the last decade on privacy and opfor threat disposition. The target for this capability ain't AQ it is TP.

Posted by: sven10077 at December 30, 2013 01:39 PM (TE35l)

65 When I'm told by my government that I may be questionable simply by having a veteran in the family or belonging to an unapproved church, I say uh-uh to this whole can of worms.

Posted by: grammie winger at December 30, 2013 01:39 PM (P6QsQ)

66 Shh, We are working on that now. Yeah, I’m pretty sure cheap lasers have been able to handle tin cans and a string for quite a while now. That and windows.

Posted by: Stephen Price Blair at December 30, 2013 01:39 PM (WX3R9)

67 Nothing wrong with spying on US allies. They damn sure spy on us.

Posted by: Flatbush Joe at December 30, 2013 01:39 PM (ZPrif)

68 Hasan e-mailed effin Anwar al-Alaki and the Tsarnavs were open, known jihadi symps. The recruiter shooter in Little Rock named himself Mujahid. Counterterror is absolutely not what they are doing. Aside from sting operations, they never catch anyone. By choice. It is Obama policy to be stupid about jihad and then deny jihad after it happens. Every. Single. Time.

Posted by: Beagle at December 30, 2013 01:39 PM (sOtz/)

69 Remember when the Mossad put C4 in the the PLO Puke's cell and gave him the phone sex of his life, rotfflmao....

Posted by: OG Celtic-American at December 30, 2013 01:40 PM (vHRtU)

70 The Dems spent most of Bush's presidency portraying the administration as Big Brother (while still portraying him as a moronic caricature).  Now it's just some rogue agency that gives them something to posture against.

Posted by: Shoot Me at December 30, 2013 01:40 PM (qiXMt)

71 If you don't understand that the government has back doors in absolutely everything you are deluding yourself.

The government has had the ability to do all sorts of nefarious things to it's citizens since the formation of the country, what we have not had is a weaponized beuaracracy that was willing to do these things under the guise of security and a judiciary that will give them carte-blanche.


As I have said, the 9/11 terrorists were all in the country on immigration violations, the government knew of them and chose not to do anything about them.

The NSA has been gathering data for a long time and knew about the Tsnarov brothers, hell the Russians told alerted the alphabets about them, the alphabets did nothing, because the Tsnarovs are not the enemy.

We are the enemy!

Posted by: Kreplach at December 30, 2013 01:40 PM (Xkr8I)

72 But if it's Americans were talking about, get a warrant.

Yep, 1 warrant per person per crime per year.  And No you can't make being a Moron a crime.

Posted by: DaveA[/i][/b][/s] at December 30, 2013 01:41 PM (DL2i+)

73 I want the most competent spy organization on the planet but I also want non-political judicial oversight (stop laughing) holding the reigns. Overseas? Have at it guys.

Posted by: Todd Wiley at December 30, 2013 01:41 PM (lrkg9)

74
I would suspect Gabe is doing fucking cartwheels wherever he is
Posted by: Misanthropic Humanitarian




Glancing at his tweets du jour, he spent the day defending the NSA, celebrating drone testing and happy tweeting because he got to wear jeans to work,

Posted by: Laurie David's Cervix at December 30, 2013 01:41 PM (kdS6q)

75 55 51 Nixon + J Edgar Hoover + Hugo Chavez = ?? ****** Hillary 2014 Posted by: Karnaq at December 30, 2013 06:36 PM (RJMhd) ********** Jeebus-- I meant 2016 but I pissed myself when I came up with the answer and went too early. Still you know it is happening.... She'll rework Kanye West's Black Skinhead as her campaign song. And there will be no stopping her. We will all be too busy with the circular firing squad.

Posted by: Karnaq at December 30, 2013 01:41 PM (RJMhd)

76 Note.... the document is from 2007.... Under Bush.... who had SOME restraints... Now? under O? with 6 more years to 'fix' this technology???? and strong arm companies????

Posted by: Romeo13 at December 30, 2013 01:42 PM (lZBBB)

77 Meh - this doesn't bother me. All I use my phone for is to come here and play Deer Hunter. NSA is already reading everything here, so...

Posted by: shredded chi, the young curmudgeon at December 30, 2013 01:42 PM (hW6y3)

78 Even better news: I don't even have a smartphone. Just a older slider model with basic Internet accessibility that serves my purposes adequately. If your phone can surf the Internet, then it has modifiable software inside. Anyone with physical access who wants to can insert the same type of software into it. It’s ZeroHedge, so they’re trying to make it sound mysterious with strange capital letters, but SIGINT is just software interrupts. They have been in computers since the seventies. It’s nothing new, and if your phone does Internet, your phone has it.

Posted by: Stephen Price Blair at December 30, 2013 01:42 PM (WX3R9)

79 65 Grammie Winger, Correct and "wrong church" means any non liberation theology Chritian faith.

Posted by: sven10077 at December 30, 2013 01:42 PM (TE35l)

80 71. Exactly They do not act on the known bad guys . That is not their goal.

Posted by: grammie winger at December 30, 2013 01:42 PM (P6QsQ)

81 I expect the NSA to spy on foreigners, whom are usually smelly and rife with disease.
Posted by: Dr Spank


Not to mention they play soccer.  And do you know what soccer lacks?  That's right, cheerleaders.  No cheerleaders, no elbows.  I say we fight the sans elbows. 

Posted by: pep at December 30, 2013 01:43 PM (6TB1Z)

82 (That the SIGINT they’re talking about is interrupts and not signal intelligence, is my reading of the article.)

Posted by: Stephen Price Blair at December 30, 2013 01:43 PM (WX3R9)

83 Still not clear if these iPhone hacks require physical access. Leaning towards yes.

Posted by: Flatbush Joe at December 30, 2013 01:44 PM (ZPrif)

84 And the beauty part is your probably paying for the payload to be inserted and extracted from your phone.

Assuming the tech description is accurate, they'd be doing it via SMS to minimize performance impacts that might tip off the user that anything was going on.

Small short bursts of data won't be a visible "front of screen" performance impact.

If there's a ton of stuff they wanted to move, and they weren't in a hurry and paced it out over the span of days, you might not even notice the battery life impact. 

A phone's storage being brain sucked at full speed via this scheme would, of necessity, experience severely degraded battery life.  THAT is unavoidable unless added power grabbing operations for the hack are throttled below the level of human perception.

Humans notice 10% differences, that's about our threshold of perception for "felt in the seat of your pants" performance variances.  If they only stole 5-7%, you'd never notice.

Posted by: Purp[/i][/b][/s] at December 30, 2013 01:44 PM (70Unk)

85
Just think of it as if that Big Brother Television is your SmartPhone.  Feel better?

Posted by: Bob at the NSA at December 30, 2013 01:44 PM (MaP11)

86 Curious about corporate spying and the utility of gaining access to phones. I'm sure there are some board meetings worth listening in on. Are companies already banning all phones from sensitive meetings or areas?

Posted by: Todd Wiley at December 30, 2013 01:45 PM (lrkg9)

87

you'll beeeeee sorrrrrrryyyyyy

 

 

Posted by: Justice John Roberts at December 30, 2013 01:45 PM (W6iIX)

88 I often feel like my smart phone has turned on me anyway, so at least I now have someone to blame. Well, I mean, besides Bush.

Posted by: Mallamutt, RINO President for Life at December 30, 2013 01:46 PM (OWjjx)

89 Yeah, I’m pretty sure cheap lasers have been able to handle tin cans and a string for quite a while now. That and windows. Many many years ago there was a little piece in Popular Electronics that briefly described this capability. Like in the late 70s.

Posted by: Blacque Jacques Shellacque at December 30, 2013 01:46 PM (G5cc0)

90 Don't any of you morons watch Person of Interest???

Posted by: Bean Pies, ey? at December 30, 2013 01:46 PM (Qev5V)

91 The problem with these big data dumps is that it's very very difficult to glean information from huge data sets to find the individuals you want. If you already know who the individuals are, then it's quite easy to glean all the information about them that you want. Like, say, a political opponent.

Posted by: AmishDude at December 30, 2013 01:46 PM (xSegX)

92 for "felt in the seat of your pants" performance variances.

