July 30, 2013

Cruz: Either We Stop ObamaCare Now or We Surrender To It Forever
— Ace

Sorry, I'm just phoning this in now because I'm trying, with no success of course, to shame the media into actually taking an interest in a Democratic scandal.

But this is as usual a comprehensive piece by AllahPundit on a topic I've been trying to avoid, to wit, the coming civil war in the party, as the Accomodationist Wing once again ignores the Constitutionalist Hawks.

And I'm sure the Accomodationist Wing can offer us all sorts of excuses why "this isn't the right time" and all of that. I suppose it is true -- and I can't be a baby about this and deny it -- that an actual government shutdown could cost us our chance at the Senate, and even lose us the House. And, if the latter were to happen, we'd lose our one source of power to stop Obama, at least until 2016.

And yet, and yet. I think these arguments about the political inadvisability of certain actions usually mask the real reason for abeyance: I don't want to, I don't agree with that, I don't want to take on the Permanent DC Complex of bureaucrats, donors, and media. I want to just drift along the sweet river Apocalypse. But I don't want to admit these things to my voters. Instead I will always just dress everything up in terms of poll numbers.

Posted by: Ace at 02:52 PM | Comments (285)
Post contains 250 words, total size 1 kb.

1 Roomy.

Posted by: garrett at July 30, 2013 02:53 PM (tx/9d)

2 >>> I'm trying, with no success of course, to shame the media into actually taking an interest in a Democratic scandal. Filner is not a scandal. We are proud of him.

Posted by: MSM at July 30, 2013 02:55 PM (czQU/)

3 "the coming civil war in the party"

Let's settle this. 


Posted by: slatz at July 30, 2013 02:55 PM (yuZy4)

4

What do they care?  They are exempt. 

That's better than a waiver.

Posted by: garrett at July 30, 2013 02:55 PM (tx/9d)

5 LAUSD is filled with employees who are getting their hours cut to below 30 because of Obamacare but they can't even conceive of it because he's their messiah

Posted by: DAve, LAUSD, inc. at July 30, 2013 02:56 PM (OksBo)

6 Boehner will cave like a cheap whore for Weiner

Posted by: Butt F*ck GOP at July 30, 2013 02:56 PM (tqOG8)

7 The 90s shutdown directly gave rise to Clinton having enough time to mess around with Lewinsky. Obama already has more than enough free time. What will he do?

Posted by: wooga at July 30, 2013 02:57 PM (YeZ0a)

8 This is not the right hill to live on.

Posted by: Karl Rave at July 30, 2013 02:57 PM (xGjmy)

9 Burn, baby burn!!!

Posted by: billygoat at July 30, 2013 02:57 PM (MTSwl)

10 After we repeal Obamacare can we sacrifice John McCain to the God of the volcano?

Posted by: garrett at July 30, 2013 02:58 PM (tx/9d)

11

Obama already has more than enough free time. What will he do?

 

 

Study the complex relationship between umbrellas and archways?

Posted by: garrett at July 30, 2013 02:59 PM (tx/9d)

12 It would be rather gauche to try to repeal the President's signature legislative achievement now.  And tasteless.

Posted by: John Boehner at July 30, 2013 03:00 PM (8ZskC)

13 If John Kerry and Secretariat Jessica Parker had a baby, would it be covered by Obamacare or would it just be sent to an equestrian vet?

Posted by: kathysaysso at July 30, 2013 03:00 PM (6H6o8)

14 If you don't stand for something, you'll fall for anything.

Posted by: alexthechick - SMOD. Take us away. at July 30, 2013 03:00 PM (Gk3SS)

15 the GOP is so far up Obummers ass, they can call the kettle black

Posted by: Butt F*ck GOP at July 30, 2013 03:00 PM (tqOG8)

16

And I'm sure the Accomodationist Wing can offer us all sorts of excuses why "this isn't the right time" and all of that. I suppose it is true -- and I can't be a baby about this and deny it -- that an actual government shutdown could cost us our chance at the Senate, and even lose us the House. And, if the latter were to happen, we'd lose our one source of power to stop Obama, at least until 2016.

 

I may be wrong, but I still think that there's a vast silent majority of Americans waiting for the GOP to finally show some balls  and come out against the Leftard Agenda. 

 

As Rush  is fond of saying, conservatism works every time it's tried. The problem with the establishment GOP is, they won't even try.  We are aware of the negative impacts of OCare, and it hasn't   even been fully  implemented yet. People's rates are going up, lots of people are being forced to go part time to avoid penalties,  and as a result, tax revenue will go down.

 

This is a bad law, and should be called such, all the time, by each and every Pubbie. They could even use some Dims quotes, as a few of them have spoken up too.  They could  bypass the MFM and start putting vids  on YouTube. But that would make sense...

Posted by: BackwardsBoy, who did not vote for this shit at July 30, 2013 03:00 PM (0HooB)

17 they better stop it....but they won't so LET IT BURN!

Posted by: phoenixgirl @phxazgrl at July 30, 2013 03:01 PM (8JJ6O)

18 Obama already has more than enough free time. What will he do?


Deep thoughts about shit.

Posted by: Cicero (@cicero) at July 30, 2013 03:01 PM (8ZskC)

19 10 Garrett,

It ain't going away...

The McCain gang will aid the donks in saving it, they will speak of "not hurting the poor in this dire hour of economic need.

I know these fuckers by the smell of shit in my nose...

they are the people that hated the Reagan GOP at its core for expecting them to do something.

Posted by: sven10077 at July 30, 2013 03:01 PM (LRFds)

20 The accomodationists don't even believe it can all come to an end someday...

...yet of the hundreds of empires that ever existed since recorded history began, the the USA's "empire", such as it is, is the only one in the history of the world still extant.

It is the nature of empire that it is ephemeral on historical timescales.  The accomodationists are fucking retards. 

If you're not actively reigning in entropy ALL THE TIME, then entropy is reigning you in.


Posted by: Purp[/i][/b][/u][/s] at July 30, 2013 03:02 PM (S3yfV)

21 The Republicans don't know how to be an opposition party.  Democrats have been such a successful party in support of government growth and all the "winning" consultants only know how to "win" by growing government and passing out goodies.  Who do you ask in Washington to help you craft a winning campaign of "take the goodies away"? 

True strict Constitutionalists have fantastic arguments, but how do you implement a successful "tear out all the unconstitutional crap" campaign?  How do you do the daily grind of tearing out all the crap the leftists have been building since before Lincoln?  The arguments are beautiful, but how do you actually implement all that with the leftist howler monkeys in the MSM and the Democrats in Congress putting their fully operational rage machine into motion?

Posted by: bonhomme at July 30, 2013 03:02 PM (J79eW)

22 Anyone know where I can get a nice whig?

Posted by: John Boehner at July 30, 2013 03:02 PM (8ZskC)

23 In Peruvia the sweet river Apocalypse is the main thoroughfare . There are no exits .

Posted by: Bill D. Cat at July 30, 2013 03:02 PM (0iJzo)

24 The Party does not exist. It is made up of individuals. Replace the individuals and you have replaced the Party.

Posted by: Lincolntf at July 30, 2013 03:03 PM (ZshNr)

25 It's never the right hill to take a stand on. "This hill is covered with Poplars, which make me sneeze. That other hill just wasn't round enough, and the other before that wasn't quite as pointy as I like them."

You know, eventually, if you keep backing away from your stated principles, people are going to assume you don't have any, and walk all over you.

Posted by: Sticky Wicket at July 30, 2013 03:03 PM (qoQi/)

26 But they did report on a scandal, Ace. They reported on Weiner. Aren't you impressed?!!. They are. It proves their great objectivity

Posted by: FenelonSpoke at July 30, 2013 03:03 PM (iQit/)

27 I hate the Republicans. Comfortable cowards, all of 'em.

Posted by: Cicero (@cicero) at July 30, 2013 03:04 PM (8ZskC)

28 Why are we listening to the accomodationalists? They've lost the big fights. The people don't want this. We could build momentum for the midterms. Its just a matter of will.

Posted by: Iblis at July 30, 2013 03:04 PM (9221z)

29 The used to be a cigarette commercial that said "I would rather fight than switch". I say fight it.

Posted by: sTevo at July 30, 2013 03:04 PM (dlAh+)

30
Let's call a spade a spade: the GOP has been cowed into submission by the MSM yelling 'racist!" at every turn- they have been successfully neutered

McConnel Boehner McCain and all the rest of you quislings- GODDAMN YOU ALL TO HELL


Posted by: Jones in CO at July 30, 2013 03:05 PM (8sCoq)

31 Short version of what I said earlier: Ideas don't rot, but civilizations do.

Posted by: Purp[/i][/b][/u][/s] at July 30, 2013 03:05 PM (S3yfV)

32

Hell, the GOP could even start pointing out that this POS law was  written by a guy who   was in jail at   the time.

 

Name names,  point out that this wasn't even written by a member of Congress.  Is this what you vote for?

 

So many ways to fight this type of thing, so little   will to do so.

Posted by: BackwardsBoy, who did not vote for this shit at July 30, 2013 03:05 PM (0HooB)

33 21 Bonhomme,

Easy, you don't...

gravity kills and I'm guilty....you're guilty too.

http://youtu.be/IUVheOwDM5I

Posted by: sven10077 at July 30, 2013 03:05 PM (LRFds)

34 Ace,  maybe it would cost us the House.  If so,  we wouldn't have held onto the House for many more years,  anyway.

I just want someone to act like they know that Flyover Country and the workers of this country actually exist.  Someone who will defend us.

If we are doomed anyway,  I would rather go down fighting,  telling it like it is and calling them out for what they are.

Posted by: Miss Marple at July 30, 2013 03:05 PM (GoIUi)

35
[the House] our one source of power to stop Obama




Ok, now that's funny.

Wait, were you being serious?

Oh dear.

Posted by: Laurie David's Cervix at July 30, 2013 03:06 PM (kdS6q)

36 Racism racism racism. Also racism. Racistly, racist racism.

Posted by: Flatbush Joe at July 30, 2013 03:06 PM (ZPrif)

37 Repeal obamacare? The political cost is just too damn high. Do you know what else is too damn high? The rent.

Posted by: Guy who says the rent is too damn high. at July 30, 2013 03:06 PM (pxDth)

38 En Fuego!

Posted by: that guy that shouts en fuego at July 30, 2013 03:06 PM (QupBk)

39 Zimbabwe is looking like the go to economic powerhouse and move to country compared to the US...thank god Sheila Jackson will be the new Homeland Security Wonk...

Posted by: Butt F*ck GOP at July 30, 2013 03:06 PM (tqOG8)

40 23 Bill D Cat,

one thing about Charon our cruise director...

the fucker never gets lost and he works goddamned cheap...

two shiny coins.

Posted by: sven10077 at July 30, 2013 03:06 PM (LRFds)

41 RINOs should be the first to water the tree of liberty. Fifth columnists, the lot of them.

Posted by: Hurricane LaFawnduh at July 30, 2013 03:07 PM (pginn)

42 They keep telling us that it is tactically wrong to do all kinds of crap. When was the last time their tactics worked for our benefit. Fuck the GOP and there tactics we're losing try something different Speak the fuck up pricks.

Posted by: McGregor at July 30, 2013 03:07 PM (qo244)

43 If I repealed Obamacare, the press would have to mention what a bloated, stupid pig I am.

Posted by: Meghan McCain at July 30, 2013 03:07 PM (8ZskC)

44 You don't need no stinkin health care in Peruvia.

Posted by: sTevo at July 30, 2013 03:08 PM (Ue8+L)

45 >>> Short version of what I said earlier: Ideas don't rot, but civilizations do.

yup. re: my earlier pessimistic statement that "America is all done," we can at least keep the idea of America inside of us.  Maybe one day, 60 years from now, it will make a return.


Posted by: ace at July 30, 2013 03:08 PM (/IWYB)

46 And yet, and yet. I think these arguments about the political inadvisability of certain actions usually mask the real reason for abeyance...

Like the fact that the Republican Party is not now, and probably has not been since at least 1995, the party of small, Constitutionally-limited government, fiscal responsibility and freedom? That what they really are is the part of Big Government, only with a slightly different flavor?

Nah - it really couldn't be that simple.

Bring on "coming civil war in the party" - anything that ushers the GOP into history faster brings-about the possibility (albeit slight in the pre-Burning Times era) of a fiscally conservative, pro-freedom alternative to the fascists (Democrats) emerging.

Posted by: DocJ at July 30, 2013 03:08 PM (du8Bm)

47 Charon our cruise director... Good one, sven.

Posted by: FenelonSpoke at July 30, 2013 03:08 PM (iQit/)

48 the coming civil war in the party Only a Dance-Off will settle this. It's ON!

Posted by: toby928 at July 30, 2013 03:08 PM (QupBk)

49 42 McGregor,

as one of the San Diego Chargers in the Coryell era of atrocious defense once said...

"here's an idea how about we tackle the sonsofbitches and keep them from fucking scoring...can we try that for a change?"

Posted by: sven10077 at July 30, 2013 03:09 PM (LRFds)

50

Part of the problem is a failure to realize that a large number of Americans simply want to be part of the "cool" crowd.  Obama and the Dems are perceived as cool, and so a lot of Americans will look for any excuse to back him.  It's human nature: people respect strength and will flock to it. 

 

The solution isn't to back away from attacks, but to increase them.  Go on the offensive.  Mock the left at every turn.  No more of this "my friend across the aisle" bullshit; stand your ground and declare that accommodation with a bad policy leads only to harmful results.  In other words: grow a pair. 

Posted by: Colorado Alex at July 30, 2013 03:09 PM (lr3d7)

51 I'm good with that Ms McCain.

Posted by: sTevo at July 30, 2013 03:09 PM (Ue8+L)

52 Bullcrapola. 60 years my ass. Less than ten.

Posted by: Lincolntf at July 30, 2013 03:09 PM (ZshNr)

53 After we repeal Obamacare can we sacrifice John McCain to the God of the volcano?

Volcanoes are just where my indigestion flares up from time to time.

You really think McCain is going to help with that?  He doesn't look like a little purple pill to me.

Posted by: Vulcan at July 30, 2013 03:10 PM (YEelc)

54

"The McCain gang will aid the donks in saving it, they will speak of "not hurting the poor in this dire hour of economic need."

 

 

 

My friends, these millions of God's children coming across our border are going to need health care.

Posted by: McLaim at July 30, 2013 03:10 PM (San0v)

55 I lost just about all hope of getting rid of this shit sandwich when Roberts stabbed us in the back .Than Obama got re elected on top of that.

Posted by: steevy at July 30, 2013 03:11 PM (9XBK2)

56 I want to talk about girdles and my ideas on Acute Myelogenous Leukemia.

Posted by: MegaBreasts McCain at July 30, 2013 03:11 PM (ieU06)

57 I think you're right, Ace. On most issues, the time is never 'right' to oppose the Left. I remember going through this in the 90's, when we didn't toss Billy Jeff out because the GOP didn't want to face an incumbent Gore in 2000. There are damn few Republican's willing to stand on principle...unless we call 'getting re-elected' a principle. I don't. Honestly, it's starting to feel like the hand of God, telling us we haven't suffered enough yet.

Posted by: Mark Andrew Edwards at July 30, 2013 03:12 PM (3Znbm)

58 20 The accomodationists don't even believe it can all come to an end someday.. What they don't believe is that it might come to an end before they've gotten theirs and are long gone from the scene.

Posted by: BuddyPC at July 30, 2013 03:12 PM (jfUIE)

59 Red State said it yesterday - and all you anti-purists can suck it - there will be third party.

Done with the compromise and being told to accept the John McCains as "the only answer" in order to win the presidential election.

Worried about letting the other guys win? They already have, the damage is done. The rest is just cement.

The only way to turn this around is with a hard about. Not a slow applying of the brakes.

I didn't leave the Republican Party. It left me.

No more squishes, no more holding my nose in the voting booth. Romney was the last time I feel dirty with my beliefs compromised.

Go on bitches, start whining about how "they're just gonna win from now on!"

News Flash: THEY'VE BEEN WINNING! IF YOU WANT TO WIN AGAIN, BRING US A CONSERVATIVE. NO, A REAL ONE!

Posted by: SGT. York at July 30, 2013 03:12 PM (GY+dx)

60 Meghan McCain's IQ? Not too damn high.

Posted by: Guy who says the rent is too damn high. at July 30, 2013 03:12 PM (pxDth)

61 They keep telling us that it is tactically wrong to do all kinds of crap. When was the last time their tactics worked for our benefit.



Well sure, we've had a few bad calls in the past.  But just wait until we're all basking in the sunshine of the coming Permanent Electoral Majority.  Picture 12 million eager new natural conservatives doing their colorful Mexican hat dances and stuff on their way to the polls to vote for our next president, El Gobernador Jeb Bush 2016!  Viva!  Si se puede!

You'll thank me for this.

Posted by: Karl Rove at July 30, 2013 03:13 PM (8ZskC)

62
one thing about Charon our cruise director...
Posted by: sven10077





Sail the River Phlegethon with Duane Patterson and Ed Morrissey

Come cruise the River of Fire with Generalissimo Duane and Blogger Ed. There is no better place to travel, no better way to travel and no better folks to travel with.

Posted by: Laurie David's Cervix at July 30, 2013 03:13 PM (kdS6q)

63 Per NBC news post (NYT) http://tinyurl.com/n96928f  Hill staffers must buy health insurance - and they're not happy about it 

Posted by: Random Poster at July 30, 2013 03:13 PM (fgkVg)

64 "here's an idea how about we tackle the sonsofbitches and keep them from fucking scoring...can we try that for a change?">>

Sounds like a version of this.

Insanity: doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results.

Posted by: McGregor at July 30, 2013 03:13 PM (qo244)

65 what did Patrick Henry say about people willingly putting themselves in chains? That's the Senate GOP


they would rather roll over for 0bama like bitches in heat- and get re-elected- than do the right thing for their constituents

Posted by: Jones in CO at July 30, 2013 03:13 PM (8sCoq)

66

True strict Constitutionalists have fantastic arguments, but how do you implement a successful "tear out all the unconstitutional crap" campaign? How do you do the daily grind of tearing out all the crap the leftists have been building since before Lincoln? The arguments are beautiful, but how do you actually implement all that with the leftist howler monkeys in the MSM and the Democrats in Congress putting their fully operational rage machine into motion?

 

Well, if it was up to me, I'd be pointing out how all their extraconstitutional bullshit is oppressing the average American and keeping him or her from creating a comfortable life  for their family.  That is, after all, what a big  government does best, as    it   has throughout the years.

 

Why accept  SNAP and welfare when you could be out making your own life of plenty, and making a lot more money than  TFG and the Dims are willing to give you?  Why settle for less?

 

Why settle for high  prices when you could get government out of the way so we  could have reasonably priced goods and services    again?    The only reason things are the  way they  are is because we've allowed the  government to become too big, too  powerful, and far too expensive.  This is a good message that hasn't even been tried by the GOP leadership,    IMO.

Posted by: BackwardsBoy, who did not vote for this shit at July 30, 2013 03:14 PM (0HooB)

67

".....and even lose us the House."

 

 

"Oh son, you trading your ever livin' soul for that?"

 

"Weren't lahk I wer usin' it or nothin'."

Posted by: Cicero Kid at July 30, 2013 03:14 PM (San0v)

68 This post is ruining Chris Christie's diet.

Posted by: George Orwell, the least interesting commenter in the world at July 30, 2013 03:14 PM (mukPq)

69 They keep telling us that it is tactically wrong to do all kinds of crap. When was the last time their tactics worked for our benefit. Fuck the GOP and there tactics we're losing try something different Speak the fuck up pricks.

At the root of the problem is the fact Republicans are trying to win small ball victories against the huge momentum of decades of "give me this, and I'll give you that".  What does "tear all this rot out" have in terms of quid pro quo?  It's a losing proposition for Democrats who are going against what their constituents want.  They want pork.  They want payouts.  What's the "win win" for Democrats?  So the Republicans are stuck arguing what's best for the nation with no payout to the Dems. 

Posted by: bonhomme at July 30, 2013 03:14 PM (WhJf8)

70 Sail the River Phlegethon with Duane Patterson and Ed Morrissey The sideshow must go on.

Posted by: George Orwell, the least interesting commenter in the world at July 30, 2013 03:15 PM (mukPq)

71


Why accept SNAP and welfare when you could be out making your own life of plenty, and making a lot more money than TFG and the Dims are willing to give you? Why settle for less?

 

Because it's safe.  The majority of humanity doesn't want freedom.  They want safety.  And if that means living as a slave, then they'll happily accept it.  Especially if they can have the little rituals that allow them to pretend that they're not slaves.

Posted by: Colorado Alex at July 30, 2013 03:15 PM (lr3d7)

72 There are a hundred "Third Parties", just look at all 50 State ballots. They mainly suck, they rarely win, and their shit is so retarded it makes Helen Keller look like Alert Einstein. But seriously, have fun, pick a snappy name and. everything.

Posted by: Lincolntf at July 30, 2013 03:16 PM (ZshNr)

73 I'm beginning to think some of you don't believe in compassionate conservatism. Or even Santa Claus.

Posted by: George Orwell, the least interesting commenter in the world at July 30, 2013 03:16 PM (mukPq)

74 The polls show that the only people who are enthusiastic about Obamacare are the liberal Democratic base. And, frankly, not all of the liberal Democratic base. Internal schism have shown up. The unions with gold-plated health plans of their own are starting to figure out that they're boned by Obamacare's taxes on such plans.

And, Obama himself has already made a huge optics blunder by agreeing to delay the employer mandate. Make him explain why that had to happen, if his plan was so brilliant. Make him explain it over and over till he gets flustered and tetchy. He's already pretty irritable.

I don't think that picking a fight over this thing is going to be a mistake to be regretted.

Posted by: torquewrench at July 30, 2013 03:16 PM (gqT4g)

75

Feckless, invertebrate GOP. I wouldn't piss in their mouth if their teeth were on fire.

*Spjts on ground*

Posted by: CrotchetyOldJarhead at July 30, 2013 03:16 PM (waJ+2)

76

Maybe if we just Lean Forward a little we'll be in a better position to surrender.

OK, I've got hold of my ankles,  please be gentle.

Posted by: American Taxpayers at July 30, 2013 03:16 PM (wAQA5)

77 62 LDC,

You win the internet for the evening....

collect your winning in  Pervian goose necks...


the horde is in good hands in my coming absence, and FenlonSpoke thanks for the kind words...

I'm not great at this like some but every once in a while I can spin a pretty word or two.

Comedy Gold Poppin' Fresh in Peruvia

Posted by: sven10077 at July 30, 2013 03:16 PM (LRFds)

78 Actually there is a true cost to shutting down the government. Same result as shutting down the electric grid, or shutting down the credit card system or the banking system. Many many people go hungry in about two days. No fast foods that you can put on your debit card ... hungry. No EBT card that works for buying junk food ... hungry. Another day or two, and you've got unrest and the start of some nifty vandalism. Another day or two and you've got lawlessness and the Police shopping at Walmart for free with the LIV's (See New Orleans after Rita or whatever it was) and not paying of course, because it's closed. Another day or two and there are home invasions of people looking for something to feed their families. Another couple of days and the gangs are forming, cause you gotta be in a gang to overcome innocents and steal their shit and everything. Now, I'm not saying I don't think it's a good idea, I just want you all to be prepared to survive the first two weeks of a crisis. If you're in a city, better hunker down with lots of supplies and ability for defense, and have some friends along too. Better yet, have a plan and get away from major metropolitan areas EARLY. I firmly believe that the result of all of this is a significant reduction in the LIV population. And the neat thing is that they will destroy each other, and we don't have to do much except set up a perimeter and pop some corn and of course go clean all that shit up when it's over. Then it always goes on to have to deal with the strongest of the gangs that survived the mess, and you better be ready. Jenjis Caan (J Kerry Reference) got nothing on these mean bastards. Expect no fairness or mercy. And maybe if that all turns out, we can re-instate a constitutional government and use the constitution as a template to go forward. And that's the only reason that I think that Ace's proclamation earlier that 'it's all over' (not an exact quote probably) might be wrong. I personally prefer this solution to SMOD, because the good guys and the prepared get to survive. It's pretty close to Let It Burn. In fact it's Let it Burn with a plan. LIBWIP

Posted by: Mephitis at July 30, 2013 03:17 PM (aD3yQ)

79 McCain lost too many marbles at Hanoi Hilton... Now he is too busy sucking Obama at the Hilton...

Posted by: Butt F*ck GOP at July 30, 2013 03:17 PM (tqOG8)

80 There's the same political benefit to keeping unpopular things, and getting to throw bones at the base ripping on what is unpopular, than in actually changing what is unpopular. Might even be more politically beneficial to have things that outrage the base that you aren't directly responsible for, if you are politically savvy enough. Not as much so on the right as the left, for sure, but it's still there.

Posted by: Dave S. at July 30, 2013 03:17 PM (UvR6d)

81

yup. re: my earlier pessimistic statement that "America is all done," we can at least keep the idea of America inside of us. Maybe one day, 60 years from now, it will make a return.

 

 

You know, we could fix this if you'd let us use that Time Machine that you don't have.

Posted by: garrett at July 30, 2013 03:17 PM (tx/9d)

82

And I'm sure the Accomodationist Wing can offer us all sorts of excuses why "this isn't the right time" and all of that. I suppose it is true -- and I can't be a baby about this and deny it -- that an actual government shutdown could cost us our chance at the Senate, and even lose us the House. And, if the latter were to happen, we'd lose our one source of power to stop Obama, at least until 2016.