Nuh-uh.

Posted by: Every Butt-Dyno K&N buyer ever[/i][/b][/s] at December 30, 2013 01:46 PM (DL2i+)

93 The problem isn't that the government can do this. It is that they have shown that they cannot be trusted with this capability.

Posted by: gm at December 30, 2013 01:47 PM (K0tm3)

94 Like, say, a political opponent.

Posted by: AmishDude at December 30, 2013 06:46 PM (xSegX)

 

 

yo!

I've been sayin 'dat da whole time

Posted by: Justice John Roberts at December 30, 2013 01:47 PM (W6iIX)

95 Many many years ago there was a little piece in Popular Electronics that briefly described this capability. Like in the late 70s.

Drive up 295 past DIA sometime.  The building is huge, with little tiny slit windows that look like a prison.  There's a reason.

Posted by: pep at December 30, 2013 01:47 PM (6TB1Z)

96 Hillary - The Benghazi Bitch

Posted by: Flatbush Joe at December 30, 2013 01:47 PM (ZPrif)

97
iSpy

Posted by: Hate Miser at December 30, 2013 01:47 PM (2ljO9)

98   The NSA says it's all good and they are totes responsible and stuff.  Well, that's a load off my mind.  The NSA can't catch bad guy terrorists before they blow up a marathon or fly a plane into a building.... but, they are gonna make sure that my Tea Party activities are recorded and reported on to the person in charge in this administration.  Keep up the good work boys.  We are all proud of you out here in middle America.

Posted by: Some Guy in Wisconsin at December 30, 2013 01:48 PM (wE2+Q)

99 88 Mallamutt, I knew my android is stepping out, I don't know if its crush is Barry or Soros.

Posted by: sven10077 at December 30, 2013 01:48 PM (TE35l)

100 Don't any of you morons watch Person of Interest???

Posted by: Bean Pies, ey? at December 30, 2013 06:46 PM (Qev5V)

 

YES. He's very... "interesting."

Posted by: Califemme at December 30, 2013 01:48 PM (MffOI)

101 If only they'd done this to see who was buying blank VHS tapes in bulk in Pakistan in the 2000s.

Posted by: Chris_Balsz at December 30, 2013 01:48 PM (5xmd7)

102 Do you really think the current thugs in office would have any qualms about using information gained this way for corrupt purposes?

Posted by: grammie winger at December 30, 2013 01:48 PM (P6QsQ)

103 If only they'd done this to see who was buying blank VHS tapes in bulk in Pakistan in the 2000s.

Posted by: Chris_Balsz at December 30, 2013 06:48 PM (5xmd7)

 

 

oohhh, a thinker

Posted by: zipline Bob at December 30, 2013 01:49 PM (W6iIX)

104 102 Do you really think the current thugs in office would have any qualms about using information gained this way for corrupt purposes?

Don't you worry, sweetcakes, I'm on it.

Posted by: Eric Holder at December 30, 2013 01:49 PM (6TB1Z)

105 any qualms about using information gained this way for corrupt purposes?

Posted by: grammie winger at December 30, 2013 06:48 PM (P6QsQ)

 

 

That would be a nope, right there

Posted by: The IRS at December 30, 2013 01:50 PM (W6iIX)

106 Do you really think the current thugs in office would have any qualms about using information gained this way for corrupt purposes? There are rules against that!

Posted by: The Internal Revenue Service at December 30, 2013 01:50 PM (OWjjx)

107 102 Do you really think the current thugs in office would have any qualms about using information gained this way for corrupt purposes? Posted by: grammie winger at December 30, 2013 06:48 PM (P6QsQ) No, hell no.

Posted by: Misanthropic Humanitarian at December 30, 2013 01:50 PM (HVff2)

108

Damn you Pixy.  You better stop stealing my spaces..... or....... or..... or else!

Posted by: Some Guy in Wisconsin at December 30, 2013 01:51 PM (wE2+Q)

109 OK. We can't sue the government. Can we sue the cell phone manufacturers? Yeah I know. All those pages of stuff and all.

Posted by: Golfman in. NC at December 30, 2013 01:51 PM (/djtm)

110 78: no, SIGINT is Signal Intelligence.

Posted by: knob at December 30, 2013 01:51 PM (dite0)

111 104 102
Do you really think the current thugs in office would have any qualms
about using information gained this way for corrupt purposes?


Don't you worry, sweetcakes, I'm on it.
Posted by: Eric Holder


Say, just out of curiosity, you haven't been anywhere near Charlottesville, VA lately, have you?

Posted by: pep at December 30, 2013 01:52 PM (6TB1Z)

112 Posted by: Purp at December 30, 2013 06:44 PM (70Unk) You write it so it only sends the data while it is recharging... thus no impact on battery life. With 3G or 4G access... throttle it to 10% bandwidth and the user would never notice... as both tend to fluctuate naturally.... Or you write it so it only sends data while recharging AND while screen is Asleep (dark)...

Posted by: Romeo13 at December 30, 2013 01:52 PM (lZBBB)

113 I guess their clever enough to root their own phone so they get rid of all the crapware that is pre-installled.

Posted by: YIKES! at December 30, 2013 01:53 PM (mETGQ)

114 If your phone can surf the Internet, then it has modifiable software inside. It does that just barely. The only thing I use the Internet connection for is to see what time the local LD Amtrak train comes rolling through town. Otherwise, it rarely ever gets surfed on (too cumbersome), and there are no "apps" installed on it. It's a phone, and that's basically what it's used as. If the NSA is going to do something to modify what's in my phone, they'll need to physically take it from me first, for all the good that'll do them.

Posted by: Blacque Jacques Shellacque at December 30, 2013 01:53 PM (G5cc0)

115 Anyone still use semaphore flags?

Posted by: itchytriggerfinger at December 30, 2013 01:53 PM (XwN3V)

116 1. Ace, the problem is that now we're all targets. There's apparently little or no oversight and if a technology cam be abused, it will be. If the NSA will illegally spy on "love interests", do you think they won't illegally spy on political opponents? 2. Betcha the NSA's a rider on every Amazon delivery drone, per FCC regulation.

Posted by: Xavier at December 30, 2013 01:54 PM (JqAxf)

117 96 Hillary - The Benghazi Bitch Posted by: Flatbush Joe at December 30, 2013 06:47 PM (ZPrif) ******* That's how she will check Biden. Plus--our new voting class didn't even care when it happened--in 2016? Forget about it--they have. And the media will make sure it stays that way. It's Hillary all the way. We won't stop her--we are too afraid to focus on the ultimate threat--so instead we will take each other down. That's always "easier"--and makes people feel like they accomplished something.

Posted by: Karnaq at December 30, 2013 01:54 PM (RJMhd)

118 I wonder, not at all sarcastically, what George Washington or Teddy Roosevelt would do...

Posted by: OG Celtic-American at December 30, 2013 01:54 PM (vHRtU)

119 Todd Wiley: "Curious about corporate spying and the utility of gaining access to phones. I'm sure there are some board meetings worth listening in on." For certain. Smart phones are essentially micro-computers now with the miniaturization of tech and the ability to offload datastreams to the internet. Der Spiegel has an ongoing series inspired by the Snowden leaks. As a private sector infiltration (ab)use example, Petrobras in Brazil was a major espionage target because "interests" wanted to know where to offshore drill, and Petrobras is the best in the world at discovering and mapping productive fields. Oil, being the geopolitical commodity it is, was of interest to both government and friends of government. Clearly a whole new world of security is on its way to deter smartphone espionage in the corporate meeting domain.

Posted by: AnonymousDrivel at December 30, 2013 01:54 PM (eHIJJ)

120
Can we sue the cell phone manufacturers?
Posted by: Golfman in. NC




California court.

On an issue relating to the Obama administration.

Lotto odds on winning.

Posted by: Laurie David's Cervix at December 30, 2013 01:54 PM (kdS6q)

121 "If so -- what did everyone think we were paying them to do, exactly?"



Perhaps figure out that We The People aren't the enemy that needs to be spied upon - or is that asking too much?