 

Point of order - what, exactly, has the House stopped since January 3, 2011?  I can count the list on one hand and still have all my digits available for other purposes.

Posted by: steveegg at July 30, 2013 03:17 PM (o44nj)

83 >They keep telling us that it is tactically wrong to do all kinds of
crap.


These fucking Republicans can't get past trying to win the next news cycle.

they only long view they take is their next re-election campaign

Posted by: Jones in CO at July 30, 2013 03:18 PM (8sCoq)

84 Of course it's too late.  Although the repukes didn't vote for this mess, I don't believe they are all that upset that it is now law.  In essence, the repukes are just Statists Light.  They all crave the power of being in the cesspool of DC.

Posted by: Truck Monkey, Gruntled New Business Owner at July 30, 2013 03:19 PM (jucos)

85 Eventually you run out of other peoples money. The Burning will settle much.

Posted by: toby928 at July 30, 2013 03:19 PM (QupBk)

86
Insanity: doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results.

Ok boys, I know a lot of you are thinking we tried this play 17 times in a row, and it may have cost us a few points, but there's no way they'll expect it again! Quarterback, on the snap, hand the ball peacefully over to the nearest opposing player.....and break!

Posted by: Coach Rove at July 30, 2013 03:19 PM (qoQi/)

87 You got to know when to hold 'em, know when to fold 'em, Know when to walk away and know when to run. You never count your money when you're sittin' at the table. There'll be time enough for countin' when the dealin's done.

Posted by: Kenny Rogers at July 30, 2013 03:20 PM (XvHmy)

88 Well, if it was up to me, I'd be pointing out how all their extraconstitutional bullshit is oppressing the average American and keeping him or her from creating a comfortable life for their family. That is, after all, what a big government does best, as it has throughout the years.

Why accept SNAP and welfare when you could be out making your own life of plenty, and making a lot more money than TFG and the Dims are willing to give you? Why settle for less?

Why settle for high prices when you could get government out of the way so we could have reasonably priced goods and services again? The only reason things are the way they are is because we've allowed the government to become too big, too powerful, and far too expensive. This is a good message that hasn't even been tried by the GOP leadership, IMO.


Right, that's a fantastic message.  How do you actually do deals in Congress with that mission statement?  It's a loser for Democrats.  You can't deal because they don't get anything out of it.  They don't get pork to hand to their constituents, they don't get votes for going along with the Republicans.  The only way that works is if that message gets out and you replace Dems with Reps.  THEN you can actually get the whole ball rolling in the right direction.

Posted by: bonhomme at July 30, 2013 03:21 PM (WhJf8)

89

Have we become the frogs in the slow boiling pot?  The frogs don't know, after all.

Posted by: Conservative Crank at July 30, 2013 03:21 PM (sQ0LB)

90 It would also be fun to have the House GOP delegation all standing out on the steps of the Capitol with an enormous banner behind them.

What goes on the banner? The Max Baucus quote about how Obamacare is a trainwreck.

OBAMACARE = "TRAINWRECK".

In five-foot-tall, high visibility letters.

With everyone present swiveling around to point at the word. "This is how _Democrats themselves_ describe the plan they came up with. Do you trust your health and your family's health to a 'trainwreck' of a plan? No? We have an alternative. Stand with us while we repeal the trainwreck and put in something that works."

Of course, this presupposes the fractious House GOP being able to come up with and agree on an alternative that they could then present. A long shot.

Posted by: torquewrench at July 30, 2013 03:21 PM (gqT4g)

91 Getting off topic here, but my first chance today to post about this (mostly lurk, but very motivated today). My wife (Canadian) became a US citizen today. The guest speaker/dignitary that spoke at the end of the ceremony was Valerie Jarrett. Disgusting. I could count on two hands the number of words that actually congratulated the 700 or so new citizens. The remainder was a blatant, flat out rah rah speech about how wonderful TFG is and how hard he's working for all of you. The last 3rd of the speech was about how wonderful the senate immigration bill was and how we should all work to see it become law. I have never been so disgusted and offended. Honestly if a politician I had agreed with ideologically did the same thing I would equally be offended because this is such a special day for the new citizens. If anyone ever doubted what TFG and his posse are all about, this was a prime, craptastic example of how low they are. My blood was boiling. It is one thing to get pissed off watching them on TV or listening on the radio. When it's in your face and violating a solemn personal occasion, it really hits home.

Posted by: Pete at July 30, 2013 03:21 PM (2N4Ot)

92

Have we become the frogs in the slow boiling pot? The frogs don't know, after all.

 

Posted by: Conservative Crank at July 30, 2013 08:21 PM (sQ0LB)

 

Ribbit!

Posted by: Boiled Frog at July 30, 2013 03:22 PM (o44nj)

93

Have we become the frogs in the slow boiling pot? The frogs don't know, after all.

 

Posted by: Conservative Crank at July 30, 2013 08:21 PM (sQ0LB)

 

I may have started slow, but I'm just about out of water now.  Enjoy the red-hot metal.

Posted by: Now-Rapidly Boiling Pot at July 30, 2013 03:24 PM (o44nj)

94

So Ace in history

Gen G Washington - we have to take the fight to the British let's cross the Delaware?

Ace - But we could lose boats and get our socks wet its just not worth the fight

 

.......comfortable in our bondage? May the chains rest lightly!

 

Posted by: bobbymike at July 30, 2013 03:24 PM (YFPAQ)

95 Why accept SNAP and welfare when you could be out making your own life of plenty, and making a lot more money than TFG and the Dims are willing to give you? Why settle for less?>>

Part of the problem is they have segregated the poor from everybody that works. By letting things go to shit where makers are forced to move away from the poor by  judges that rule on "what the criminals home life is" and crappy schools. If the only thing you see is snap and welfare it is normal. Then the culture of the poor kids to punish those that want to succeed. It became a self fulfilling prophecy.

Posted by: McGregor at July 30, 2013 03:24 PM (qo244)

96 More ammo and a third party. In that order.

Posted by: Harrison Bergeron at July 30, 2013 03:24 PM (JQuNB)

97 what will the 3rd party be called?

Posted by: Jones in CO at July 30, 2013 03:26 PM (8sCoq)

98 >>> Per NBC news post Hill staffers must buy health insurance - and they're not happy about it Suck it, Monkeys!

Posted by: fluffy Lemon at July 30, 2013 03:26 PM (czQU/)

99 72 There are a hundred "Third Parties", just look at all 50 State ballots. They mainly suck, they rarely win, and their shit is so retarded it makes Helen Keller look like Alert Einstein. But seriously, have fun, pick a snappy name and. everything.

Posted by: Lincolntf at July 30, 2013 08:16 PM (ZshNr)


--Helen Keller was fairly intelligent, especially giver her handicaps.  Sheila Jacksoff Lee is far stupider despite having all her senses intact.

Posted by: logprof at July 30, 2013 03:26 PM (3VBXw)

100 Ace - But we could lose boats and get our socks wet its just not worth the fight You didn't actually read the post, did you?

Posted by: toby928 at July 30, 2013 03:26 PM (QupBk)

101 We're already the "party of no". Obama has hammered that one home into the soft skulls of the LIV's. So what the hell. Let's actually be the party of no on this one.

Posted by: Dave S. at July 30, 2013 03:27 PM (UvR6d)

102

So Ace McCain/McConnell/Cornyn/et al in history

Gen G Washington - we have to take the fight to the British let's cross the Delaware?

Ace McCain/McConnell/Cornyn/et al - But we could lose boats and get our socks wet its just not worth the fight

 

.......comfortable in our bondage? May the chains rest lightly!

 

Posted by: bobbymike at July 30, 2013 08:24 PM (YFPAQ)

 

ReWrite™ engaged before Ace whacks you with a half-full Valu-Rite bottle.

Posted by: steveegg at July 30, 2013 03:27 PM (o44nj)

103 I prefer the Party of Fuck No.

Posted by: toby928 at July 30, 2013 03:27 PM (QupBk)

104 Fine, put her mug on your flag.

Posted by: Lincolntf at July 30, 2013 03:28 PM (ZshNr)

105 I say fight it. Push it. Shut it down.

And if we lose the House, well, then we know.

We know that no help will be forthcoming from anywhere.

And then we act accordingly.

Posted by: tsj017 at July 30, 2013 03:28 PM (tIcJF)

106

what will the 3rd party be called?

 

Posted by: Jones in CO at July 30, 2013 08:26 PM (8sCoq)

 

DOOM!

 

And Monty will be our leader.

Posted by: steveegg at July 30, 2013 03:28 PM (o44nj)

107 97 what will the 3rd party be called? Posted by: Jones in CO at July 30, 2013 08:26 PM (8sCoq) I'm for The Liberty Party.

Posted by: Harrison Bergeron at July 30, 2013 03:28 PM (JQuNB)

108 Senate Minority Leader Jones in CO would be raking 0bama over the coals every fucking day, and plotting his defeat on every issue

Posted by: Jones in CO at July 30, 2013 03:29 PM (8sCoq)

109 104 LincolnTF,

Kick us out Linc...

no really I read earlier that noted diet guru and fitness expert Chris Christie says Blue Heaven would be better off without us leeches in flyover country....

so kick us out and fly over...

I'd give my right nut happily to not have the EPA breathing down my neck as a shale speculator.

Posted by: sven10077 at July 30, 2013 03:29 PM (LRFds)

110 >I'm for The Liberty Party.

Posted by: Harrison Bergeron at July 30, 2013 08:28 PM (JQuNB)



I like it- or the Constitution Party

Posted by: Jones in CO at July 30, 2013 03:29 PM (8sCoq)

111 What , in the ever loving fuck , is a post ?

Posted by: Bill D. Cat at July 30, 2013 03:29 PM (0iJzo)

112 How do you get rid of the gigantic socialist monstrosity of massive deficit spending and entrenched welfare and bureaucracy? Well, there's two ways. One way is to dismantle it. That way is obviously more work. Or it *seems* like more work, because the other way is to wait for it to collapse. And if that seems like less work to you, you aren't a student of history. Then again, being a student of history, I figure people will wait until it's too late and then be shocked when it all comes down around their ears, and *then* they'll start acting *really* stupid, not the garden-variety stupid we're seeing now. ... A few people found a way to live as something other than grist for the mill, and the world hates that idea so much it *must* be destroyed. I think it's some kind of universal principle.

Posted by: Merovign, Dark Lord of the Sith [/i] [/b] [/s] [/u] at July 30, 2013 03:29 PM (qyfb5)

113 I'm for The Liberty Party. With a thirsty tree on blue field flag.

Posted by: toby928 at July 30, 2013 03:30 PM (QupBk)

114 what will the 3rd party be called?

Posted by: Jones in CO at July 30, 2013 08:26 PM (8sCoq)
>>

The free shit party.

Fuck they don't watch the news we'll have things fixed before they figure it out.

Posted by: McGregor at July 30, 2013 03:30 PM (qo244)

115 Frogs in a pot... What do the French have to do with it?

Posted by: sTevo at July 30, 2013 03:30 PM (8Ylyo)

116 Helen Keller was fairly intelligent, especially giver her handicaps.

Yeah, but then she had a commie whispering in her ear (metaphorically) saying she was only successful because she had rich parents.  She went full-blown commie in later years.

Posted by: bonhomme at July 30, 2013 03:30 PM (QehQP)

117 the coming civil war in the party FIFY.

Posted by: rickl at July 30, 2013 03:30 PM (sdi6R)

118 Let's all go to Peruvia.  This is the only logical option.

Posted by: Truck Monkey, Gruntled New Business Owner at July 30, 2013 03:31 PM (jucos)

119 110 Jones in CO,

Call it the Free Shit Party

Posted by: sven10077 at July 30, 2013 03:31 PM (LRFds)

120 I like it- or the Constitution Party Posted by: Jones in CO at July 30, 2013 08:29 PM (8sCoq) That works too.

Posted by: Harrison Bergeron at July 30, 2013 03:31 PM (JQuNB)

121 100 Ace has in fact come a long way. A long way. Not quite the spine of steel with corncob stuck in ass cluster yet, but a long way.

Posted by: T. at July 30, 2013 03:31 PM (7BwYs)

122

Frogs in a pot... What do the French have to do with it?

 

Posted by: sTevo at July 30, 2013 08:30 PM (8Ylyo)

 

They're a couple years ahead of us on the Red Line Express to Hell.

Posted by: steveegg at July 30, 2013 03:32 PM (o44nj)

123 112 Mero,

if you are within 75 miles of a city and don't know your neighbors...

you are wrong.

Posted by: sven10077 at July 30, 2013 03:32 PM (LRFds)

124 Lose seats for a futile stunt designed mostly to boost the pre-primary conservative creds for likely candidates?

Why is this a good idea again?  We do all know that there is exactly zero chance of this succeeding in stopping Obamacare, right?

RIGHT???

An argument can be made that this is part of a long term effort to engender public option towards repealing Obamacare, and it's not a bad argument if and only if we recognize that as the goal.

Likewise, one could suggest that it's merely a negotiation tactic.

Problem is, too many of the kneejerk, reactionary types (who seem to be the majority here) will blame the inevitable failure as "teh rino gop establishment caved again grrrr".

So yes- as a purely political gesture intended to bring showcase the failings of Obamacare into the spotlight, this might not be a terrible idea. 

Unfortunately, the base is only willing to engage the emotional outrage center of their brains, without bothering to think more than one step ahead and cursing those who do.

It's not about accomodation.  It's about acknowledging a very, very obvious reality.

Posted by: Hollowpoint at July 30, 2013 03:32 PM (X9Mnx)

125 The GOP is rapidly *becoming* a third party. We don't need a third party, we need a *second* party.

Posted by: Merovign, Dark Lord of the Sith [/i] [/b] [/s] [/u] at July 30, 2013 03:32 PM (qyfb5)

126 If there's going to be a mass migration to Peruvia , I call dibs on ATF .

Posted by: Bill D. Cat at July 30, 2013 03:32 PM (0iJzo)

127 This just in..... The City of San Diego is suing Bob Filner over costs associated with sexual harassment claims.  HAHAHAHAHA.

Posted by: Truck Monkey, Gruntled New Business Owner at July 30, 2013 03:33 PM (jucos)

128 sven I don't think me n you is on the same page, Hoss

Posted by: Jones in CO at July 30, 2013 03:33 PM (8sCoq)

129 and I mean that as my drill sgt explained if you are ever more than a foot from your unguarded weapon...


you are wrong...

Posted by: sven10077 at July 30, 2013 03:33 PM (LRFds)

130 How about he "Can we scrape up enough votes to appear on a single ballot?" Party?

Posted by: Lincolntf at July 30, 2013 03:33 PM (ZshNr)

131

McGregor/Sven,

 

The Free Shit Party is already taken by the Rats.  How about the Free Fucks Party?

 

Wait a minute - the Rats also took that.

Posted by: steveegg at July 30, 2013 03:33 PM (o44nj)

132 A few people found a way to live as something other than grist for the mill, and the world hates that idea so much it *must* be destroyed. I think it's some kind of universal principle. 
Posted by: Merovign, Dark Lord of the Sith at July 30, 2013 08:29 PM (qyfb5)


Crabs in a bucket.  

Posted by: ConservativeMonster at July 30, 2013 03:33 PM (sGtp+)

133 I'm of the opinion that Republicans should just stand back and let O'care self-destruct.  Call me an optimist, but I think very few healthy Americans will sign up for the exchanges... leading to a rate-death-spiral in short order.

I predict things will get so bad that at least one Democrat running for Senate will join the "repeal it" ranks.

Posted by: Serious Cat at July 30, 2013 03:33 PM (UOjzE)

134 It's not about accomodation. It's about acknowledging a very, very obvious reality. That we're fucked?

Posted by: toby928 at July 30, 2013 03:33 PM (QupBk)

135 114 McGregor,

I like the way you think...

"Free Shit Party" confuse the fuckers

Posted by: sven10077 at July 30, 2013 03:34 PM (LRFds)

136 Posted by: Hollowpoint at July 30, 2013 08:32 PM (X9Mnx) You're just a purist who wants to drive eveyone but you out. You should be happy we finally agree with out. Throw us out, coach! Let us know how that works out for you.

Posted by: Merovign, Dark Lord of the Sith [/i] [/b] [/s] [/u] at July 30, 2013 03:34 PM (qyfb5)

137

That we're fucked?

 

Posted by: toby928© at July 30, 2013 08:33 PM (QupBk)

 

Or as Monty puts it, terminally boned.

 

How about a merger of the two - terminally fucked.

Posted by: steveegg at July 30, 2013 03:35 PM (o44nj)

138 I'm of the opinion that Republicans should just stand back and let O'care self-destruct. Posted by: Serious Cat at July 30, 2013 08:33 PM (UOjzE) It's *designed* to do that. The "single-payer" solution has already been written. It wasn't a goal, it was a means to an end. Our end.

Posted by: Merovign, Dark Lord of the Sith [/i] [/b] [/s] [/u] at July 30, 2013 03:36 PM (qyfb5)

139 I like it- or the Constitution Party
Posted by: Jones in CO at July 30, 2013 08:29 PM (8sCoq)



That sounds really old, like some kind of pirate boat or something.  None of the cool young plugged-in kids that I hang with would get it.  You got a name with like, Bieber in it?

Posted by: Meghan McCain at July 30, 2013 03:36 PM (8ZskC)

140 128 Jones in CO,

I think we're in the same boat but McGregor and I oddly both had the same "outside of the box thought"....

once every 2 to 6 years Donk Ass MoFo discovers his moderate roots and reminds folk "hey I hunt, and I care about the poor...I try not to motor them down in my Maseratti..."

the Free Shit Party would have to remember every 2 to 6 years...

"hey Free Shit is T3h Aw3s0m3"

people who are jedi mind tricked by the daily show are not Sherlock Fucking Holmes.

Posted by: sven10077 at July 30, 2013 03:36 PM (LRFds)

141 That we're fucked?

Posted by: toby928© at July 30, 2013 08:33 PM (QupBk)


No, that we have to wait until we take the Senate to make moves to repeal ACA.

Posted by: Serious Cat at July 30, 2013 03:36 PM (UOjzE)

142 There is hope.  My grandson has noticed that Burmese immigrants in his area get government money, and that while they have little jobs at Burger King or such,  they all have fancy cars.  This has pisssed him off,  as he is 17 and saving for his own car.

"Grandma,  here I am working and saving to get a car,  and the government gives them money to buy NEW cars!"

"Yes,  grandson,  and they do it with tax money they take from you and me."

Another conservative is born!!


Posted by: Miss Marple at July 30, 2013 03:37 PM (GoIUi)

143 (Ace) we can at least keep the idea of America inside of us

The world prior to the idea of America was a pretty bleak freaking place. 

The British empire got about 90% of the way there before it decided it didn't want to be an empire anymore, but missed on a few very key elements.

The ancient Greeks were never really close at all, because their notions were only for the elite, not the common man.

Posted by: Purp[/i][/b][/u][/s] at July 30, 2013 03:37 PM (S3yfV)

144

No, that we have to wait until we take the Senate to make moves to repeal ACA.

 

Posted by: Serious Cat at July 30, 2013 08:36 PM (UOjzE)

 

Given that the subsidies that are a part of PlaceboCare will be handed out before that can happen, we're terminally fucked.

Posted by: steveegg at July 30, 2013 03:37 PM (o44nj)

145 It's *designed* to do that. The "single-payer" solution has already been written.

It wasn't a goal, it was a means to an end.

Our end.

Posted by: Merovign, Dark Lord of the Sith at July 30, 2013 08:36 PM (qyfb5)

It has?  This is the first I've heard about a single-payer provision.  If the exchanges are so bad, the private insurers will drop out.  Where is the law that gives the Feds the power to offer a replacement insurance plan?

Posted by: Serious Cat at July 30, 2013 03:39 PM (UOjzE)

146 That we're fucked?

Pretty much.

How harshly we fucked is about all we can influence.

Posted by: Hollowpoint at July 30, 2013 03:39 PM (X9Mnx)

147 “You cannot dialogue with the prince of this world. This is clear.” - Pope Francis

Posted by: Iblis at July 30, 2013 03:39 PM (9221z)

148 >>> We do all know that there is exactly zero chance of this succeeding in stopping Obamacare, right? >>> RIGHT??? Wrong. There are numerous jumping-off points. Various gov't unions don't want to be saddled with it, so saddle 'em up and make Obama ride. Or we could just quit, as you seem to be advocating.

Posted by: fluffy Lemon at July 30, 2013 03:39 PM (czQU/)

149

Because it's safe. The majority of humanity doesn't want freedom. They want safety. And if that means living as a slave, then they'll happily accept it. Especially if they can have the little rituals that allow them to pretend that they're not slaves.

 

Point out that is disappearing from   American  life.  Show all  the empty seats in   the stands   at sporting events. Show declining attendance figures.

 

Hell, just show how bad the economy is doing under Dim rule. The idiot GOP won't even  do that.  When was  the last time we heard the real UE figures from a Pubbie?

 

Those  spineless  wimps deserve to be cast upon the ash heap of history for their  failure to act properly to  insure a good life for the majority of the country  in accordance with our Constitution. Yeah,  a third party will hand over power to the  Dims  for a few years,  but  with the leadership we have now in the GOP, they're giving    the Dims everything   they want anyway.

Posted by: BackwardsBoy, who did not vote for this shit at July 30, 2013 03:40 PM (0HooB)

150 It has? This is the first I've heard about a single-payer provision. If the exchanges are so bad, the private insurers will drop out. Where is the law that gives the Feds the power to offer a replacement insurance plan?



If the exchanges don't work, we will have a healthcare "crisis."  You know the rest.

Posted by: Cicero (@cicero) at July 30, 2013 03:40 PM (8ZskC)

151 Given that the subsidies that are a part of PlaceboCare will be handed out before that can happen, we're terminally fucked.

Posted by: steveegg at July 30, 2013 08:37 PM (o44nj)

Subsidies aren't worht much if their isn't a single insurer on your State's exchange.

Posted by: Serious Cat at July 30, 2013 03:40 PM (UOjzE)

152

Posted by: Hollowpoint at July 30, 2013 08:32 PM (X9Mnx)

 

Spoken like a true member of the minority half of the Party-In-Government.

Posted by: steveegg at July 30, 2013 03:40 PM (o44nj)

153 I've just come to terms with the fact that since I was born at the end of the baby boom, I'm going to be put to sleep by the death panels when I am no longer able to work because I'll have some sort of age related 'illness' or 'condition.'

Unable to work= not worth keeping alive.

New World Order baby.

/at least my organs will be harvested by our Dear Leaders to help them live on....

Posted by: shibumi at July 30, 2013 03:40 PM (25HWz)

154 84 Of course it's too late. Although the repukes didn't vote for this mess, I don't believe they are all that upset that it is now law. In essence, the repukes are just Statists Light. They all crave the power of being in the cesspool of DC. Posted by: Truck Monkey, Gruntled New Business Owner at July 30, 2013 08:19 PM (jucos) I agree 100%. The Republicans have no intention of reducing the size and scope of government. All they want is a seat at the table of power. You don't hear the UK Tories advocating for the privatisation of the NHS, do you? All they do is argue that they can administer it better than Labor. I actually think that we are lucky in that we are approaching a full-on economic collapse. Unlike Europe, state-run healthcare won't have time to get a foothold in America before it all blows up.

Posted by: rickl at July 30, 2013 03:41 PM (sdi6R)

155   It has? This is the first I've heard about a single-payer provision. If the exchanges are so bad, the private insurers will drop out. Where is the law that gives the Feds the power to offer a replacement insurance plan? 
Posted by: Serious Cat at July 30, 2013 08:39 PM (UOjzE)


It's not in Ocare proper.   It's the "solution" the Lefties will offer when Ocare "fails".  

"The "free market" has failed due to evil greedy insurance companies!   Time for single payer!"

They're hoping the failure of Ocare will drive the public to demanding more gov't healthcare.  

Posted by: ConservativeMonster at July 30, 2013 03:41 PM (oY6Yp)

156 124 Hollowpoint,

Yeah look not to doubt the eleventy D chess ability of the McCain Gang or even you Hollowpoint no offense...

but when a furry hunter like Ace, and a retarded viking like me figured out in 2008 that Ogabecare was purpose built to fail to get singlepayer and we look more right than those who think its failure hurts the donks...

Let's just say Spock may well be a shaved Ewok and leave it at that

Posted by: sven10077 at July 30, 2013 03:41 PM (LRFds)

157

Subsidies aren't worht much if their isn't a single insurer on your State's exchange.

 

Posted by: Serious Cat at July 30, 2013 08:40 PM (UOjzE)

 

The problem is, there will be a single insurer on your state's exchange...as planned.

Posted by: steveegg at July 30, 2013 03:41 PM (o44nj)

158 If the exchanges don't work, we will have a healthcare "crisis." You know the rest.

Posted by: Cicero (@cicero) at July 30, 2013 08:40 PM (8ZskC)


Tell me how a single-payer reform gets past the GOP controlled house?

Posted by: Serious Cat at July 30, 2013 03:41 PM (UOjzE)

159 I feel the pain. Daily. The ony advice I'll give is stop thinking about what they are going to do to you, start thinking what you are going to do to them. This is going to be a great story. One way or the other. As far as the GOP...yes, I'm told it exists.

Posted by: T. at July 30, 2013 03:41 PM (7BwYs)

160 It has? This is the first I've heard about a single-payer provision. If the exchanges are so bad, the private insurers will drop out. Where is the law that gives the Feds the power to offer a replacement insurance plan? Posted by: Serious Cat at July 30, 2013 08:39 PM (UOjzE) Same place in the law that allowed them to pass the one they already passed. I said they wrote it, I didn't say they've passed it yet. That comes once the existing system fails so badly they have people marching in the street, then they "solve" it with Even More Government. You seriously missed the Czar talk about this being a path to single-payer? Totally flew by you?