Posted by: [/i] [/s] [/u] [/b] An Observation at December 30, 2013 01:54 PM (ylhEn)

122 The government is now treating all Americans the way high school principals treat their students: Screw over everyone just to be sure that... A. You get the guilty party B. Nobody can be accused of singling out anyone in particular. It stinks.

Posted by: Niedermeyer's Dead Horse at December 30, 2013 01:55 PM (DmNpO)

123 LDC. Had I thought it through..

Posted by: Golfman in. NC at December 30, 2013 01:55 PM (/djtm)

124
Jana Kramer, the hot Nationwide catsuit girl.

http://tinyurl.com/q7u58sc

Trivia: She is also a country singer and  sings the Nationwide  jingle in the commerical.


Posted by: noone, really [/i] [/b] at December 30, 2013 01:57 PM (5ikDv)

125 "So now the terrorists will just pay retail at Best Buy and walk out with no NSA bugs" But the NSA knows who you are and how you vote.

Posted by: Decaf at December 30, 2013 01:57 PM (eta5+)

126 If I owned Apple stock, I'd have sold it yesterday.

Posted by: Jeffrey Quick at December 30, 2013 01:57 PM (0v4Ix)

127 118 I wonder, not at all sarcastically, what George Washington or Teddy Roosevelt would do... Posted by: OG Celtic-American at December 30, 2013 06:54 PM (vHRtU) GW would be pissed TR would think its awesome

Posted by: Misanthropic Humanitarian at December 30, 2013 01:58 PM (HVff2)

128 "I have no problem with them being able to spy. But if it's Americans were talking about, get a warrant. " FISA will take care of that.

Posted by: Decaf at December 30, 2013 01:59 PM (eta5+)

129 Lick me on Facebook!

Posted by: soothsayer at December 30, 2013 01:59 PM (09CLD)

130 > 126 If I owned Apple stock, I'd have sold it yesterday.

Cept 99% of Apple/iSuckHoboDick users think this is a GOOD thing...

Posted by: OG Celtic-American at December 30, 2013 01:59 PM (vHRtU)

131 67 Nothing wrong with spying on US allies. They damn sure spy on us.

Posted by: Flatbush Joe at December 30, 2013 06:39 PM (ZPrif)


Sure. But we are not supposed to do it while stationed on their territory. And spying on the German Chancellor's cellphone is a bit much.

Posted by: baldilocks at December 30, 2013 02:00 PM (36Rjy)

132 Ace hasn't gone all opportunistic kid libertarian in the Obama era? That's cool

Posted by: blue.dot at December 30, 2013 02:01 PM (hrJm2)

133 The Wicked Bitch of.Benghazi.

Posted by: Dr Spank at December 30, 2013 02:01 PM (DpEwG)

134 "FISA will take care of that." You know it. Just received a new, bulk shipment of rubber stamps last week.

Posted by: FISA Court at December 30, 2013 02:01 PM (eHIJJ)

135 Der Spiegel---how shit didn't they hack Merkel's phone? But linking to Zerohedge...ugh--sorry but that's a den of anti-Semites.

Posted by: Karnaq at December 30, 2013 02:01 PM (RJMhd)

136 77 Meh - this doesn't bother me. All I use my phone for is to come here and play Deer Hunter. NSA is already reading everything here, so... Posted by: shredded chi, the young curmudgeon at December 30, 2013 06:42 PM (hW6y3) Hell, they even comment here.

Posted by: rickl at December 30, 2013 02:01 PM (sdi6R)

137 The real problem with this is that they do not have to NOTIFY you if you are the subject of a warrant. A search warrant? Needs to be served... you know it happens... This stuff? You never know if you are the subject of a warrant or not... Yet, with this, you are NOT safe in your 'papers'.... And anyone else would HAVE to get a warrant, to get this info....

Posted by: Romeo13 at December 30, 2013 02:02 PM (lZBBB)

138 132 blue duck, Go fellate a chainsaw.

Posted by: sven10077 at December 30, 2013 02:03 PM (TE35l)

139 Ugh I just bought a new desktop in April. I knew I should have just built one.

Posted by: Dack Thrombosis at December 30, 2013 02:03 PM (oFCZn)

140 My friends, you have nothing to fear with Barack Obama in the White House.

Posted by: John McCain at December 30, 2013 02:03 PM (Pr6hk)

141 "Correct and "wrong church" means any non liberation theology Chritian faith." I should be OK then seeing as my Pope is the flavor of the year with all the magazines not to mention being this year's best dressed.

Posted by: Decaf at December 30, 2013 02:03 PM (eta5+)

142 quantum theory? is Dennis hopper involved?

Posted by: Bigby's Knuckle Sandwich at December 30, 2013 02:03 PM (RLTt1)

143 Benghazi on Special Report Bin Laden's 1998 fatwa was an effort to decentralize jihad against America and our allies, civilian and military. To say a jihadi is "not al Qaeda" misses the entire point and methodology of jihad for, now, 15 years (but really almost 1400). They all share the exact same goals found in Islamic theology. It is not a phobia when a half billion people sympathize with the few million who want to play soccer with your head.

Posted by: Beagle at December 30, 2013 02:04 PM (sOtz/)

144 Hodor!

Posted by: Hodor at December 30, 2013 02:04 PM (g1DWB)

145 You know it. Just received a new, bulk shipment of rubber stamps last week. Posted by: FISA Court at December 30, 2013 07:01 PM (eHIJJ) Yeah, there was a FISA court who BLASTED the NSA for a lack of controls on who was getting this info.... and then in the same document expanded their mandate to get more data... /facepalm

Posted by: Romeo13 at December 30, 2013 02:04 PM (lZBBB)

146 Jana Kramer, the hot Nationwide catsuit girl.

Holeeee crap, that is one beautiful woman.

Posted by: pep at December 30, 2013 02:04 PM (6TB1Z)

147 137 Romeo13, Come on trust us, we are just as non-partisan as IRS & EPA.... //N$A

Posted by: sven10077 at December 30, 2013 02:05 PM (TE35l)

148 It is not a phobia when a half billion people sympathize with the few million who want to play soccer with your head. Posted by: Beagle at December 30, 2013 07:04 PM (sOtz/) Yup.... a Phobia is an IRRATIONAL Fear... I'm totally rational in my Fear of what Islam is... for as Patton said of Rommel... "I read your damned book!!"

Posted by: Romeo13 at December 30, 2013 02:05 PM (lZBBB)

149 @146
Yeah isn't she something?

 I Google -stalked her today after watching the commercial.

I need as much beauty as possible in my life lately. : )

Posted by: noone, really [/i] [/b] at December 30, 2013 02:07 PM (5ikDv)

150 Smart phones are essentially micro-computers

They got some heavy weight compute power in the 4-core CPU generation. 

They're basically handheld computers that can also make phone calls.  The percentage of telephony aspects has declined to the point where you can consider it a wart on the side of a general purpose handheld computer.

Posted by: Purp[/i][/b][/s] at December 30, 2013 02:07 PM (70Unk)

151 Posted by: Purp at December 30, 2013 07:07 PM (70Unk) Yeah... but I'm waiting for the Ipad that can make a phone call.... So I can SEE the damn thing.... LOL

Posted by: Romeo13 at December 30, 2013 02:08 PM (lZBBB)

152 No, article does not say it can all be done remotely. Once initially hacked it can. The slide specifically says they can't do it remotely but hope to in the future. The slide says the initial implant has to be done with "close access methods" -- ie physical access.

Posted by: Flatbush Joe at December 30, 2013 02:09 PM (ZPrif)

153 "And anyone else would HAVE to get a warrant, to get this info...." John Gotti learned he had been taped while sitting in court.

Posted by: Chris_Balsz at December 30, 2013 02:10 PM (5xmd7)

154 The slide says the initial implant has to be done with "close access methods" -- ie physical access. Posted by: Flatbush Joe at December 30, 2013 07:09 PM (ZPrif) Slide is from 2007..... 6 years ago....

Posted by: Romeo13 at December 30, 2013 02:10 PM (lZBBB)

155 More Jana.

http://tinyurl.com/o7zj5kn

Posted by: noone, really [/i] [/b] at December 30, 2013 02:10 PM (5ikDv)

156 The linked article does not say the NSA can hack every iPhone remotely. It says, once an initial implant is installed, then it can remotely control the iPhone. That's not remotely shocking to me at all. Ace, I think this headline is misleading.