Posted by: Merovign, Dark Lord of the Sith [/i] [/b] [/s] [/u] at July 30, 2013 03:41 PM (qyfb5)

161 --Helen Keller was fairly intelligent, especially giver her handicaps. Sheila Jacksoff Lee is far stupider despite having all her senses intact. Posted by: logprof Can she write in cursive? Let's switch her cursive writing with Folger's coffee crystals and see what happens!

Posted by: Reader C.J. Burch writes more nonsense...... at July 30, 2013 03:42 PM (v6hyJ)

162 Tell me how a single-payer reform gets past the GOP controlled house?


Boehner.

Posted by: Cicero (@cicero) at July 30, 2013 03:43 PM (8ZskC)

163 >Tell me how a single-payer reform gets past the GOP controlled house?

Posted by: Serious Cat at July 30, 2013 08:41 PM (UOjzE)




statement presumes we hold the House in 2014

Posted by: Jones in CO at July 30, 2013 03:43 PM (8sCoq)

164 158 Serious Cat,

Tell me how the GOP House won't be demonized by Chuck Tard and Piss Matthews for not clapping for Tinkerbell Soetoro to fly....

it has always been their endgame.

Posted by: sven10077 at July 30, 2013 03:43 PM (LRFds)

165

Tell me how a single-payer reform gets past the GOP controlled house?

 

Posted by: Serious Cat at July 30, 2013 08:41 PM (UOjzE)

 

Easy - Dingy Harry will shut down government until he gets his way.

 

And Bo(eh)ner will cave.

Posted by: steveegg at July 30, 2013 03:43 PM (o44nj)

166

Posted by: Pete at July 30, 2013 08:21 PM (2N4Ot)

 

 

 

 

Telling a room full of people that followed immigration laws that they should support a bill that rewards those that broke immigration law.

 

 

 

Fuckin' brilliant.

Posted by: AZ Hi Desert (All my Hate cannot be found) at July 30, 2013 03:44 PM (ial2b)

167 Boehner, that gutless chain-smoking pussy motherfucker- I really want to horsewhip him on the Capitol Lawn

Posted by: Jones in CO at July 30, 2013 03:44 PM (8sCoq)

168 Tell me how a single-payer reform gets past the GOP controlled house? Boehner. Minority Leader Boehner.

Posted by: toby928 at July 30, 2013 03:44 PM (QupBk)

169 Tell me how a single-payer reform gets past the GOP controlled house? Posted by: Serious Cat at July 30, 2013 08:41 PM (UOjzE) Same way several trillion new debt did.

Posted by: Merovign, Dark Lord of the Sith [/i] [/b] [/s] [/u] at July 30, 2013 03:44 PM (qyfb5)

170 167 Boehner, that gutless chain-smoking pussy motherfucker- I really want to horsewhip him on the Capitol Lawn Posted by: Jones in CO at July 30, 2013 08:44 PM (8sCoq) Do you, perchance, have a newsletter I can subscribe to?

Posted by: BCochran1981 - Credible Hulk at July 30, 2013 03:45 PM (GEICT)

171 The problem with the GOP eliters is their insistence on the principle of Go Along to Get Along.

.....and pretty soon you have no principles.

And will someone point out Precedent Mendacious' phony talking points in his "Middle Class" BS?
One of the main strategies of the marxists is to CRUSH the middle class' aspirations of upward mobility.

He is ACTIVELY pursuing that goal while pretending to the other.

WILL NOBODY CALL HIM OUT?

Posted by: ontherocks at July 30, 2013 03:45 PM (J64dn)

172 Serious Cat,  it doesn't have to pass the House,  the way Obama operates.

He will declare a national emergency and simply institute it by edict.  The media will hail him as a savior,  the LIV's will think it's groovy,  and we will get to see how well an NHS system works in the US.

I bet we won't even get the option of going to private doctores.  He will draft all physicians and control all medicine.

Bah.  I go on Medicare in September,  so I will let you all know how swell your future medical care will be.

Posted by: Miss Marple at July 30, 2013 03:45 PM (GoIUi)

173 @141 No, that we have to wait until we take the Senate to make moves to repeal ACA.

Damn man, we couldn't even end the Department of Education (which educates nobody), the Department of Commerce (who's sole job is to impede commerce), etc. at any time since 1995. You think, even with an R CONgress and RiNO Prezzy Chris Krispecreme that ACA is being repealed? Seriously?

Posted by: DocJ at July 30, 2013 03:45 PM (du8Bm)

174 Eventually my waters turn to fires. Just saying.

Posted by: Sweet River Apocalypse at July 30, 2013 03:46 PM (Aif/5)

175 Tell me how a single-payer reform gets past the GOP controlled house?>>

King Bammy invokes it and every politician keeps their mouth shut.

Sound Familiar?

Posted by: McGregor at July 30, 2013 03:46 PM (qo244)

176
1) Exchanges fold.  Nobody can "comply".
2) The "tax" for non-compliance is ALREADY in place. 
3) Raising that "tax" is only a "minor tweak" to the existing law.
4) Medicare is extended to the whole population.

Posted by: Purp[/i][/b][/u][/s] at July 30, 2013 03:46 PM (S3yfV)

177 RE: O'care was designed to fail

You people are giving too much credit to the democrats. O'care sucks because the democrats don't know fuck-shit about how economics works. Its not a grand conspiracy to get the plan they really want.  They just didn't know what the fuck they are doing.  When trying to understand the democrat's crazy decisions, always pick stupidity over conspiracy.

Posted by: Serious Cat at July 30, 2013 03:46 PM (UOjzE)

178 I'd hit Meghan McCain so hard, a cure for cancer would drop out of her uterus rendering this Obamacare idiocy moot.

Posted by: Fritz at July 30, 2013 03:47 PM (bWoh5)

179
King Bammy invokes it and every politician keeps their mouth shut.

THIS.

Posted by: shibumi at July 30, 2013 03:47 PM (25HWz)

180 Wrong. There are numerous jumping-off points. Various gov't unions don't want to be saddled with it, so saddle 'em up and make Obama ride.

If you honestly believe there's any chance of an Obamacare repeal before 2016, I recommend you find the nearest Jr High civics textbook and review how our system of government works.

The provision to issue waivers and other such discretionary bullshit written into the bill- you do realize those weren't put there by accident, yes?

They were put there precisely to give themselves the ability to shield and limit the damage to political allies.

The unions aren't going to turn on Obama over Obamacare.  Senate Dems aren't going to join the GOP in delivering a 60 vote majority.  Obama isn't going to veto his signature legislation under any circumstance.

Again- there's zero chance this succeeds in stopping Obamacare in any meaningful way.  Once you recognize that obvious fact you may come back to the adult table.

Posted by: Hollowpoint at July 30, 2013 03:47 PM (X9Mnx)

181 Once you recognize that obvious fact you may come back to the adult table. And do .. what?

Posted by: toby928 at July 30, 2013 03:48 PM (QupBk)

182 #177  THEY HAVE ALREADY SAID THIS IS THE FIRST STEP TO SINGLE PAYER!!

Have you not been paying attention?  They SAID this was their plan! It is structured in such a way as to destroy the insurance companies!

Jeesh!

Posted by: Miss Marple at July 30, 2013 03:48 PM (GoIUi)

183 160 It has? This is the first I've heard about a single-payer provision. If the exchanges are so bad, the private insurers will drop out. Where is the law that gives the Feds the power to offer a replacement insurance plan? Posted by: Serious Cat at July 30, 2013 08:39 PM (UOjzE) You seriously missed the Czar talk about this being a path to single-payer? Totally flew by you? Posted by: Merovign, Dark Lord of the Sith at July 30, 2013 08:41 PM (qyfb5) Obamacare was designed to fail. After destroying the private insurance market. That will leave single-payer government-run healthcare as the only option. And the LIVs will demand it.

Posted by: rickl at July 30, 2013 03:48 PM (sdi6R)

184 @ 181 And do .. what?

Get King Putt his 9-iron for his next approach shot.

Posted by: DocJ at July 30, 2013 03:49 PM (du8Bm)

185 Fritz, newsletter, sign me up.

Posted by: sTevo at July 30, 2013 03:49 PM (8Ylyo)

186 91  Posted by: Pete at July 30, 2013 08:21 PM (2N4Ot)
*****************
Congratulations to your wife.  How unfortunate that ValJar is let out of her cage to perform at  ceremonies meant to celebrate America.  That said, glad to have a new American who wanted it badly enough to do it right.

Posted by: gracepmc at July 30, 2013 03:49 PM (rznx3)

187 Its not a grand conspiracy to get the plan they really want.

The policy wonk that architected it essentially confessed that it was designed to fail as a precursor to single payer.

Posted by: Purp[/i][/b][/u][/s] at July 30, 2013 03:49 PM (S3yfV)

188 177 Serious Cat,

Not on this...

they've been fucking this chicken since the 20s...

basically they finally accepted that the eleven second attention span caucus who works(an ever shrinking number BTW) will not eat the shit apple of UHC in one gulp but two bites...

fuck yeah that may be an apple...

sure there's plenty of fucktard in the mess but at the end of the day they know a majority in their caucus love shit apples and they are bettering enough 11second AS voters will want to try the second bite

Posted by: sven10077 at July 30, 2013 03:49 PM (LRFds)

189 1) Exchanges fold. Nobody can "comply".
2) The "tax" for non-compliance is ALREADY in place.
3) Raising that "tax" is only a "minor tweak" to the existing law.
4) Medicare is extended to the whole population.

Posted by: Purp at July 30, 2013 08:46 PM (S3yfV)

By law, they can only collect on that tax by reducing your tax refund.  It is incredibly weak. Republicans aren't going to vote to increase the penalties or give its enforcement teeth.


Posted by: Serious Cat at July 30, 2013 03:49 PM (UOjzE)

190 Its not a grand conspiracy to get the plan they really want.



Yes it is. It is sloppy law but that is a feature not a bug. It was designed to destroy private insurance. Obama tipped his hat before he was elected when he said it would take time to get a single payer system.

Posted by: typo dyno rip van winkin at the mofos at July 30, 2013 03:50 PM (OT+H4)

191

You people are giving too much credit to the democrats. O'care sucks because the democrats don't know fuck-shit about how economics works. Its not a grand conspiracy to get the plan they really want. They just didn't know what the fuck they are doing. When trying to understand the democrat's crazy decisions, always pick stupidity over conspiracy.

 

Posted by: Serious Cat at July 30, 2013 08:46 PM (UOjzE)

 

Counterpoint - Lenin, Mao, Castro, et al didn't know fuck-shit about economics and their shit lasted decades because they know how to manipulate humans.

Posted by: steveegg at July 30, 2013 03:50 PM (o44nj)

192 I want to just drift along the sweet river Apocalypse.

At least we have the soul of a poet to adequately depict our circumstances.

Posted by: herbork at July 30, 2013 03:50 PM (t1s5e)

193 The policy wonk that architected it essentially confessed that it was designed to fail as a precursor to single payer.

Posted by: Purp at July 30, 2013 08:49 PM (S3yfV)

Link?

Posted by: Serious Cat at July 30, 2013 03:51 PM (UOjzE)

194 Lose seats for a futile stunt designed mostly to boost the pre-primary conservative creds for likely candidates?

Why is this a good idea again? We do all know that there is exactly zero chance of this succeeding in stopping Obamacare, right?

RIGHT???

An argument can be made that this is part of a long term effort to engender public option towards repealing Obamacare, and it's not a bad argument if and only if we recognize that as the goal.

Likewise, one could suggest that it's merely a negotiation tactic.

Problem is, too many of the kneejerk, reactionary types (who seem to be the majority here) will blame the inevitable failure as "teh rino gop establishment caved again grrrr".

So yes- as a purely political gesture intended to bring showcase the failings of Obamacare into the spotlight, this might not be a terrible idea.

Unfortunately, the base is only willing to engage the emotional outrage center of their brains, without bothering to think more than one step ahead and cursing those who do.

It's not about accomodation. It's about acknowledging a very, very obvious reality.


So this is another hill we should surrender? Another line scratched in the dirt we should step back from? At what point do we actually stand and fight? Do we ever get to that point, or should we always just acquiesce, and vote the McCain/Rove approved ticket? And please don't give me 11 dimensional cheese as an answer. I'd rather lose on my terms, standing up for what I believe in, now, than continue to support this charade of an opposition party.

Posted by: Sticky Wicket at July 30, 2013 03:51 PM (qoQi/)

195 I'd hit Meghan McCain so hard, a cure for cancer would drop out of her uterus rendering this Obamacare idiocy moot. I've had the same thought , but dude , I'd hate to get caught .

Posted by: Bill D. Cat at July 30, 2013 03:51 PM (0iJzo)

196

By law, they can only collect on that tax by reducing your tax refund. It is incredibly weak. Republicans aren't going to vote to increase the penalties or give its enforcement teeth.

 

Posted by: Serious Cat at July 30, 2013 08:49 PM (UOjzE)

 

You haven't seen the 2014 tax forms yet, have you?  There will be a line for those of us who pay estimated quarterly taxes (even to the point of having to write two checks on April 15) to add the penalty to the bottom line.

Posted by: steveegg at July 30, 2013 03:52 PM (o44nj)

197 Just because the Democrats don't know what they're doing has never stopped them before. And frankly, what is it that they are trying to do? Donald Sensing wrote a very interesting essay a few days ago about Obama. Don't pay attention to the typical things he does that appear to be FUBAR. His plan is to reduce the country to a one-party state. At that, he is succeeding. Most of the comments on this post indicate that.

Posted by: Reader C.J. Burch writes more nonsense...... at July 30, 2013 03:52 PM (v6hyJ)

198 186 91 Posted by: Pete at July 30, 2013 08:21 PM (2N4Ot) ***************** Congratulations to your wife. How unfortunate that ValJar is let out of her cage to perform at ceremonies meant to celebrate America. That said, glad to have a new American who wanted it badly enough to do it right. Posted by: gracepmc at July 30, 2013 08:49 PM (rznx3) Thanks. She was pissed too, and now she's registered to vote!

Posted by: Pete at July 30, 2013 03:52 PM (2N4Ot)

199 By law, they can only collect on that tax by reducing your tax refund.

That gets changed in an obscure last minute one sentence amendment attached to a Defense spending bill.

Posted by: Purp[/i][/b][/u][/s] at July 30, 2013 03:52 PM (S3yfV)

200 177 RE: O'care was designed to fail You people are giving too much credit to the democrats. O'care sucks because the democrats don't know fuck-shit about how economics works. Its not a grand conspiracy to get the plan they really want. They just didn't know what the fuck they are doing. When trying to understand the democrat's crazy decisions, always pick stupidity over conspiracy. Posted by: Serious Cat at July 30, 2013 08:46 PM (UOjzE) Sorry, but you are dead wrong. Dangerously wrong. This has nothing to do with economics. It has everything to do with power.

Posted by: rickl at July 30, 2013 03:53 PM (sdi6R)

201 200 RickL,

now wait a sec you mean it is not just luck that our eleventy D chess has been smashed by people playing a game of room 101...?

Posted by: sven10077 at July 30, 2013 03:53 PM (LRFds)

202 The policy wonk that architected it essentially confessed that it was designed to fail as a precursor to single payer.>>

And the only hope we have is that the incompetents that designed it were to stupid to put time release measures in it. Well they put a couple in for elections but not enough since Obama has to ignore the law for 2014.

Posted by: McGregor at July 30, 2013 03:54 PM (qo244)

203 Hollowpoint is hereby bequeathed tonight's edition of the Thomas Hutchinson Award. Congratulations, well-deserved.

Posted by: T. at July 30, 2013 03:55 PM (7BwYs)

204 >Counterpoint - Lenin, Mao, Castro, et al didn't know fuck-shit about economics and their shit lasted decades because they know how to manipulate humans.


counter-counter-point

0bama has only 1200- some days left-


Posted by: Jones in CO at July 30, 2013 03:55 PM (8sCoq)

205 181 Once you recognize that obvious fact you may come back to the adult table. And do .. what? Posted by: toby928© at July 30, 2013 08:48 PM (QupBk) ---- Finish your damn shit sandwich

Posted by: Dave S. at July 30, 2013 03:55 PM (UvR6d)

206 You people are giving too much credit to the democrats. Posted by: Serious Cat at July 30, 2013 08:46 PM (UOjzE) You're living in a world isolated from what these people have actually been saying, THEY ADMITTED IT, from Obama's health czar and other advisors to politicians like Frank and others, SAID AS MUCH. Why the FUCK do people watch other people ADMIT THEIR PLANS and then say, "no, that couldn't possibly be true?" Seriously, why does this happen?

Posted by: Merovign, Dark Lord of the Sith [/i] [/b] [/s] [/u] at July 30, 2013 03:55 PM (qyfb5)

207 Damn man, we couldn't even end the Department of Education (which educates nobody), the Department of Commerce (who's sole job is to impede commerce), etc. at any time since 1995. You think, even with an R CONgress and RiNO Prezzy Chris Krispecreme that ACA is being repealed? Of course. There is no stopping Obamacare, none, never. The only thing that impedes it is the monstrosity of the thing itself. It's so predisposed to failure it will continue life as a blind, raging wounded beast, tended by nameless and unelected bureaucrats who will guard its life with passion, as it provides their paychecks and power. Like every other federal abomination it will quickly become free from any restraint by the citizens. Look at the TSA. Almost no one thinks the perverts and goons manning the airport with their security theater/grope schtick do anything reasonable or useful, yet the party in power is unable to reform it. It's their own Democrat voters who put up with just as much abuse as the rest of us. And nothing changes.

Posted by: George Orwell, the least interesting commenter in the world at July 30, 2013 03:56 PM (mukPq)

208 I waver between eye clawing despair that the goddamn GOP cannot even get up off the mat after every god-given scandal after scandal, opportunities to wrap every goddamn thing wrong with the economy, schools, unions, killing the middle class around the left's neck, and scream to voters that if you voted for them, you voted for THIS....and just wishing for the Obama trainwreck to just get here already so the screaming of the public won't be drowned out by the howler monkey media and the politicians running in 14 and 16 will sprout some serious balls. I really, really worry what will happen (has happened) without a vocal opposition party that is so afraid of the media, its sworn enemy. These crooks and idiots are running the country right off a cliff and I cannot believe most americans are happy about it, but when I watch TV...God, it is so depressing. And Chris Chistie, what a loathsome ass you turned out to be.

Posted by: goldiocks at July 30, 2013 03:56 PM (1kxWc)

209 I am sick and tired of all the bullshit.
Shut it down.
No more compromising, I've done it enough and now my butthole is sore from the reaming I've been getting from our GOP betters.

Fuck it.  Go full on Cruz and let the chickens buttholes fall where they may.

Sincerely and Pissed Off,
MrsPaulsAssaultFishsticks

Posted by: mpfs, @mpfs79 at July 30, 2013 03:56 PM (65dQq)

210

That gets changed in an obscure last minute one sentence amendment attached to a Defense spending bill.


Or a farm bill, or healthcare for women bill, or for a (fill in this blank) for the children bill, or Trayvon's bill. It will be fixed, stealthily, and our Republican betters will go along with it.

Posted by: Sticky Wicket at July 30, 2013 03:56 PM (qoQi/)

211 http://tinyurl.com/yjkv4kp

Ed Schitz on MSLSD admitted it....


Posted by: sven10077 at July 30, 2013 03:57 PM (LRFds)

212 Yeah look not to doubt the eleventy D chess ability of the McCain Gang or even you Hollowpoint no offense...

but when a furry hunter like Ace, and a retarded viking like me figured out in 2008 that Ogabecare was purpose built to fail to get singlepayer and we look more right than those who think its failure hurts the donks...


Of course single payer is their eventual goal.  They've spent decades on the effort.

Doesn't change a thing.  Tilting at windmills doesn't win you the war.

Posted by: Hollowpoint at July 30, 2013 03:57 PM (X9Mnx)

213 Hollowpoint is hereby bequeathed tonight's edition of the Thomas Hutchinson Award. Congratulations, well-deserved. I'm pretty sure I just got Dennis Miller'd .

Posted by: Bill D. Cat at July 30, 2013 03:57 PM (0iJzo)

214 "....lose our one source of power to stop Obama ...." Yeah, golly we wouldn't want to do that, after all, look at how well it's working for us now. Un-*$#&%^-ing-believable hogwash ! A radical approach is the only chance we have of pulling ourselves out of the fire, assuming that's still even possible.

Posted by: sneaky little five-eyes at July 30, 2013 03:57 PM (SwHqo)

215 >>> Once you recognize that obvious fact you may come back to the adult table. Aren't you a magnanimous little weasel? You are completely correct. Attempting nothing will accomplish nothing. Having declared yourself to be the smartest adult in the room, tell us: how do we fix this?

Posted by: fluffy at July 30, 2013 03:57 PM (czQU/)

216 His plan is to reduce the country to a one-party state. This.

Posted by: George Orwell, the least interesting commenter in the world at July 30, 2013 03:58 PM (mukPq)

217 206 Mero,

B/C the GOP cavedivers are the ONLY SANE MEN IN THE ROOM!

says a peanut butter covered John McCain with Lindsay Graham tossing chicken feathers at him yelling "GAMECOCKS 4 EVAH BABY!"

yeah sane...."like that"

Posted by: sven10077 at July 30, 2013 03:59 PM (LRFds)

218 What I wouldn't give for a Sen. Blutarsky right now.

Posted by: mpfs, @mpfs79 at July 30, 2013 03:59 PM (65dQq)

219 Damn man, we couldn't even end the Department of Education (which educates nobody), the Department of Commerce (who's sole job is to impede commerce), etc. at any time since 1995. You think, even with an R CONgress and RiNO Prezzy Chris Krispecreme that ACA is being repealed? Seriously?

Posted by: DocJ at July 30, 2013 08:45 PM (du8Bm)

Well.. do you doubt that in the even the GOP takes over the Senate next year that in 2015 the first thing Majority Leader McConnell will do is bring a vote for full repeal?  Of course he will.  Now, it may not survive a Democrat filibuster, and Obama is certain to veto it... but its a start.  One day, that law is toast.  My worry is that the replacement won't be a market-oriented approach... but a mushy-middle that tries to appease the  "popular" stuff in ACA (like per-conditions nonsense).

Maybe I'm more optimistic than most around here because I'm still relatively young (I'm 9 years old). You old people need to trust in the new generation of morons to make shit happen.

Posted by: Serious Cat at July 30, 2013 04:01 PM (UOjzE)

220 The "adult table" is apparently the Children's Table off in the side room the Dems set up for the Republicans to keep them out of the way. Adults are apparently people who look at an oncoming disaster and say "well, we probably can't do anything about that, so let's not make a fuss. We'll just look silly."

Posted by: Merovign, Dark Lord of the Sith [/i] [/b] [/s] [/u] at July 30, 2013 04:01 PM (qyfb5)

221 206 Why the FUCK do people watch other people ADMIT THEIR PLANS and then say, "no, that couldn't possibly be true?" Seriously, why does this happen? Posted by: Merovign, Dark Lord of the Sith at July 30, 2013 08:55 PM (qyfb5) It is a puzzler, isn't it? See Hitler > Mein Kampf OK, I'm invoking Godwin's Law. Sue me.

Posted by: rickl at July 30, 2013 04:02 PM (sdi6R)

222

counter-counter-point

 

0bama has only 1200- some days left-

 

Posted by: Jones in CO at July 30, 2013 08:55 PM (8sCoq)

 

You believe what you want to believe.  I'm going NOWHERE!

Posted by: Teh SCOAMT at July 30, 2013 04:02 PM (o44nj)

223 says a peanut butter covered John McCain with Lindsay Graham tossing chicken feathers at him yelling "GAMECOCKS 4 EVAH BABY!" yeah sane...."like that" Posted by: sven10077 at July 30, 2013 08:59 PM (LRFds) As the Inimitable EOJ would say; CHOCKIT ICE KWEEM!!

Posted by: Merovign, Dark Lord of the Sith [/i] [/b] [/s] [/u] at July 30, 2013 04:03 PM (qyfb5)

224 Oh and here in Boston, two women were attacked-stabbed, I think, and another 24 year old girl was beaten, abducted and murdered last week on the same night/early morning by a 'person of interest' who may be a white hispanics who lived in public housing, with 14 juvenile arrests and 34 adult arrests on various serious crimes, was caught by police selling his EBT card last year and his wallet was found in the hands of another female mugging victim last year and the police never followed up. The murdered girl was abducted at 6 am and driven around in broad daylight to several ATMs before he killed her. So this asshole and the Boston bombing family were living on my tax money forever...... And Mayor Menino is handing out blue safety whistles for women in the neighborhood.

Posted by: goldiocks at July 30, 2013 04:03 PM (1kxWc)

225 Speaking of Thomas Hutchnson, I've been bustin' into a Sam Adams as a reward for surviving mortal combat with complex analysis residuals and partition functions, and you can taste the quality. Night and day difference. Kinda makes me hope I stay in the same union as Boston, but having a case smuggled over the border now and then would be okay to.

Posted by: T. at July 30, 2013 04:04 PM (7BwYs)

226

What I wouldn't give for a Sen. Blutarsky right now.

 

Posted by: mpfs, @mpfs79 at July 30, 2013 08:59 PM (65dQq)

 

Toga. Toga! TOGA! TOGA!