Posted by: Flatbush Joe at December 30, 2013 02:11 PM (ZPrif)

157 "Do you really think the current thugs in office would have any qualms about using information gained this way for corrupt purposes?" Gramma, and they didn't therefore Obama's second term.

Posted by: Decaf at December 30, 2013 02:12 PM (eta5+)

158 NSA: "I never had sex with that woman. Even if she is your mother, In a wheelchair. Utterly demented. Whose greatest statement these days is 'pooped 'em'.

And even if I did she's a lying bitch out to frame me with a paternity suit 'cause she fucked the entire football team. Three months ago. And they are all the father of that child.

Because, Tequila. And she's a slut. Like Benghazi, and Wookies.

The Benghazi-Chewbakka Defense. Ya, that's the ticket.

'Cause she is a 97 year old slut that fucked the football team three months ago so the dick glove doesn't fit and also because fuck you beasty-normative infinitive-gender self hate drama queer inclusive Rose Bowl float SQUIRREL!

Posted by: OG Celtic-American at December 30, 2013 02:12 PM (vHRtU)

159 The reason they are intercepting iPhone shipments is, presumably, so they can install the initial implant. Because they can't do it remotely.

Posted by: Flatbush Joe at December 30, 2013 02:12 PM (ZPrif)

160 Still not clear if these iPhone hacks require physical access. Leaning towards yes.

Posted by: Flatbush Joe at December 30, 2013 06:44 PM (ZPrif) 



"DROPOUT JEEP is a software implant for the Apple iPhone that utilizes modular mission applications to provide specific SIGINT functionality"



Doesn't sound like from the above description. All that's required is that the subject phone download an "update". So Apple (acting as a proxy for the NSA) tells you there is a bug in your iPhone's firmware, and you need to download an update, and then you get the malware, right off Apple's server. Or someone you know sends you a "LOL, you gotta watch this..." Bingo, again.



Posted by: Alberta Oil Peon at December 30, 2013 02:13 PM (60Q+L)

161 Please God just don't let the NSA have webcam footage of me masturbating to The Goodbye Girl that one time.

Posted by: Dack Thrombosis at December 30, 2013 02:13 PM (oFCZn)

162 Maybe they can do it remotely now, I have no idea. Wouldn't be surprised if they could. The more phones are just like regular computers, they more they can be hacked just like regular computers. And regular computers can be hacked remotely.

Posted by: Flatbush Joe at December 30, 2013 02:14 PM (ZPrif)

163 The linked article does not say the NSA can hack every iPhone remotely. "for example, when they intercept shipping deliveries. If a target person, agency or company orders a new computer or related accessories, for example, TAO can divert the shipping delivery to its own secret workshops. The NSA calls this method interdiction" True. Article DOES state that they can AND do interdict your shipment.

Posted by: rickb223 at December 30, 2013 02:15 PM (CRyse)

164 160 Alberta Oil Peon, When this nation goes overt police state it will be the worst one in Pan-Anglic history.

Posted by: sven10077 at December 30, 2013 02:16 PM (TE35l)

165 Alberta Oil, yeah and the next paragraph of the slide says specifically that it can't be installed remotely, but they hope to do so in the future. That line you quoted was from that same slide.

Posted by: Flatbush Joe at December 30, 2013 02:16 PM (ZPrif)

166 Please God just don't let the NSA have webcam footage of me masturbating to The Goodbye Girl that one time.

If you hadn't uploaded it to YouTube, they might have missed it.

Posted by: Blanco Basura at December 30, 2013 02:17 PM (JawqV)

167 138 Sven, awesome suggestion

Posted by: Misanthropic Humanitarian at December 30, 2013 02:17 PM (HVff2)

168 Please God just don't let the NSA have webcam footage of me masturbating to The Goodbye Girl that one time. *** Marsha Mason?!!

Posted by: Niedermeyer's Dead Horse at December 30, 2013 02:17 PM (DmNpO)

169 Mainly, we're interested because there are reasonable fears that the government is not being restricted by the Constitution or even the Rule of Law. We know for example that the IRS and the FBI have - between themselves and separately - violated the Constitutional rights of over 140 million Americans based on their political leanings. Every day that the IRS corporately avoids life imprisonment for a significant portion of their workforce is a day that we are assured we have sub-citizen standings before our own government. That's why people are concerned about the NSA's abilities.

Posted by: Inspector Cussword at December 30, 2013 02:19 PM (xJS2Q)

170 167 Misanthropic Humanitarian, I like cutting to the chase...

Posted by: sven10077 at December 30, 2013 02:19 PM (TE35l)

171 They do not need physical access to your phone to compromise it. If you are connected to a network and you are the target they can insert. They have the keys to the castle and the blessing of the regime and the establishment to do whatever they want. We have no standing and quite frankly not enough people on our side who thinks this is a big fucking deal to make it a big fucking deal. Sucks to be us but there it is.

Posted by: Kreplach at December 30, 2013 02:19 PM (Xkr8I)

172 but I'm waiting for the Ipad that can make a phone call....

You'll probably be waiting forever.  Technically its (relatively) trivial.  They want you to buy BOTH devices though.

Posted by: Purp[/i][/b][/s] at December 30, 2013 02:19 PM (70Unk)

173 171 We even have folks "on our side" who think this is great.

Posted by: grammie winger at December 30, 2013 02:21 PM (P6QsQ)

174 >>Are we really upset to discover that the national security apparatus has been thinking up new ways to spy on targets?<<

No, indeed that is what we pay them to do.

But if they are spying on Americans or picking targets at the discretion of political operatives, we should chop their dicks off.

Posted by: Marcus at December 30, 2013 02:21 PM (MDwlR)

175 171 Kreplach, It's why we're fucked...on the bright side within a 1/2 decade I will be going dark.

Posted by: sven10077 at December 30, 2013 02:21 PM (TE35l)

176

You know...just *reading* the data on a phone or device is bad. Just think,though, they could also ADD data to your device. They don't like you? Suddenly "proof" of various crimes (you never committed) show up on your devices.

 

Posted by: gman at December 30, 2013 02:22 PM (UkbKS)

177 Don't worry. TFG has got it all in hand.  All in hand.  Relax.

Posted by: Sphynx at December 30, 2013 02:22 PM (OZmbA)

178 You'll probably be waiting forever. Technically its (relatively) trivial. They want you to buy BOTH devices though.

Posted by: Purp at December 30, 2013 07:19 PM (70Unk)


Just put Skype on your iPad. Or buy a real computer, and put Skype on it.

Posted by: Alberta Oil Peon at December 30, 2013 02:22 PM (60Q+L)

179 This is why I always keep my phone camera pointed at my junk.

Posted by: johnd01 at December 30, 2013 02:23 PM (r0+v0)

180 why couldn't you get an ipad app for voip and do it that way?

Posted by: Bigby's Knuckle Sandwich at December 30, 2013 02:23 PM (xRg8A)

181 176 gman, Tell me about it... //Lamar Alexander's office?

Posted by: sven10077 at December 30, 2013 02:23 PM (TE35l)

182 Thanks for ruining my week gman

Posted by: grammie winger at December 30, 2013 02:23 PM (P6QsQ)

183 179 This is why I always keep my phone camera pointed at my junk.

Posted by: johnd01 at December 30, 2013 07:23 PM (r0+v0)



Hey!


Me, too!!

Posted by: Carlos Danger at December 30, 2013 02:23 PM (OZmbA)

184 Kreplach, that might be true -- but that is not what the articles and slide in the links are saying. The slide specifically says the implant/exploit has to be installed with "close access". It can then be activated remotely and new software packages can be uploaded remotely and data can be downloaded remotely. That's different from being able to hack any iPhone on the planet at any moment. I have no idea if they can do that or not.

Posted by: Flatbush Joe at December 30, 2013 02:24 PM (ZPrif)

185 179 johnd01, How ya doin'? //Ant'knee Wienah

Posted by: sven10077 at December 30, 2013 02:24 PM (TE35l)

186 @172 You can buy iPads with cellular phone capability.