Posted by: Sen. Blutarsky at July 30, 2013 04:04 PM (o44nj)

227 Those of you who believe this to have a non-zero chance of stopping Obamacare to any significant degree as opposed to a political stunt- convince me.

Game this out- what the GOP should do, how the Dems would respond, and the political impact.

And no, FIGHT FIGHT FIGHT isn't an explanation.

Give me one plausible scenario where the GOP could repeal or significantly weaken Obamacare.  With all the anger directed towards the GOP for failing to somehow stop Obamacare, tell 'em how it's done.  No 20 sided dice allowed though.

And for those of you confused about the word, "Plausible" does not mean "The Magical Fantasy That Lives In My Head"

Posted by: Hollowpoint at July 30, 2013 04:04 PM (X9Mnx)

228 OK, I'm invoking Godwin's Law. Sue me. Posted by: rickl at July 30, 2013 09:02 PM (sdi6R) Technically I think you're *triggering* rather than invoking, but just as well.

Posted by: Merovign, Dark Lord of the Sith [/i] [/b] [/s] [/u] at July 30, 2013 04:05 PM (qyfb5)

229 >>> Those of you who believe this to have a non-zero chance of stopping Obamacare to any significant degree as opposed to a political stunt- convince me. No, no. You're not listening. Explain what will work. I will read it.

Posted by: fluffy at July 30, 2013 04:07 PM (czQU/)

230 And for those of you confused about the word, "Plausible" does not mean "The Magical Fantasy That Lives In My Head" Posted by: Hollowpoint at July 30, 2013 09:04 PM (X9Mnx) The problem is that the world we observe, the one of actual consequences, doesn't match the magical fantasy that lives in *your* head. So communication becomes impossible, especially since you open with "you stupid fucking rubes" so no one has an incentive to meet your petulant demands. Seriously, you want a discussion, you don;t open by calling people knee-jerk reactionaries who only think with emotional outrage centers. You walked in LOOKING FOR A FIGHT and now you claim you want a discussion? BULLSHIT.

Posted by: Merovign, Dark Lord of the Sith [/i] [/b] [/s] [/u] at July 30, 2013 04:08 PM (qyfb5)

231 You guys are fuckin' high-larious! I gotta big, fat dick you can suck.

Posted by: Chris Christie, the Wave of the Future at July 30, 2013 04:08 PM (JQuNB)

232 227 Never mind manuevers.

Posted by: T. at July 30, 2013 04:09 PM (7BwYs)

233 You haven't seen the 2014 tax forms yet, have you? There will be a line for those of us who pay estimated quarterly taxes (even to the point of having to write two checks on April 15) to add the penalty to the bottom line.

Posted by: steveegg at July 30, 2013 08:52 PM (o44nj)

I thought they haven't been released yet?  Regardless, I'm not paying that portion... and if I re-up my health insurance next year, I'm not listing it on my tax forms.

Posted by: Serious Cat at July 30, 2013 04:09 PM (UOjzE)

234

Explain what will work. I will read it.

 

Posted by: fluffy at July 30, 2013 09:07 PM (czQU/)

 

Allow me to take words out of Bobby Knight's mouth:

 

"Lean back and enjoy it, just like you did from 2003-2006."

Posted by: steveegg at July 30, 2013 04:09 PM (o44nj)

235
Give me one plausible scenario where the GOP could repeal or significantly weaken Obamacare. With all the anger directed towards the GOP for failing to somehow stop Obamacare, tell 'em how it's done. No 20 sided dice allowed though.

I can't. But I'm not going to go along to get along as you seem to advocate. I'll make my stand.

I might also point out that you brought this shit up, and the ball's in your court. How do you propose to those of us at the non adult tables that you're right? Make your argument.

Posted by: Sticky Wicket at July 30, 2013 04:09 PM (qoQi/)

236 And Mayor Menino is handing out blue safety whistles for women in the neighborhood. ---------- Good idea Menino! Blow baby blow!

Posted by: Filthy Filner at July 30, 2013 04:10 PM (Aif/5)

237 Hollopoint is a troll He has no idea what will work to defeat Democrats Even if he did he would not tell us His job is to prevent folks from stepping outside the boundaries set by the GOP and the Democrats

Posted by: eman at July 30, 2013 04:12 PM (CE55J)

238

Posted by: eman at July 30, 2013 09:12 PM (CE55J)

 

You misspelled "Emptyhead"

Posted by: steveegg at July 30, 2013 04:12 PM (o44nj)

239 I think there's something to be said that America experiencing ObamaCare might be what tilts this country back to the Right.

Depends on how you want to pursue public policy goals, but if ObamaCare had immediately go into place, there would be a different President in the White House right now.

Posted by: Jeepers at July 30, 2013 04:12 PM (XDRsa)

240 #227   I will take you up on the challenge.

The first thing you do is run ads targeted to all of the people who are HURT by Obamacare:  young people who are being forced to buy insurance they don't need, people whose premiums with their companies have skyrocketed, people who have been forced into part-time work.  You have to get some public backing.

Then you bring a bill which allows insurance to cross state lines.  Who could argue with that,  as it would make Obamacare cheaper,  right?  The democrats would oppose it,  because they would not like anything which kept them from control.

Then you pass a bill allowing people to buy ADDITIONAL insurance over and beyond whatever Obamacare covers,  sort of like Medicare supplements.  The dems will fight on this as well,  because what they want is control and single payer.

By this time you should be able to get enough public outrage that the dems will be forced to do some changes or be defeated at the polls.  

Posted by: Miss Marple at July 30, 2013 04:13 PM (GoIUi)

241 Of course, I wouldn't try "going straight at them" with the cockleshells we have in D.C. The idea is to keep trading broadsides with the expectation of coming out agead. I could *entirely* understand how this would be beyond the GOP.

Posted by: T. at July 30, 2013 04:13 PM (7BwYs)

242

Regardless, I'm not paying that portion... and if I re-up my health insurance next year, I'm not listing it on my tax forms.

 

Posted by: Serious Cat at July 30, 2013 09:09 PM (UOjzE)

 

Roomies in prison?

Posted by: steveegg at July 30, 2013 04:13 PM (o44nj)

243 Having declared yourself to be the smartest adult in the room, tell us: how do we fix this?

It's too late for a true "fix".  DOOM is coming, and there's no stopping it.

But to answer your question, it's pretty fucking simple.  No seven dimensional chess necessary.  Hell, not even a triple digit IQ.

1.  Rally public support against Obamacare.
2.  Do what is necessary to keep the House and gain a Senate (60 votes preferably) majority.  Yes, that will mean putting up with a few RINOish types in bluish states and districts.
3.  Help get a Republican president elected in 2016.
4.  Repeal / revise / fix.

If those steps are objectionable to you, don't look anywhere but the mirror when you think about the impact of Obamacare.

Posted by: Hollowpoint at July 30, 2013 04:13 PM (X9Mnx)

244 >>> Hollopoint is a troll No. Hollowpoint is the smartest adult in the room. He is going to tell is what will work. He will give specific ideas and they will be brilliant. The floor is yours, Hollowpoint.

Posted by: fluffy at July 30, 2013 04:14 PM (czQU/)

245

Posted by: Hollowpoint at July 30, 2013 09:13 PM (X9Mnx)

 

That worked out so fucking well for small-government types between 2003 and 2006, when we had everything except 60 in the Senate.  Instead, we got taxpayer-subsidized medications.

Posted by: steveegg at July 30, 2013 04:15 PM (o44nj)

246 The main problem is that the legacy J-school-based media is an instrument of Progressivism. This is not too surprising, simce the whole idea of J-school was developed, and J-schools organized and operated, for the express purpose of advancing Progressivism, or Socialism, as it was openly called at the time. That media organization's purpose and function is to synthesize a self-contained, artificial, self-referential false reality, in which the Progressive agenda is the only normal, decent and socially acceptable course of action. It doesn't merely argue the agenda. It rigs the terms and premises and unstated assumptions of the "discussion, so as to lead inevitably to its desired pre-ordained results. The overall effect of their multi-generational, daily activity is a kind of mass hypnosis, in which the core ethics of millions of people are re-written, the way a virus rewrites a cell's DNA. The secondary problem is that the politicians who purportedly represent the non-Progressive segment of US society live entirely within this false reality, accept its premises and then wonder why they're not getting a fair shake from it.

Posted by: Phinn at July 30, 2013 04:15 PM (oFH2D)

247 You seriously missed the Czar talk about this being a path to single-payer? Totally flew by you? Barney Frank as much as admitted it. Single payer or a strong public option were his words I believe.

Posted by: MegaBreasts McCain at July 30, 2013 04:15 PM (dvRYt)

248 I think I had a good plan.  At least I gave a strategy,  rather than just saying "rally public opinion."

So I figure that I am smarter than Hollowpoint.

Posted by: Miss Marple at July 30, 2013 04:16 PM (GoIUi)

249 I think there's something to be said that America experiencing ObamaCare might be what tilts this country back to the Right.

Depends on how you want to pursue public policy goals, but if ObamaCare had immediately go into place, there would be a different President in the White House right now.

Posted by: Jeepers at July 30, 2013 09:12 PM (XDRsa)

This!

Posted by: Serious Cat at July 30, 2013 04:16 PM (UOjzE)

250 A third party would lose a lot more than the GOP does and the Democrats would increase their power, but the battleground would shift There would be a true alternative, a true opposition It would grow and win You don't have to game out every step You have to make a new move You have to try

Posted by: eman at July 30, 2013 04:16 PM (CE55J)

251 Oh, and partial-privatization of SocSecurity didn't even make it to the floor of the House.  How the fuck do you think repeal of PlaceboCare will do any better?

Posted by: steveegg at July 30, 2013 04:16 PM (o44nj)

252 So, now that I've successfully survived another round of knowledge, had planned on finishing "Empires in the Balance", but it's getting bogged down in troop movements on Luzon**, so I've switched to Hornfischer's "Last Stand". Because sometimes you havevto go fight with the fleet you have. **Really enjoyable on the pre-war stuff.

Posted by: T. at July 30, 2013 04:16 PM (7BwYs)

253

Depends on how you want to pursue public policy goals, but if ObamaCare had immediately go into place, there would be a different President in the White House right now.

 

Posted by: Jeepers at July 30, 2013 09:12 PM (XDRsa)

 

Yeah - we'd have the godfather of PlaceboCare cementing it in place.

Posted by: steveegg at July 30, 2013 04:18 PM (o44nj)

254 @ 219 Well.. do you doubt that in the even the GOP takes over the Senate next year that in 2015 the first thing Majority Leader McConnell will do is bring a vote for full repeal?

Uh, yes. I doubt precisely that. If that wasn't clear.

Posted by: DocJ at July 30, 2013 04:19 PM (du8Bm)

255 Ha! Hollowpoint wants to keep whacking the grizzly bear with a toy hammer It does not work And if he thinks doom is inevitable why is he so determined to take it slow and keep using the trusty GOP?

Posted by: eman at July 30, 2013 04:20 PM (CE55J)

256 254 DocJ,

repeal it?

Nah we'll "fix it"...

"repeal and replace"...how's about the camel of govt get its fucking nose out of the tent?

Posted by: sven10077 at July 30, 2013 04:21 PM (LRFds)

257 By this time you should be able to get enough public outrage that the dems will be forced to do some changes or be defeated at the polls.

Good points all, but even as a long term strategy it still requires more votes in Congress and a GOP President

It's going to be awhile before "sticker shock" really hits the masses.  Until then the LIV populace (i.e. The Average Voter) isn't going to put major pressure on the Dems.

Short term, there's nothing decisive we (or the GOP) can do.

Posted by: Hollowpoint at July 30, 2013 04:21 PM (X9Mnx)

258 >>> So I figure that I am smarter than Hollowpoint. No, no, no! Not possible. Back to the children's table you go.

Posted by: fluffy at July 30, 2013 04:21 PM (czQU/)

259 @256 The part of this "discussion" that gets me the most frustrated is that people don't seem to recall that 1/03 though 1/07 actually happened. Or that it happened but that a GOP CONgress with Pres Fatboy come 1/17 will be, in any measurable way, better.

Posted by: DocJ at July 30, 2013 04:26 PM (du8Bm)

260 As to my sober view on the situation--defund it, let the President veto, after that move on. If any disruption results, it's the President's faut. Congress has the moral and ethical high ground on spending matters--or at least anybody velueving in a Republic should so feel, as a general matter of principle. As far as public opinion--one day the only public opinion that is truly going to matter is the kind that comes in .223, wielded by one side or the other, so it really doesn't matter. If Congress thinks the thing should be defunded, defund it. If the President vetoes, he vetoes.

Posted by: T. at July 30, 2013 04:26 PM (7BwYs)

261 Posted by: eman at July 30, 2013 09:20 PM (CE55J)

Nice to see you posting with all the usual thought, insight and consideration we've all come to expect from your comments. 