Posted by: Kreplach at December 30, 2013 02:25 PM (Xkr8I)

187 New Rule RE: digital processing devices Upon receipt, flash the BIOS after confirming checksums of source. Not perfect but more perfect than it is now. Defensive computing and telecommunicating needs a new chapter.

Posted by: AnonymousDrivel at December 30, 2013 02:25 PM (eHIJJ)

188 If they have such unfettered access what's going to keep them from planting files and framing someone? Ah, I forget myself, they'd never do that.

Posted by: Motorhead at December 30, 2013 02:25 PM (qAMin)

189 175 sven I'm not convinced that's possible anymore

Posted by: Bigby's Knuckle Sandwich at December 30, 2013 02:25 PM (RLTt1)

190

The Patriot Act that Bush signed...expired.

 

And it was mild compared to the version of it that Barky signed, to re-authorize all this.

 

The new version was laden down with new powers for the NSA, that they didn't have under Bush.

Posted by: wheatie at December 30, 2013 02:25 PM (1ScqE)

191 US law enforcement has been using techniques like this for years. FBI has entire fake cell nodes out there designed to intercept communications. People, NOTHING you do over the air is private. It is all subject to being intercepted and it always has been. Heck, the Clintons were intercepting cell phone calls of political rivals back in the 1990's.

Posted by: crosspatch at December 30, 2013 02:26 PM (ZbLJZ)

192 186 @172

You can buy iPads with cellular phone capability.

Posted by: Kreplach at December 30, 2013 07:25 PM (Xkr8I)



Ahh, but can you buy maxi-pads with duracell capability?

Posted by: Sandra Fluke at December 30, 2013 02:27 PM (OZmbA)

193 You can buy iPads with cellular phone capability.
Hey, look at the dork with the picture frame next to his face!

Posted by: Biff Tannen at December 30, 2013 02:27 PM (Ua6T/)

194 189 Bigby's Knuckle Sandwich, Eh you can, I'd have to give here up and paying the bills by internet, but you know I had a boomer today and I was pondering how much more free the nation was prior to Al Gore creating the interwebs.

Posted by: sven10077 at December 30, 2013 02:27 PM (TE35l)

195 190 The Patriot Act that Bush signed...expired. And it was mild compared to the version of it that Barky signed, to re-authorize all this. The new version was laden down with new powers for the NSA, that they didn't have under Bush. Posted by: wheatie at December 30, 2013 07:25 PM (1ScqE) Whether that is true or not I don't really know, but I knew it was trouble when it first passed. I predicted all this shit years and years ago.

Posted by: Dack Thrombosis at December 30, 2013 02:28 PM (oFCZn)

196 anyway, they're just being cheap since those Chinee bastids would be glad to just add those devices on the assembly line for em

Posted by: Bigby's Knuckle Sandwich at December 30, 2013 02:28 PM (Pnmq/)

197 @184 They can do what they want when they want at this point. If you are the target and your phone lies on a network, data or cellular, they can compromise it.

Posted by: Kreplach at December 30, 2013 02:28 PM (Xkr8I)

198 Why don't we just spy on everyone in case someone does something wrong?

Posted by: freaked at December 30, 2013 02:29 PM (Yc4/E)

199 Just about done reading an old Koontz novel, "Strange Rivers of The Heart", because MIDDLE CLASS, and it is so right on about this very subject. It takes a few quotes from his never-dying Book of Counted Sorrows to really get to the meat of the subject but, damn, he has an "unnamed" agency doing all kinds dastardly deeds with their super smart master computer. The book is now less than fiction and more like present reality.

Posted by: Pecan Sandi at December 30, 2013 02:30 PM (QEqvj)

200
The Patriot Act that Bush signed...expired. And it was mild compared to the version of it that Barky signed, to re-authorize all this.The new version was laden down with new powers for the NSA, that they didn't have under Bush.
Posted by: wheatie




2011: the legislation passed the Senate, 72 to 23, and the House, 250 to 153

So, Team Hopeless gave their usual helpsies.

Posted by: Laurie David's Cervix at December 30, 2013 02:31 PM (kdS6q)

201 This why need to vote for Jeb Bush or for his dog. Either one, doesn't matter.

Posted by: eman at December 30, 2013 02:31 PM (EWsrI)

202 Eman would that dog be red?

Posted by: freaked at December 30, 2013 02:32 PM (Yc4/E)

203 This why need to vote for Jeb Bush or for his dog. Either one, doesn't matter. *** What difference, at this point, does it make?

Posted by: Niedermeyer's Dead Horse at December 30, 2013 02:32 PM (DmNpO)

204 176 You know...just *reading* the data on a phone or device is bad. Just think,though, they could also ADD data to your device. They don't like you? Suddenly "proof" of various crimes (you never committed) show up on your devices. Posted by: gman at December 30, 2013 07:22 PM (UkbKS) Kiddie porn. It doesn't sound like it would be hard to do. Get caught with kiddie porn on your computer and you won't have a single friend left in the world. Your own family would disown you. Am I paranoid to think that maybe that's what's hanging over the heads of prominent Republicans, including John Roberts?

Posted by: rickl at December 30, 2013 02:32 PM (sdi6R)

205 200 Laurie David's Cervix, Quite, anytime Freedom needs a hand you can count on the Gee Oh Pee to grab a leg...

Posted by: sven10077 at December 30, 2013 02:32 PM (TE35l)

206 Vote for me!

Posted by: Red Dog Republican at December 30, 2013 02:33 PM (Yc4/E)

207 194 sven i dunno. there's already sats what can read the date on a dime, this crap, now the drone rollouts, then unified databases and fusion centers, and appliances that phone home, etc. i think to go dark maybe you've gotta be dead.

Posted by: Bigby's Knuckle Sandwich at December 30, 2013 02:33 PM (E3HCo)

208 207 Bigby's Knuckle Sandwich, I'll be closer to being ash too.... Work on a decent arborial canopy, hide capabilities in plain sight.... Dunno

Posted by: sven10077 at December 30, 2013 02:35 PM (TE35l)

209 What did Lucius Fox say about this in Dark Knight?

Posted by: Marcopohlo at December 30, 2013 02:35 PM (p+RU7)

210 I wonder how long the poor guys listening in can last. Can you imagine? "'Lo" "Whadaya doin'?" "Nuthin', whadayoo doin'?" "Nothin'" "Wanna do sumpthin'?" "I dun"-BOOM!!! "Waht was dat?" "I dunno, though it was on your end."

Posted by: Meremortal, not listening at December 30, 2013 02:35 PM (jTKU5)

211 198 that works if it's mutual. surveillance no, sousveillance si

Posted by: Bigby's Knuckle Sandwich at December 30, 2013 02:35 PM (E3HCo)

212 So, once more our freedom of speech is at risk because some bureaucrat feels it is his right to intercept a computer and put spyware on it?  Somehow I think more Tea Party members are targeted here than jihadists.  Just based on past performance of the regime in control of America.

Posted by: TimothyJ at December 30, 2013 02:36 PM (ep2io)

213 A scifi writer, Greg Bear, I think, came up with an answer: no privacy at all for anyone anywhere anytime. Yeah, the whole world could watch you fap or drop a stool, but on the other hand there was almost no crime.

Posted by: eman at December 30, 2013 02:36 PM (EWsrI)

214 I saw an Iphone in a movie once.

Posted by: Boss Moss at December 30, 2013 02:37 PM (ShvtX)

215 Kiddie porn. It doesn't sound like it would be hard to do. Get caught with kiddie porn on your computer and you won't have a single friend left in the world. Your own family would disown you. Am I paranoid to think that maybe that's what's hanging over the heads of prominent Republicans, including John Roberts? No you are not.

Posted by: Grey Fox at December 30, 2013 02:38 PM (jbb0E)

216
A scifi writer, Greg Bear, I think, came up with an answer: no privacy at all for anyone anywhere anytime.
Posted by: eman



David Brin.

Posted by: Laurie David's Cervix at December 30, 2013 02:38 PM (kdS6q)

217 The reason they are intercepting iPhone shipments is, presumably, so they can install the initial implant. Because they can't do it remotely.

 

Posted by: Flatbush Joe at December 30, 2013 07:12 PM (ZPrif)

 

why intercept when you can take care of this at the fac tory?

Posted by: dDan at December 30, 2013 02:38 PM (hwYmz)

218 Didn't iphone open for Droid a while back?

Posted by: Meremortal, waves lighter at December 30, 2013 02:39 PM (jTKU5)

219 These questions are all supposed to be rhetorical, right? Yes, we should be worried and upset that the NSA is stealing items and messing with them. Yes, we should be worried and upset that the NSA is spying on all U.S. Citizens. Yes, we should be worried and upset that the NSA can swipe all your information from your phone, from a distance. Anyone who's not worried is being a fool.

Posted by: Just A Guy at December 30, 2013 02:40 PM (5v7zJ)

220 Are our library records still private?!?

Posted by: RWC at December 30, 2013 02:40 PM (Q6HBD)

221 AAAANNNDDD The Senator John Blutarsky Award for Humorous Conservative Blogging goes to Ace O' Spades. Doug Ross Fabulous 50.

Posted by: t-dubyah-d at December 30, 2013 02:40 PM (u6lBN)

222 219 Just A Guy, Heh we're thrilled! //GOPe

Posted by: sven10077 at December 30, 2013 02:42 PM (TE35l)

223 220 I hope so. I just checked out "Happy Happy Happy" by Phil Robertson. Dangerous stuff.

Posted by: grammie winger at December 30, 2013 02:42 PM (P6QsQ)

224 the whole world can watch you fap? makes for awkward quarterly performance reviews

Posted by: Bigby's Knuckle Sandwich at December 30, 2013 02:42 PM (9vxrW)

225 The slide specifically says the implant/exploit has to be installed with "close access". It can then be activated remotely and new software packages can be uploaded remotely and data can be downloaded remotely.

That's different from being able to hack any iPhone on the planet at any moment. I have no idea if they can do that or not.

Posted by: Flatbush Joe at December 30, 2013 07:24 PM (ZPrif)

Of course the NSA wouldn't have any reason at all to cultivate the impression in the general public that such exploits cannot be added to a smartphone without physical contact. None.At.All.

Posted by: Alberta Oil Peon at December 30, 2013 02:42 PM (60Q+L)

226

195...Posted by: Dack Thrombosis at December 30, 2013 07:28 PM (oFCZn) 

 

Just take a quick read of 'The Patriot Act' on Wikipedia...it shows the long list of amendments to the original.

 

Hell, they even have..."Immunity for compliance with FISA wiretap" now.

Posted by: wheatie at December 30, 2013 02:42 PM (1ScqE)

227 It worries the crap out of me.

Posted by: freaked at December 30, 2013 02:43 PM (Yc4/E)

228
Quite, anytime Freedom needs a hand you can count on the Gee Oh Pee to grab a leg...
Posted by: sven10077



Gets worse.  Almost all the votes against the Patriot Act extension were Democrats.  Only 4 Republican senators voted no.

Posted by: Laurie David's Cervix at December 30, 2013 02:44 PM (kdS6q)

229 Posted by: grammie winger at December 30, 2013 07:42 PM (P6QsQ) Uh oh. You are going to be shunned at the next GLAAD event.

Posted by: RWC at December 30, 2013 02:45 PM (Q6HBD)

230 dDan: "why intercept when you can take care of this at the factory?" Assuming Apple (aka the manufacturer) isn't being extorted or forced to collaborate, it's in the best interest of the spying entity to involve as few people as possible. An interdiction during shipping (i.e. in the mailing pipeline) is probably the most stealthy method possible if physical access is required.

Posted by: AnonymousDrivel at December 30, 2013 02:46 PM (eHIJJ)

231 I'm sure there was no influence in the last presidential election. Yes, I said "the last " presidential election.

Posted by: pawn at December 30, 2013 02:46 PM (xxdkI)

232 I'm sure there was no influence in the last presidential election. Yes, I said "the last " presidential election.

Posted by: pawn at December 30, 2013 02:46 PM (xxdkI)

233 sorry about the DP.

Posted by: pawn at December 30, 2013 02:47 PM (xxdkI)

234 Anyone who's not worried is being a fool.

Posted by: Just A Guy at December 30, 2013 07:40 PM (5v7zJ)


Someone should write a book about this. Maybe call it 2041.

Posted by: Zombie George Orwell at December 30, 2013 02:47 PM (2DunM)

235 If I had a conservative blog, I'd be very worried. Of course if I had a conservative blog I'd have been worried long before now. And probably audited.

Posted by: Meremortal, not too worried at December 30, 2013 02:48 PM (jTKU5)

236 An interdiction during shipping (i.e. in the mailing pipeline) is probably the most stealthy method possible if physical access is required.

iPhones are assembled in China. Imagine the old Mad Magazine Spy v. Spy come to life.

Posted by: Retread at December 30, 2013 02:49 PM (cHwk5)

237 The reason they are intercepting iPhone shipments is, presumably, so they can install the initial implant. Because they can't do it remotely. Posted by: Flatbush Joe at December 30, 2013 07:12 PM (ZPrif) why intercept when you can take care of this at the factory? Easy. If every phone has it, researchers will more easily get access to a phone with the changes on it. Then they can take a look. If only the target gets the phone from the intercepted batch, less chance someone will scope the thing.

Posted by: bonhomme[/i][/b][/i][/b] at December 30, 2013 02:49 PM (44jNh)

238 Is this not somehow related to the NSA sidetracking packages via UPS, Fedex etc... and then adding hardware or software to spy on US citizens?

I don't believe for a second they only do this stuff to foreigners.  I also believe they spend almost all of their time looking at US citizens these days.  Looking at our foreign policy there is certainly no evidence that they understand either Jack or shit about what our enemies are doing.

Posted by: Thatch at December 30, 2013 02:49 PM (qYvEa)

239 If they want to listen in on terrorists, shouldn't they be putting chips in all the disposable phones?

Posted by: Meremortal, not real worried at December 30, 2013 02:49 PM (jTKU5)

240 Only 4 Republican senators voted no. Posted by: Laurie David's Cervix at December 30, 2013 07:44 PM (kdS6q) ******* Well if you count Lisa Murkowski as Republican....

Posted by: Karnaq at December 30, 2013 02:49 PM (RJMhd)

241 235 Meremortal, Well on the bright side we can work on water ballet at the camps.

Posted by: sven10077 at December 30, 2013 02:49 PM (TE35l)

242 Better news?  I am still using my RazR phone, I defy them to get into that!  Hi, guys!

Posted by: Peaches at December 30, 2013 02:51 PM (8lmkt)

243 Obamaphone knows when I'm home.

Posted by: homee at December 30, 2013 02:51 PM (Yc4/E)

244 Posted by: Inspector Cussword at December 30, 2013 07:19 PM (xJS2Q) More, we KNOW that the NSA is giving information to Drug Enforcement folks, who are then telling lies about the original 'tip' to get further warrants... There were multiple articles about this happening a few months back... Thus, at least 'some' of the NSA IS listening to Americans, in America... and then using the data tracking capabilities to alert other law enforcement folks.... And I would bet $1000 that the Secret Service gets information about 'threats' to the POTUS.

Posted by: Romeo13 at December 30, 2013 02:51 PM (lZBBB)

245 sorry about the DP. No need to apologize, Sugar. I enjoyed myself.

Posted by: Sandra Fluke at December 30, 2013 02:52 PM (++92l)

246 Believe what you want. But don't claim as proof something that doesn't support your claim. The linked article and slide do not say NSA can hack anybody's iPhone remotely. It says just the contrary, in fact. Otherwise we're just in conspiracy land where everything is proof of anything and it's opposite.

Posted by: Flatbush Joe at December 30, 2013 02:54 PM (ZPrif)

247 No need to apologize, Sugar. Fluke's a Disabled Person!

Posted by: bonhomme[/i][/b][/i][/b] at December 30, 2013 02:54 PM (44jNh)

248 I hope the NSA is happy with my porn selections.

Posted by: Roc Ingersol at December 30, 2013 02:54 PM (ZFXqT)

249 Well on the bright side we can work on water ballet at the camps. Posted by: sven10077 at December 30, 2013 07:49 PM (TE35l) And a free Koran, plus a spiffy prayer rug!