By which I mean "none".  In case you didn't catch that, being a dummy and all.

Someday, if you work real hard at it, your comments might come close to displaying the intellectual scribblings of Mehgan McCain.  Maybe.  Probably not.

Posted by: Hollowpoint at July 30, 2013 04:27 PM (X9Mnx)

262 Basically, I'm not a believer in the equality of the branches. Nor were the Founders (no argument to be brooked). Congress, and specifically the House, should have preeminence on spending matters. Night or day, D or R. Elsewhise, it is just an elective monarchy.

Posted by: T. at July 30, 2013 04:31 PM (7BwYs)

263 261 Insult me all day long if you like, troll What you say is not important

Posted by: eman at July 30, 2013 04:33 PM (CE55J)

264 That worked out so fucking well for small-government types between 2003 and 2006, when we had everything except 60 in the Senate. Instead, we got taxpayer-subsidized medications.

What small-government types?

Between "Compassionate Conservative" Bush and The K Street Project, the few that existed were trampled by the feeding frenzy at the pig trough.  The end result was that they (deservedly) got their asses kicked in 2006.  Don't think they don't remember.

Attitudes have changed, and the shit is approaching the fan at an accelerated rate.  You want to stop Obamacare?  There's only one weapon we have to fight that battle, and unfortunately is the Republican Party.

For all their faults, they're the army we have.  Want them to improve?  Great, help do that.  Just don't demand the impossible and throw a tantrum when they fail to deliver it.

Posted by: Hollowpoint at July 30, 2013 04:36 PM (X9Mnx)

265 263 Eman,

Futile idiocy never wins power...

ask Nanny Botox about 2006 and all that

Posted by: sven10077 at July 30, 2013 04:36 PM (LRFds)

266 You people realize that there is a good chance the exchanges won't even be up in running anyways?  You can't have an exchange if their IT guys still need another 9+ months to get the damn thing running.

I say a better strategy is to keep hiring away ACA's lead database designer..

Posted by: Serious Cat at July 30, 2013 04:41 PM (UOjzE)

267

Between "Compassionate Conservative" Bush and The K Street Project, the few that existed were trampled by the feeding frenzy at the pig trough. The end result was that they (deservedly) got their asses kicked in 2006. Don't think they don't remember.

 

Attitudes have changed, and the shit is approaching the fan at an accelerated rate. You want to stop Obamacare? There's only one weapon we have to fight that battle, and unfortunately is the Republican Party.

 

For all their faults, they're the army we have. Want them to improve? Great, help do that. Just don't demand the impossible and throw a tantrum when they fail to deliver it.

 

Posted by: Hollowpoint at July 30, 2013 09:36 PM (X9Mnx)

 

All well and good, but that army is still being led by the K Street Crowd (or did you forget the purge of those who want to actually cut spending from the House Budget Committee?).

 

Further, every discretionary dollar Obama and Reid wanted for PlaceboCare thus far has been approved.  This army's leadership has proven beyond a shadow of a doubt they don't want to fight.

Posted by: steveegg at July 30, 2013 04:58 PM (o44nj)

268 All well and good, but that army is still being led by the K Street Crowd (or did you forget the purge of those who want to actually cut spending from the House Budget Committee?).

Except that's not really what happened.  It was inaccurately reported as such on some conservative websites, but if you take a close look at who was purged, it wasn't for being too fiscally conservative.

Most of the funding for Obamacare comes from new entitlement spending.  Without the votes, to weaken / repeal Obamacare, the House GOP can't touch it.

Posted by: Hollowpoint at July 30, 2013 05:04 PM (X9Mnx)

269 239 I think there's something to be said that America experiencing ObamaCare might be what tilts this country back to the Right. Posted by: Jeepers at July 30, 2013 09:12 PM (XDRsa) Sorry, but that's wishful thinking. Once government healthcare is implemented, it's forever. England has had government healthcare since the 1940s, and they've moved steadily to the Left since then.

Posted by: rickl at July 30, 2013 05:09 PM (sdi6R)

270 Addendum to my #269: Generations of English people literally can't conceive of a healthcare system that isn't controlled by the government, because that's all they've ever known.

Posted by: rickl at July 30, 2013 05:13 PM (sdi6R)

271 Exactly.  It is now or never and the spishy Republicans and establishment pundits like Jen Rubin be damned.  I would rather face the voters saying we have taken the last chance to stop ObamaCare and the Democrats refuse to budge.  So, voters, pick which one you want: ObamaCare or not.

Posted by: Rick Caird at July 30, 2013 05:20 PM (oD3Gm)

272 The GOP establishment lives in constant fear of a return of the 1995-1996 "government shutdown."

The reality is that the GOP only lost 2 House seats and gained 2 Senate seats in 1996.  A NET win, given the bias towards Senate seats.

But they weren't invited to any of the good DC cocktail parties after that.  So I guess we understand their priorities: Conservative base=BAD; Liberal pussy=GOOD.

Posted by: Vercingetorix at July 30, 2013 05:28 PM (vwYj4)

273 Defunding of ACA != Repeal.


Its more important to repeal the law, even with a veto, than win a temporary stay.  With Barack being forced to veto a repeal in 2015, it sets up the stakes clearly for independant voters going into the 2016 election.

Posted by: Serious Cat at July 30, 2013 05:30 PM (UOjzE)

274

For all their faults, they're the army we have. Want them to improve? Great, help do that. Just don't demand the impossible and throw a tantrum when they fail to deliver it.

Posted by: Hollowpoint at July 30, 2013 09:36 PM (X9Mnx)

 

then the fight is already over, thanks tough guy

Posted by: Shoey at July 30, 2013 05:46 PM (m6OUa)

275 Screw the Accommodationist Party and go with the Constitutional Hawks. Our Country was founded on The Constitution, our gift from our Founding Fathers. We should honor them, not forget them. They fought with their lives, not on paper, for this once great Country. We can rise again but we have to go with the Constitutional Hawks. I love Ted Cruz! He doesn’t stand down. He has balls, and he is articulate. Perry and Cruz 2016, but I think the VP can’t be from the same state. I know that is why Dick Cheney moved back to Wyoming to be GWB’s VP. I used to have pocket Constitution in magazine rack in here. I relocated magazine rack. I’m going to bring it back where it belongs. Let’s send one to each of the accommodationists in the House and Senate. Didn’t Boehner piss them off by reading in in early 2011 when the newly elected republican majority was sworn in? How quickly that SOB swatted the Tea Party members out of leadership posts because they wouldn’t fall into the line he wanted them to. Boehner has to go with McConnell, neither has done anything for us. Go read Madison Project’s endorsement of Matt Bevin against Mitch, for how bad Mitch has been behind the scene, of course.

Posted by: CarolT at July 30, 2013 06:15 PM (z4WKX)

276 Amnesty was the hill.  Reps are not a lesser of two evils, they are the same.  They just spell 'statist' differently.  To h3ll with them.

Posted by: rabidfox at July 30, 2013 06:18 PM (Gejy0)

277 "If you honestly believe there's any chance of an Obamacare repeal before 2016, I recommend you find the nearest Jr High civics textbook and review how our system of government works." That's a joke coming from you. "Give me one plausible scenario where the GOP could repeal or significantly weaken Obamacare." 1. Deny funding for office space, phone lines, email accounts, computers, furniture, travel, hiring, firing, benefits management, payroll, pensions, or training for new staff, or the transfer of existing personnel, to coordinate the launch of state exchanges, train personnel to coordinate the launch of state exchanges, answer queries from state officials as to the creation of state exchanges, study the rate of implementation of state exchanges, or answer congressional inquiries concerning the implementation of state exchanges. Maybe you think all the funding is there already, but I very much doubt they were that thorough when they rammed it through after midnight. 2. Refuse to vote for such funding ever. 3. Impeach every official who commits the felony of conversion of federal property - look it up, its one charge against Edward Snowden - by using federal property for those purposes. I doubt they will CHOOSE to do that, instead CHOOSING to cave and vote for the funding-- which would be their CHOICE to lose, again. There is nothing impossible about refusing to vote for the funding. The GOP is not "the only army we have". We are the army. Maybe you hadn't noticed by you are in the presence of the most successful rebellion against federal authority by 20 million wetbacks. We do not need the political process to destroy socialism. 9 out of 10 of us can even comply with it, and it will collapse under the weight of enforcement.

Posted by: Chris_Balsz at July 30, 2013 07:08 PM (9KRIj)

278 I do not understand the difficulty of this.  You pass a continuing resolution without Obamacare funding and then you go home.  It has a rider removing any automatic spending (which shouldn't even be necessary since one Congress cannot bind another --- at least back when we had a Constitution). 

Then either the Dems in the Senate pass it on their side or they shut the government down.  It is their call.  The Pubbies can honestly say they funded everything but Obamacare when the press complains about how hard the shutdown would be on call girls receiving disability payments for their overbites or whoever else they trot out.  If they really wanted to put the pressure on they could pass portions of the budget every week or every month so the Senate has to decide over and over again not to fund their most beloved programs.  We should have been rolling these out for months now to get them used to it.  It would have been worth it to even increase the spending on these other programs to make it easier for them to swallow.  You think they wouldn't have passed all of these things with nice increases only to realize too late that nothing is coming for Obamacare?  The Republicans would have taken flack right up till the moment the trap was sprung... but then... sweet, sweet victory.

Most people hate this monstrosity and even Dems are starting to look for a way out.  This gives them a way to save face.  You ALWAYS have to give stupid people a way to back down so they remain the alpha moron in the eyes of the idiots who elected them.   "We had to concede on this or else the government would shut down."  Then they can fund raise off the issue and tweet pictures of their dicks till their hearts are content.

I don't think the Republicans understand that either they win on this issue or they cease to exist because they will serve no useful function.  I know I was assuming that the whole thing would be repealed the instant the Republicans got the upper hand.  But now the noises I am hearing are that it will be too difficult even then. 

So why would I go vote for this bunch? 

They refuse to offer me my liberty back and I can't be bought.  There is no deal to be made.

Posted by: Thatch at July 30, 2013 07:20 PM (qYvEa)

279 Called my congressfeeder today (freshman NC rep so-called) and spoke to apparent 12 year old.  *note to self.  lock and load*  asked her about O-care.  She - poor thing - hadn't given it any thought.

Move to my senatefeeder.  Rec'd e-gop talking points.  Sooooo worried about gov shutdown and gov workers furloughed.  Sitrep:  Clear to revolt when ready.

Posted by: NCwoof at July 30, 2013 08:11 PM (aUQgu)

280 The Rubicon was crossed over 20 years ago.  This whole discussion is pointless. 

Posted by: Purp[/i][/b][/u][/s] at July 30, 2013 08:47 PM (S3yfV)

281 It's not true we lose by force the house on a shutdown IF we explain to the American people we are th good guys, only defunding the ACA, not the rest of the gov.

The method would force the DEMS to shut down the gov in response, and that could WIN for us politically. We have no choice regardless.

This is the hill to die on.

Countries that seal national health care configuring are not able to be conservative anymore, that's just a fact.

Since most people hate Obamacare, we have one chance before the exchanges kick in and dependency makes it impossible to beat to defund. And to challenge Obama's selective tinkering with the law and mandates as beng unconstitutional. We want to make it fall on it's own weight as a back up plan...

Posted by: Mehnow at July 30, 2013 09:16 PM (Ua1XQ)

282 "124 -- It's not about accomodation. It's about acknowledging a very, very obvious reality."

How about we acknowledge the obvious reality that once ObamaCare is implemented, there will be no need for a GOP? At that point, the present situation -- two political gangs warring over who gets the most loot -- becomes an irreversible fact.


Posted by: Salt Lick at July 31, 2013 12:30 AM (1Y3FE)

283 Today we are all Vikings. I'd rather go out with a sword in my hand, on my feet, swinging than cowed, crying, and kneeling.

btw I prefer an axe.

2nd btw: Always be sure to list cornyn with mcshamnasty, gramNESTLE, ryanNOOO, and all the other RINOS.



Posted by: Blacksmith8 at July 31, 2013 01:57 AM (3zW8P)

284

"Oh, and partial-privatization of SocSecurity didn't even make it to the floor of the House. How the fuck do you think repeal of PlaceboCare will do any better?"

 

Apples and oranges.   SS has been entrenched for decades, is very popular, and doesn't interfere with people's daily life.    Obamacare was recently enacted, is hugely UNpopular, and (as people are already figuring out) will radically affect nearly everyone's health and life on a constant basis.

Posted by: JPS at July 31, 2013 03:29 AM (wS6Sf)

285 Based on the attack on Paul, the establishment has already penciled in Angry Birds Piggie and his Constitutionalist sidekick and nominal Latino, Ted Cruz for the ticket. You can book it. And we'll all fawn and march obediently to the polls like none of this ever happened. Because the thought of Cruz one fat choked heartbeat away will be too enticing to resist.

Posted by: PC at July 31, 2013 04:45 AM (oJmIY)

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