Posted by: Meremortal, not real worried at December 30, 2013 02:54 PM (jTKU5)

250 My android is mysteriously out of memory and the file manager, even in super user mode, can not account for a big chunk of the usage.  I blame the NSA.

Posted by: SpongeBobSaget at December 30, 2013 02:54 PM (kxSZr)

251 242 Peaches, I miss my old sanyo.. 244 Romeo13, Look at El Patrolero Bordero in the side bar.... We have to submit to their games or "out of control illegal immigration" you know like uh...since 1986...? These powers are not used for stated missions they are used for fishing or God help us planting ones.

Posted by: sven10077 at December 30, 2013 02:56 PM (TE35l)

252 They stole this tech from us! Sort of.

Posted by: Ass Probing Aliens at December 30, 2013 02:56 PM (RLTt1)

253 Otherwise we're just in conspiracy land where everything is proof of anything and it's opposite. Here's the issue. The only barrier is technical, not lawful. The article proves that. In six years, has the NSA been able to overcome that barrier? Let me put it to you this way. You can buy zero-day exploits for nearly any system online. Those are people outside the NSA who have hacked those systems. IOW, NSA doesn't even have to do the work, the technical barrier is overcome without NSA involvement.

Posted by: bonhomme[/i][/b][/i][/b] at December 30, 2013 02:57 PM (44jNh)

254 They want me to update to ios7 or something. The little red "1" stares at me every time I turn the phone on. But I'm not doing it, no sir. Something is up with that, so no dice. Other people talk about a weird "cloud" and losing all their contact numbers. *looks around, squints*

Posted by: Meremortal, not real worried at December 30, 2013 02:58 PM (jTKU5)

255 My android is mysteriously out of memory and the file manager, even in super user mode, can not account for a big chunk of the usage. I blame the NSA.

Posted by: SpongeBobSaget at December 30, 2013 07:54 PM (kxSZr)

 

 

No, it's us.

Posted by: Spongebobsaget's porn collection at December 30, 2013 02:58 PM (o9Rp5)

256 253 bonhomme, Flatbush Joe is on the ball ask him about Upworfy...what we need is weaponized battle cattle from the LIV militia

Posted by: sven10077 at December 30, 2013 02:59 PM (TE35l)

257 bonhomme, I'm not saying they can't do it remotely. I have no idea. I'm just saying that is not what the article and slides are saying. That slide specifically says the opposite. Also kinda weird to do the exploit that requires interdiction and physical access if you have the tech to just remotely text message any iPhone and compromise it. Maybe they can now. The slide indicated they were working on it. But also said at that time they couldn't, at least not with that exploit.

Posted by: Flatbush Joe at December 30, 2013 03:00 PM (ZPrif)

258 Ass Probing Aliens at December 30, 2013 07:56 PM (RLTt1) There's something up with you clowns too. If you were really so advanced and shit, you wouldn't need to do that ass thang. It's like Deliverance in the sky.

Posted by: Meremortal, smooths the tinfoil.... at December 30, 2013 03:01 PM (jTKU5)

259 Put down the Iphone and eat your broccoli.

Posted by: Drone #20475-957550 - assigned to you [/i] [/b] at December 30, 2013 03:03 PM (5ikDv)

260 257 spiegel described Reagan's star wars as satellites that shot out tiny plastic interception devices back in the day. no disinformation campaign there

Posted by: Bigby's Knuckle Sandwich at December 30, 2013 03:04 PM (RLTt1)

261 Put down the Iphone and eat your broccoli.

Posted by: Drone #20475-957550 - assigned to you at December 30, 2013 08:03 PM (5ikDv)


Laugh now, but that's going to be a Federal law in a couple of years.

Posted by: some other guy at December 30, 2013 03:05 PM (2DunM)

262 Posted by: Spongebobsaget's porn collection at December 30, 2013 07:58 PM (o9Rp5)

Just like the cows in Minecraft, always escaping from the corral, and don't think I'll be merciful and use the diamond sword when I catch you.  Gonna dig out an old wooden one and cast a spell of dullness on it.

Posted by: SpongeBobSaget at December 30, 2013 03:06 PM (kxSZr)

263 FJ 257. Agreed about the article. It says exactly what you are saying. Why did the iPhone require interdiction and physical access six years ago? I suspect it's because the gen 1 iPhone was released to the public June 2007. Who knows how long the gov had to prep for that? Not I. Since then, hundreds of thousands of people have worked on hacking the thing. Everything has bugs; Software, hardware, the brain even. I'm thinking they have the capability now, given there are zero day exploits on sale right now. Does the collection of unpatched exploits suit their current needs? I don't know. For me personally, that's the only limiting factor, not the law, and not internal restraint.

Posted by: bonhomme[/i][/b][/i][/b] at December 30, 2013 03:07 PM (44jNh)

264 Who's laughing?

I was in the first wave deployed with the secret Federal "Let's Move Act of 2012".

And your soda is entirely too large.

Posted by: Drone #20475-957550 - assigned to you [/i] [/b] at December 30, 2013 03:09 PM (5ikDv)

265 264 drone, You should probably get that mole looked at too....

Posted by: sven10077 at December 30, 2013 03:11 PM (TE35l)

266 And your soda is entirely too large.

Posted by: Drone #20475-957550 - assigned to you at December 30, 2013 08:09 PM (5ikDv)


During Cankles' 2nd term I'll probably get life for it.

Posted by: some other guy at December 30, 2013 03:12 PM (2DunM)

267 During Cankles' 2nd term I'll probably get life for it. Keep your soda. I'm more interested in your soul.

Posted by: Cankles[/i][/b][/i][/b] at December 30, 2013 03:15 PM (44jNh)

268 Don't know if you guys got to this, but one of the problems with having a backdoor built into this stuff that the NSA can use on a whim, is so can everyone else who figures out how they're accessing it.

Another problem with having backdoors hardwired into anything produced in America is anyone with any sense will stop buying computer stuff touched by American companies.

Posted by: Methos at December 30, 2013 03:17 PM (hO9ad)

269 Another problem with having backdoors hardwired into anything produced in America is anyone with any sense will stop buying computer stuff touched by American companies.

Posted by: Methos at December 30, 2013 08:17 PM (hO9ad) 


Works for me, my Chinese friends need to sell more computer and phone gear.



Posted by: W J Clintoon at December 30, 2013 03:19 PM (o3MSL)

270 Posted by: Methos at December 30, 2013 08:17 PM (hO9ad) Boeing has already lost an Airplane contract in South America over American Spying... They are PISSED... and rightfully so.... Remember, we are not the only country in the world with Laws... the NSA continuously breaks even our ALLIES laws constantly with this crap.

Posted by: Romeo13 at December 30, 2013 03:23 PM (lZBBB)

271 Works for me, my Chinese friends need to sell more computer and phone gear. Posted by: W J Clintoon at December 30, 2013 08:19 PM (o3MSL) And at that point? its just a question of WHO you want to have your info.... China? or the US Spooks.... and Vlad Putin can only look on.... jealously...

Posted by: Romeo13 at December 30, 2013 03:24 PM (lZBBB)

272 Remember, we are not the only country in the world with Laws... the NSA continuously breaks even our ALLIES laws constantly with this crap.

Posted by: Romeo13 at December 30, 2013 08:23 PM (lZBBB)


As a Constitutional scholar, I can unequivocally say the Foudners did not mean anything they wrote down.

Posted by: Caliph Barky Ochoomba I at December 30, 2013 03:25 PM (o3MSL)

273

sorry it it took so long, kinda glad it did though.

 

Posted by: Flatbush Joe at December 30, 2013 07:54 PM (ZPrif)   Otherwise we're just in conspiracy land where everything is proof of anything and it's opposite.

 

good point.

 

Posted by: AnonymousDrivel at December 30, 2013 07:46 PM (eHIJJ)   An interdiction during shipping (i.e. in the mailing pipeline) is probably the most stealthy method possible if physical access is required.

 

one company "Assuming Apple (aka the manufacturer)" v. quantities  of shipment companies? does apple use sole source for shipment. (?)

 

Posted by: bonhomme at December 30, 2013 07:49 PM (44jNh) ...every phone has it, researchers will more easily get access to a phone with the changes on it. Then they can take a look. If only the target gets the phone from the intercepted batch, less chance someone will scope the thing.

 

target gets phone, need to ensure target uses phone. else we're back at position one.

Posted by: dDan at December 30, 2013 03:27 PM (hwYmz)

274 bonhomme@263: "I'm thinking they have the capability now, given there are zero day exploits on sale right now. Does the collection of unpatched exploits suit their current needs?" Spiegel documented that TAO has an entire catalog/database of hardware and software exploits ready to go. One department just asks another, essentially and for example, "Yeah, we have a Juniper router running OS ver. x.y. Give us something that gives us root access..." Then it's a matter of inserting that firmware/software into the target device. Also, NSA has agents befriend hackers at whitehat/blackhat conferences to a) recruit and b) scour the latest tech. It's all logical behavior from a spy agency, of course. Be that as it may, the classically illegal exploitation of American citizens (the general citizenry, not necessarily the industry technophiles) by (ab)using this acquired tech is frightening.

Posted by: AnonymousDrivel at December 30, 2013 03:27 PM (eHIJJ)

275 If you want to see just how perverted the "homeland" security forces are, just use your military ID at a TSA check point. Oh, and be prepared to miss your plane.

Posted by: VADM(Red) Cuthbert Collingwood (Mentioned in Despatches) at December 30, 2013 03:28 PM (G7Yr9)

276 @268

Why do you need a backdoor when you can come in through the front door?

Posted by: Kreplach at December 30, 2013 03:29 PM (Xkr8I)

277 275 VAdm C Collingwood, Yeah wife experienceed that of course understand the civil service thinks the military is full of icky paleo-patriots.... Not the new and improved Obamination types

Posted by: sven10077 at December 30, 2013 03:36 PM (TE35l)

278 The NSA hacked my iRefrigerator iPad to tell me they've been monitoring my iToilet for contraband. They're convinced I eat too much red meat. True story.

Posted by: Fritz at December 30, 2013 03:38 PM (TKFmG)

279 dDan: "one company "Assuming Apple (aka the manufacturer)" v. quantities of shipment companies? does apple use sole source for shipment. (?)" Good questions. I dunno. I surmise that interdiction from the mfg. plant would be too broad; also, product distribution means going from wholesale to retail chains. Now suppose target phone is shipped by USPS via retailer. It doesn't seem like too much of a stretch by the Federal government to coordinate USPS shipping and a human target address. The filter might be "Inspect anything that is sent to Mr. Middle American especially if it comes from a tech company and weighs more than a letter."

Posted by: AnonymousDrivel at December 30, 2013 03:38 PM (eHIJJ)

280 I bought a 9 buck trakfone with double minutes. Trakfone is a CIA front. Layers.

Posted by: toby928 at December 30, 2013 03:45 PM (QupBk)

281

Posted by: AnonymousDrivel at December 30, 2013 08:38 PM (eHIJJ)

 

unlimited resources (funding, manpower, etc.) can overcome most things.

 

worth thinking about.

Posted by: dDan at December 30, 2013 03:56 PM (hwYmz)

282 "25 But they still need physical access first, right?"

Probably have to ask Apple about that. Probably Foxconn, and also the Chinese government.

Don't worry, I'm sure you'll get an honest answer.

Note:  Pretty much applies to other software and hardware makers, too. Not singling out Apple here.

Bottom line:  You have no expectation of privacy.  If the spyware is in the BIOS/firmware, they own you.  If it is in the OS, the spooks just need the "cooperation" of AV companies.

Posted by: jbarntt at December 30, 2013 04:32 PM (UNFot)

283 Uptwinkles from Gabe!

Eh?  What's that Gabe?  Yeah yeah.. we'll have the drummers do their thing all night long in celebration.

Posted by: OWS Turds at December 30, 2013 04:32 PM (b/lt+)

284 277 - sven10077 Well, I can how it would make sense to profile us. Being that every one of the 9/11 hijackers were retired military with acid reflux and herinated discs. I'm just telling you what they told me.

Posted by: VADM(Red) Cuthbert Collingwood (Mentioned in Despatches) at December 30, 2013 04:36 PM (G7Yr9)

285 Trakfone is a CIA front. So is Mattel. I'm not making this up. I promise.

Posted by: VADM(Red) Cuthbert Collingwood (Mentioned in Despatches) at December 30, 2013 04:38 PM (G7Yr9)

286 Hey Ace

"I'm not so certain I am worried about this."

not so certain...

Ok.. lemme help you out here...

One political party controls the NSA.. the party in power.  You are saying you trust that party 100% not to use ANY NSA resources to guarantee their transition to another Dem executive?

ARE YOU FUCKING CRAZY?????????????

Posted by: OWS Turds at December 30, 2013 04:39 PM (b/lt+)

287 damn sock

Posted by: Chi-Town Jerry at December 30, 2013 04:39 PM (b/lt+)

288 By the time enough people get upset by this creeping tyranny, it will be too late to do anything about it. Just think, eventually they'll stop terrorist against us. The USSR didn't have any terrorist attacks and look how happy their people were!

Posted by: Baldy at December 30, 2013 04:52 PM (2bql3)

289 Spooks gonna be spooky. Don't hate the playa.

Posted by: Auntie M at December 30, 2013 05:45 PM (AIC5Z)

290 As a former crypto-geek, I generally assume all communications are interceptable somewhere along the way -- especially in the modern age, when, as they put it on Agents of Shield, "we're surveilling [our]selves." Thus, this tidbit doesn't really surprise me. What worries me is whether or not they use their superpowers for good or evil...

Posted by: scarybiscuits at December 30, 2013 06:42 PM (a5p5X)

291

>Are we really upset to discover that the national security apparatus has been thinking up new ways to spy on targets?

If so -- what did everyone think we were paying them to do, exactly?<

 

Really?  How about they use some of that info to fucking OBLITERATE the ENEMY so that they can say 'Mission Accomplished' for reals  and stop fucking spying on us instead of using the enemy's  continuing ongoing existence to keep spying on us for ever-and-ever World without END?!

Posted by: Speller at December 30, 2013 06:46 PM (J74Py)

292 Remember: If I say, "No, I don't have any tattoos, because I'm not a scummy gang-member-wannabe," then I am also tacitly saying, "If you DO have tattoos, then you are a scummy gang-member-wannabe." Likewise, if you say, "I don't care about spying; I don't have anything to hide," then you are also saying, "People who DO care DO have something to hide." BTW, it is definitely too late to stop this. Science has screwed us, and we sold all our rights for cute little gadgets that help us look up the nearest restaurant. Yay. Turns out abortion isn't the only convenience-paved road to hell. BTW #2: People with tattoos are scummy gang-member-wannabes.

Posted by: RKae at December 30, 2013 07:57 PM (oM38p)

293 The NSA management team consists of the spiritual children of Lieutenant-General Arthur Ernest Percival.

Posted by: Huggy at December 31, 2013 04:33 AM (H/UlD)

294 If you believe in the multiverse then tatoos are how very close copies are denoted. So at least one of those "scummy gang-member-wannabes" is a charmer who would be the love of your life if you formed a relationship with her. For right now you don't have that ability.

Posted by: Huggy at December 31, 2013 04:39 AM (H/UlD)

295 It's never too late to stop anything. "...ask and it is given..." That's why God created the Multiverse. Mass surveillance has to stop because it kills the geese that lay the golden eggs. If it goes on brass hats better get ready to go back in time 2000 years. Wasn't nice even for the people at the top of the hierarchy.

Posted by: Huggy at December 31, 2013 04:48 AM (H/UlD)

296 Think of it this way... if only there were a way to get people to walk around with bugs voluntarily. That would be great, especially bugs that had video cameras built in, oh, and a list of everyone they know would be great too. Governments around the world have had this capability for years. Your smartphone is a bug 007 couldn't have dreamt of in his day. That is why smart phones (actually all transmitters) are banned from secure places. Happy New Year everyone!

Posted by: Jungle at December 31, 2013 04:30 PM (VKec4)

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